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AKATSUKI preparing for orbital insertion around Venus

91 points by bane 11y ago

florinutz 11y ago
that's what she said
jgrahamc 11y ago
This is awesome. Akatsuki failed to enter Venusian orbit five years ago and the team managing it managed to make it hibernate for almost 5 years.
- robin_reala 11y ago
  After they worked out how to return it the team published this image: http://www.cosmonoticias.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/akatsuki.jpg http://www.cosmonoticias.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/akat...
3pt14159 11y ago
I know most people are excited about humans on Mars, but I'm far more excited about Venus. 40 or 50kms up Venus is actually quite habitable. Similar gravity, pressure, calm wind speeds. We could build floating cities and create oxygen with floating bioengineered plants that slowly change the oxygen content of the planet. We could use particles or strategically placed solar panel arrays to shield off excess sunlight while we slowly change the atmosphere from CO2 to O2 + other gases. Mars is just a cold crappy desert.
- bad_alloc 11y ago
  Problems with Venus: * Acid atmosphere and extreme winds * No easy surface access -> No on-site resource extraction * No magnetic field -> more radiation * Larger delta-V requirement for a round trip * We have no launch systems built for a launch while suspendend in the atmosphere * Low water content * Much less signs that suggest previous habitability (hence Mars is more interesting)
  - pavel_lishin 11y ago
    Mars doesn't have a magnetic field, either.
    - wlesieutre 11y ago
      True, but it's further from the sun. The amount of stuff hitting you decreases with the square of distance, and Mars' closest distance from the sun is roughly twice Venus'. Assuming the simple "sun as a point source in a vacuum" model holds, Mars gets less than 1/4 the radiation of Venus. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law)
  - 3pt14159 11y ago
    * Acid atmosphere is mostly near below the surface, and is fixable in the long run. * Suface access can be done by robots, resource extraction can happen on the surface and balloons can lift the resources to the habitable zone. * No magnetic field, agreed. Problem. * Larger delta-V, less of an issue in the long run. It's easier to get to Detroit than Cuba from Toronto, but most people winter in Havana. * Launch systems are easier that bioengineering. * Water can be imported or synthesized. We'll have lots of extra O2 with all that CO2 we'll be converting. * We haven't really looked at Venus. We've sent some soviet probes in for a couple of hours each back in the 80s, and they focused on the hellish surface. In terms of long term development of human cities, I still think Venus is a far better candidate than Mars, even if Mars is easier for now.
    - structural 11y ago
      We still don't have a set of robots whose lifetime will be measured in days, not hours. Really, if the atmosphere was fixed a bit then most of what you said would become possible, but it's unclear just how that's going to happen, especially at first.
      - shostack 11y ago
        What sorts of implications might there be if we actually had a way of fixing the atmosphere? I imagine that it is intimately connected to other aspects of the planet.
- Symmetry 11y ago
  Selenian Boondocks had a great series of posts on living on Venus a while ago. The short of it is that there's lots of useful stuff in the Venusian atmosphere, and it's much easier to harvest things from the medium you're floating in than to mine it. I'm not going to speculate on terraforming since that takes so long but there's plenty of reason to go to Venus. http://selenianboondocks.com/category/venus/ http://selenianboondocks.com/category/venus/
TaylorSwift 11y ago
United States really need more advanced space explorations. It is good that many other nations such as Russia, China, Japan, and India have recently been visiting such interest. But their quests are really dwarfed in terms of technology and vision. The race against Soviet Union was what drove United States to its great height. Instead of spending resources on policing the world, space exploration is really the way to go. Investment allocation on intellectual capital through space exploration must be prioritized so that we can bring the best out of human civilization.
AstroJetson 11y ago
The update is that burn happened and that it appears to have worked. They are watching the track to see what the orbit is. Nice job on their part of trying to the mission.
heapcity 11y ago
Much praise and glory are due to the people of Japan for such a courageous and expensive undertaking.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
throwaway_yy2Di 11y ago
Here's a very interesting article about this orbit insertion, how the main rocket engine was destroyed in flight, and how JAXA hacked together a solution using only RCS thrusters: The Akatsuki story is particularly interesting for two reasons. First, because the failure was documented in exceptional detail, with telemetry from the propulsion and attitude control system available to reconstruct, like the “black box” on an airliner, the events leading up to the anomaly. JAXA is to be commended on its openness: in the challenges of space we can all learn from others, and some western agencies are not always as forthcoming with technical details of anomalies. And second, because the Akatsuki story may yet have a happy ending. http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest-blogs/2015/1204-akatsuki-returns-to-venus.html http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest-blogs/2015/1204-akatsuk...
- talloaktrees 11y ago
  it's funny how just having played Kerbal Space Program let's me understand what you are talking about
  - hcarvalhoalves 11y ago
    I'm 30 years old and I am not even ashamed to say KSP is awesome. Now I understand most things going on aerospace.
leet 11y ago
Am I the only one thinking about naruto?

