5 ms·

It just adds to the 2.4gHz channel congestion hell. Pretty much everywhere I've lived in the past 3 years, 2.4gHz has been nearly unusable.

thescriptkiddie 11y ago
It makes things look more crowded, but unless people are actually using the Comcast WiFi it isn't actually adding to congestion. The periodic SSID beacons are an annoyance but they use negligible bandwidth. That said, don't ever use an ISP provided access point.
- pavel_lishin 11y ago
  > That said, don't ever use an ISP provided access point. Why not?
  - 15155 11y ago
    Because they're running software you do not control on what is generally sub-par hardware. It's too cheap to get good, enterprise-grade equipment for home usage that will have no problems and allow you to turn all of the knobs.
  - WorldMaker 11y ago
    In addition to the other answers many of the ISPs provide their hardware on essentially a rental model. The benefit to that is that if you complain loud enough they'll replace it on their dime: the detriment is the same as with any rental though, typically they overcharge you versus what you would pay if you bought it yourself. Your mileage will probably vary, but I've certainly saved money in the long run owning my own equipment, even paying for my own replacements versus storm damage and similar.
    - shostack 11y ago
      Another consideration is that often they will try to use the fact that you don't use their hardware as an excuse to not go further in troubleshooting since they "don't support 3rd party hardware."
      - WorldMaker 11y ago
        It's fun when you get the opposite too and they follow their support scripts regardless of your 3rd party hardware and above average knowledge of the subject: Support: On your hardware, do x. Me: Did it already. It reported "Y". Support: Please do it again, following these scripted steps [what don't match my actual hardware]... [I pretend to follow along.] Me: Done. It reported "Y". Support: Oh, well then...
- indlebe 11y ago
  >That said, don't ever use an ISP provided access point. Because the hardware is often inferior to what you can pick up for ~$200 at a tech store, not to mention the lack of control you get with an ISP AP.
  - gst 11y ago
    Regarding "inferior": It's fast enough and it doesn't crash (at least for me). That's probably "good enough" for most people to not care if there's a better solution. "lack of control": The Comcast provided hardware gives me an IP via DHCP and I'm able to disable all those useless firewall features. So which features am I missing and why should I care about them?
    - indlebe 11y ago
      The average home user, sure, the ISP AP may be fine. But for the average reader of HN I suspect it would not be. I can't use an AP that does not allow me to fine-tune QoS and just tinker in general if packets are not flowing in the way that I desire.
      - untog 11y ago
        I'd be interested to know how much the average HN user cares about this. I certainly don't. I'm not even entirely sure how fast my home internet connection is - it's certainly fast enough for me to stream Netflix etc as well as connect to a VPN for working from home. I don't really care about anything else. (not that my internet connection is always great - it isn't - but that lies with my internet provider, who I have no choice over, so...)
        jlarocco 11y ago
        I was going to say this, but you beat me to it. I think there are a lot of smart people on HN, but that doesn't mean they're all interested in all the same things. Tweaking wifi settings just seems like a waste of time to me, and boring to top it off. My interaction with my AP stopped at setting the ssid and passphrase.
legulere 11y ago
I'm sad that wifi-blocking wallpaper seems to have never taken off: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stealth_wallpaper https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stealth_wallpaper
- qb45 11y ago
  That's a cool tech. If it really provides decent attenuation of WiFi without affecting other radios I think it may still take off in the future. There will be a point when 2.4GHz WiFi doesn't work anymore at all.
  - gst 11y ago
    How do you get to this conclusion? The density is probably not going to get much higher than it is already, but the technology is going to continue to improve.
    - qb45 11y ago
      More high-def everything, people moving from cable TV to streaming, WiFi displays, ever growing software updates, realtime online games... Growing expectations may easily compensate for technological improvement. Maybe wallpapers are too much pita, but if it came preinstalled in the walls and floors? Why not?
      - vanattab 11y ago
        Do the wallpapers/paints block cell signals at all?
        warmwaffles 11y ago
        They can if they can form a faraday cage
    - wtallis 11y ago
      2.4GHz technology has already stopped improving. It's just getting more crowded as "the Internet of Things" trend gets more popular, flooding the 2.4GHz band with even more devices that—owing to their low-power design—often support only 802.11b or g and only at low rates, making them horrifically wasteful of airtime.

