4 ms·

I really agree on this. They should focus on a browser that respects privacy and email that respects privacy (perhaps by resuming Thunderbird development). On

by nextos 11y ago

I really agree on this. They should focus on a browser that respects privacy and email that respects privacy (perhaps by resuming Thunderbird development). On top of that, I'd argue IM + video/audio chat that respects privacy is something that desperately needs better solutions. I'd push software forward, and then innovate on protocols. Peer to peer might be the only way to achieve true privacy.

scrollaway 11y ago
They're trying something with Firefox Hello. Unfortunately, short of Google open sourcing Hangouts and making it a truly open protocol, I don't see a change happening in the IM space any time soon =/
- ianlevesque 11y ago
  I think that's a little overly pessimistic. Look how quickly Slack went from non-existent to huge in the messaging space.
  - loudmax 11y ago
    Isn't Slack just another proprietary platform? They may leverage some open protocols, but I don't see how Slack decentralizes messaging. Am I missing something?
    - ianlevesque 11y ago
      It doesn't, the point is there's still room for this space to be disrupted.
lewisl9029 11y ago
Absolutely. Although the market for centralized secure messaging is currently being served adequately by the likes of Signal and Telegram, centralized messaging platforms inevitably leak metadata. I don't want to belittle the work done by teams that have already started work on distributed messaging platforms like Tox and Matrix (and my own proof-of-concept, Toc [1]), but Mozilla is in a much better position to tackle the problem of decentralized, private messaging that also has great UX, and not just in terms of sheer resources: 1) They have (or at least had) a decentralized identity management platform in Persona. 2) They have a decentralized, zero-knowledge data sync platform in Firefox Sync. 3) They have a lot of influence in the web standards community that they can leverage to push a new federated messaging protocol to succeed XMPP. This is the kind of work that I think Mozilla should be doing, because they can do it better than anyone else who's willing (i.e. not for-profit corporations, because they have very little to gain by building decentralized apps and federated protocols that have no lock-in whatsoever). [1] http://toc.im/ http://toc.im/
- conradev 11y ago
  I would also include Ricochet[1] in the list of decentralized messaging tools, which is centered around Tor hidden services. [1] https://ricochet.im https://ricochet.im
- mook 11y ago
  Also, Mozilla already had some IM support (XMPP, twitter, and yahoo, I think) in Thunderbird / Instantbird. IRC too, but that's a different sort of messaging.
ori_b 11y ago
> I really agree on this. They should focus on a browser that respects privacy and email that respects privacy I'd love to see it happen, but who would the money come from?
gutnor 11y ago
Imagine a browser that has a privacy mode using tor ? Privacy in browser nowadays is privacy from your wife or kids, not privacy from anything on the server side. Seeing how hostile most of the western governments are toward privacy on the internet, that's probably not the best long term strategy for Mozilla though. They could quickly find themselves labelled terrorist organisation ( by mistake ) and have their account frozen ( by mistake ) for a long period of time ( due process, can't rush those stuff )
- niutech 11y ago
  Nonsense. Tor Browser is actually based on Mozilla Firefox and it has been alive for long. Nobody would be so mad to call the web browser vendor a terrorist organization.
  - kagamine 11y ago
    Clearly you don't follow the UK news, the UK govt. have been toying with banning Tor (encryption in general) for a couple of years. Here is a recent article about it http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/mar/11/tor-should-not-be-banned-in-britain http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/mar/11/tor-should...
    - chris_wot 11y ago
      If they targeted Mozilla all hell would break loose. Mozilla is no Napster! They would have one heck of a fight on their hands. I don't believe they would win.

by nextos 11y ago

scrollaway 11y ago

They're trying something with Firefox Hello. Unfortunately, short of Google open sourcing Hangouts and making it a truly open protocol, I don't see a change happening in the IM space any time soon =/

ianlevesque 11y ago
I think that's a little overly pessimistic. Look how quickly Slack went from non-existent to huge in the messaging space.
- loudmax 11y ago
  Isn't Slack just another proprietary platform? They may leverage some open protocols, but I don't see how Slack decentralizes messaging. Am I missing something?
  - ianlevesque 11y ago
    It doesn't, the point is there's still room for this space to be disrupted.

lewisl9029 11y ago

Absolutely. Although the market for centralized secure messaging is currently being served adequately by the likes of Signal and Telegram, centralized messaging platforms inevitably leak metadata. I don't want to belittle the work done by teams that have already started work on distributed messaging platforms like Tox and Matrix (and my own proof-of-concept, Toc [1]), but Mozilla is in a much better position to tackle the problem of decentralized, private messaging that also has great UX, and not just in terms of sheer resources: 1) They have (or at least had) a decentralized identity management platform in Persona. 2) They have a decentralized, zero-knowledge data sync platform in Firefox Sync. 3) They have a lot of influence in the web standards community that they can leverage to push a new federated messaging protocol to succeed XMPP. This is the kind of work that I think Mozilla should be doing, because they can do it better than anyone else who's willing (i.e. not for-profit corporations, because they have very little to gain by building decentralized apps and federated protocols that have no lock-in whatsoever). [1] http://toc.im/ http://toc.im/

conradev 11y ago
I would also include Ricochet[1] in the list of decentralized messaging tools, which is centered around Tor hidden services. [1] https://ricochet.im https://ricochet.im
mook 11y ago
Also, Mozilla already had some IM support (XMPP, twitter, and yahoo, I think) in Thunderbird / Instantbird. IRC too, but that's a different sort of messaging.

ori_b 11y ago

> I really agree on this. They should focus on a browser that respects privacy and email that respects privacy I'd love to see it happen, but who would the money come from?

gutnor 11y ago

Imagine a browser that has a privacy mode using tor ? Privacy in browser nowadays is privacy from your wife or kids, not privacy from anything on the server side. Seeing how hostile most of the western governments are toward privacy on the internet, that's probably not the best long term strategy for Mozilla though. They could quickly find themselves labelled terrorist organisation ( by mistake ) and have their account frozen ( by mistake ) for a long period of time ( due process, can't rush those stuff )

niutech 11y ago
Nonsense. Tor Browser is actually based on Mozilla Firefox and it has been alive for long. Nobody would be so mad to call the web browser vendor a terrorist organization.
- kagamine 11y ago
  Clearly you don't follow the UK news, the UK govt. have been toying with banning Tor (encryption in general) for a couple of years. Here is a recent article about it http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/mar/11/tor-should-not-be-banned-in-britain http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/mar/11/tor-should...
  - chris_wot 11y ago
    If they targeted Mozilla all hell would break loose. Mozilla is no Napster! They would have one heck of a fight on their hands. I don't believe they would win.