91 points by bane 11y ago

that's what she said

This is awesome. Akatsuki failed to enter Venusian orbit five years ago and the team managing it managed to make it hibernate for almost 5 years.

robin_reala 11y ago
After they worked out how to return it the team published this image: http://www.cosmonoticias.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/akatsuki.jpg http://www.cosmonoticias.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/akat...

3pt14159 11y ago

I know most people are excited about humans on Mars, but I'm far more excited about Venus. 40 or 50kms up Venus is actually quite habitable. Similar gravity, pressure, calm wind speeds. We could build floating cities and create oxygen with floating bioengineered plants that slowly change the oxygen content of the planet. We could use particles or strategically placed solar panel arrays to shield off excess sunlight while we slowly change the atmosphere from CO2 to O2 + other gases. Mars is just a cold crappy desert.

bad_alloc 11y ago
Problems with Venus: * Acid atmosphere and extreme winds * No easy surface access -> No on-site resource extraction * No magnetic field -> more radiation * Larger delta-V requirement for a round trip * We have no launch systems built for a launch while suspendend in the atmosphere * Low water content * Much less signs that suggest previous habitability (hence Mars is more interesting)
- pavel_lishin 11y ago
  Mars doesn't have a magnetic field, either.
  - wlesieutre 11y ago
    True, but it's further from the sun. The amount of stuff hitting you decreases with the square of distance, and Mars' closest distance from the sun is roughly twice Venus'. Assuming the simple "sun as a point source in a vacuum" model holds, Mars gets less than 1/4 the radiation of Venus. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law)
- 3pt14159 11y ago
  * Acid atmosphere is mostly near below the surface, and is fixable in the long run. * Suface access can be done by robots, resource extraction can happen on the surface and balloons can lift the resources to the habitable zone. * No magnetic field, agreed. Problem. * Larger delta-V, less of an issue in the long run. It's easier to get to Detroit than Cuba from Toronto, but most people winter in Havana. * Launch systems are easier that bioengineering. * Water can be imported or synthesized. We'll have lots of extra O2 with all that CO2 we'll be converting. * We haven't really looked at Venus. We've sent some soviet probes in for a couple of hours each back in the 80s, and they focused on the hellish surface. In terms of long term development of human cities, I still think Venus is a far better candidate than Mars, even if Mars is easier for now.
  - structural 11y ago
    We still don't have a set of robots whose lifetime will be measured in days, not hours. Really, if the atmosphere was fixed a bit then most of what you said would become possible, but it's unclear just how that's going to happen, especially at first.
    - shostack 11y ago
      What sorts of implications might there be if we actually had a way of fixing the atmosphere? I imagine that it is intimately connected to other aspects of the planet.
Symmetry 11y ago
Selenian Boondocks had a great series of posts on living on Venus a while ago. The short of it is that there's lots of useful stuff in the Venusian atmosphere, and it's much easier to harvest things from the medium you're floating in than to mine it. I'm not going to speculate on terraforming since that takes so long but there's plenty of reason to go to Venus. http://selenianboondocks.com/category/venus/ http://selenianboondocks.com/category/venus/

TaylorSwift 11y ago

United States really need more advanced space explorations. It is good that many other nations such as Russia, China, Japan, and India have recently been visiting such interest. But their quests are really dwarfed in terms of technology and vision. The race against Soviet Union was what drove United States to its great height. Instead of spending resources on policing the world, space exploration is really the way to go. Investment allocation on intellectual capital through space exploration must be prioritized so that we can bring the best out of human civilization.

AstroJetson 11y ago

The update is that burn happened and that it appears to have worked. They are watching the track to see what the orbit is. Nice job on their part of trying to the mission.

heapcity 11y ago

Much praise and glory are due to the people of Japan for such a courageous and expensive undertaking.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

throwaway_yy2Di 11y ago

Here's a very interesting article about this orbit insertion, how the main rocket engine was destroyed in flight, and how JAXA hacked together a solution using only RCS thrusters: The Akatsuki story is particularly interesting for two reasons. First, because the failure was documented in exceptional detail, with telemetry from the propulsion and attitude control system available to reconstruct, like the “black box” on an airliner, the events leading up to the anomaly. JAXA is to be commended on its openness: in the challenges of space we can all learn from others, and some western agencies are not always as forthcoming with technical details of anomalies. And second, because the Akatsuki story may yet have a happy ending. http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest-blogs/2015/1204-akatsuki-returns-to-venus.html http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest-blogs/2015/1204-akatsuk...

talloaktrees 11y ago
it's funny how just having played Kerbal Space Program let's me understand what you are talking about
- hcarvalhoalves 11y ago
  I'm 30 years old and I am not even ashamed to say KSP is awesome. Now I understand most things going on aerospace.

leet 11y ago

Am I the only one thinking about naruto?