thescriptkiddie 11y ago

It makes things look more crowded, but unless people are actually using the Comcast WiFi it isn't actually adding to congestion. The periodic SSID beacons are an annoyance but they use negligible bandwidth. That said, don't ever use an ISP provided access point.

pavel_lishin 11y ago
> That said, don't ever use an ISP provided access point. Why not?
- 15155 11y ago
  Because they're running software you do not control on what is generally sub-par hardware. It's too cheap to get good, enterprise-grade equipment for home usage that will have no problems and allow you to turn all of the knobs.
- WorldMaker 11y ago
  In addition to the other answers many of the ISPs provide their hardware on essentially a rental model. The benefit to that is that if you complain loud enough they'll replace it on their dime: the detriment is the same as with any rental though, typically they overcharge you versus what you would pay if you bought it yourself. Your mileage will probably vary, but I've certainly saved money in the long run owning my own equipment, even paying for my own replacements versus storm damage and similar.
  - shostack 11y ago
    Another consideration is that often they will try to use the fact that you don't use their hardware as an excuse to not go further in troubleshooting since they "don't support 3rd party hardware."
    - WorldMaker 11y ago
      It's fun when you get the opposite too and they follow their support scripts regardless of your 3rd party hardware and above average knowledge of the subject: Support: On your hardware, do x. Me: Did it already. It reported "Y". Support: Please do it again, following these scripted steps [what don't match my actual hardware]... [I pretend to follow along.] Me: Done. It reported "Y". Support: Oh, well then...
indlebe 11y ago
>That said, don't ever use an ISP provided access point. Because the hardware is often inferior to what you can pick up for ~$200 at a tech store, not to mention the lack of control you get with an ISP AP.
- gst 11y ago
  Regarding "inferior": It's fast enough and it doesn't crash (at least for me). That's probably "good enough" for most people to not care if there's a better solution. "lack of control": The Comcast provided hardware gives me an IP via DHCP and I'm able to disable all those useless firewall features. So which features am I missing and why should I care about them?
  - indlebe 11y ago
    The average home user, sure, the ISP AP may be fine. But for the average reader of HN I suspect it would not be. I can't use an AP that does not allow me to fine-tune QoS and just tinker in general if packets are not flowing in the way that I desire.
    - untog 11y ago
      I'd be interested to know how much the average HN user cares about this. I certainly don't. I'm not even entirely sure how fast my home internet connection is - it's certainly fast enough for me to stream Netflix etc as well as connect to a VPN for working from home. I don't really care about anything else. (not that my internet connection is always great - it isn't - but that lies with my internet provider, who I have no choice over, so...)
      - jlarocco 11y ago
        I was going to say this, but you beat me to it. I think there are a lot of smart people on HN, but that doesn't mean they're all interested in all the same things. Tweaking wifi settings just seems like a waste of time to me, and boring to top it off. My interaction with my AP stopped at setting the ssid and passphrase.

legulere 11y ago

I'm sad that wifi-blocking wallpaper seems to have never taken off: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stealth_wallpaper https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stealth_wallpaper

qb45 11y ago
That's a cool tech. If it really provides decent attenuation of WiFi without affecting other radios I think it may still take off in the future. There will be a point when 2.4GHz WiFi doesn't work anymore at all.
- gst 11y ago
  How do you get to this conclusion? The density is probably not going to get much higher than it is already, but the technology is going to continue to improve.
  - qb45 11y ago
    More high-def everything, people moving from cable TV to streaming, WiFi displays, ever growing software updates, realtime online games... Growing expectations may easily compensate for technological improvement. Maybe wallpapers are too much pita, but if it came preinstalled in the walls and floors? Why not?
    - vanattab 11y ago
      Do the wallpapers/paints block cell signals at all?
      - warmwaffles 11y ago
        They can if they can form a faraday cage
  - wtallis 11y ago
    2.4GHz technology has already stopped improving. It's just getting more crowded as "the Internet of Things" trend gets more popular, flooding the 2.4GHz band with even more devices that—owing to their low-power design—often support only 802.11b or g and only at low rates, making them horrifically wasteful of airtime.