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This car stuff still doesn't make sense to me. One big thing I don't understand about these Apple car rumors is what is Apple supposed to be doing that current

This car stuff still doesn't make sense to me. One big thing I don't understand about these Apple car rumors is what is Apple supposed to be doing that current automotive groups are not? If you're new to a product area, building a car using CMs (makes sense) with subsystems sourced from the CM or outside suppliers (also makes sense), where's the je ne sais quoi that makes the Apple car compelling over other options? How can you have an advantage over the established manufacturers, if you're sourcing parts/knowledge (e.g., BMW's nifty CFRP material) from your competition? What's the sustainable competitive advantage? An obvious answer would seem to be design, but I don't buy that Apple producing a better UI than the current car manufacturers is fait accompli. On infotainment, CarPlay is pretty frustrating to use, to the point that I question if anyone from Apple has actually used it while driving: legibility is awful (especially for Maps), Siri doesn't work well in the noisy car environment as a primary navigation tool, and touch operation takes too much eye attention. Some of the usability failures are due to current Apple styling choices (e.g., fonts that are too thin), but many are (as I see it) due to the unsuitability of the Apple multitouch UI paradigm for the car. For comparison, I'd rate both Chrysler's UConnect and BMW's iDrive as superior in usability. I have no doubt that CarPlay can be improved (e.g., physical jog wheels), but I see those improvements as teaching away from the Apple's UI paradigm and towards the existing competitors in the auto world. As to interior or exterior design, I also remain skeptical: Apple tends to pick materials that don't wear well in use, and we're talking about a product that will have far longer lifecycle than anything in the current Apple lineup. I'm sure Apple could produce something that looks nice, but plenty of marques make nice looking cars. Nice appearance for cars is commoditized. Apple's current supply chain and manufacturing processes are a hell of an advantage in consumer electronics, but there would seem to be very little overlap with automotive. I guess that applies broadly too, there seems to be so little overlap with Apple's current corporate experience and advantages in consumer electronics and the automotive arena. edit: Also, JLG's point on maintenance is poppycock. Electric cars may have reduced maintenance, but to suggest that tires and wiper blades are all one has to worry about is plain wrong. Part of the product lifecycle considerations includes recalls, e.g., Takata airbags.

Steko 11y ago
What can Apple do different than big incumbents? How about all the stuff HN goes gaga over when Tesla does it? I think you're selling design as a difference short, for Apple design is holistic and affects the entire product experience not just the look and feel or the entertainment ux. They design the manufacturing process to squeeze out nickels on the dollar and using CM means they avoid legacy overhead that weighs down behemoths like GM, VW and Toyota. They also don't have any legacy overhead tied to engineering around ICE. As we've seen with Tesla, they had to reinvent almost everything because most of the problems traditional car companies had been working on don't exist in an all-electric vehicle. Apple designs the buying process, which for cars is nightmare fuel for most people. Even in their normal retail stores, buying is easier, you can pick up some things off the shelf, ring it up yourself right where you're standing with the Store app and then walk out. This may be Apple's biggest advantage from the customer's perspective. Carplay I haven't used but I think you may be selling this short too, on /r/cars when an industry entertainment guy asked what they should be doing the most upvoted response was: get out of the way and make dumb screens for Android Auto and CarPlay [1]. Maybe you're right though and it is outclassed by some current offerings. Perhaps this area is an Apple weakness but another possibly is that CarPlay is to iCar as the Motorola ROKR was to the iphone. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/2vfubz/i_am_one_of_the_lead_engineers_responsible_for/ https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/2vfubz/i_am_one_of_th... You talk about Apple's materials being shoddy but that is not the impression I have (outside of charging cables). My iphone 3gs and 4s have held up very well and metal frame ipads, macbooks and iphones seem to do even better. Greg Koenig's much linked post about their Watch manufacturing [2] basically said Apple is operating at the pinnacle of craftsmanship when it comes to materials, precision and finish. One quote of many possible: "I see a process that could only have been created by a team looking to execute on a level far beyond what was necessary or what will be noticed. This isn't a supply chain, it is a ritual Apple is performing to bring themselves up to the standards necessary to compete against companies with centuries of experience." There is plenty of room for technical gimmicks here in the auto industry and I fully expect a video of Jony Ive explaining how revolutionary it is for safety when the entire carframe is milled from a single piece of aluminum. [2] http://atomicdelights.com/blog/a-glimpse-at-how-the-apple-watch-is-made http://atomicdelights.com/blog/a-glimpse-at-how-the-apple-wa...

Steko 11y ago

What can Apple do different than big incumbents? How about all the stuff HN goes gaga over when Tesla does it? I think you're selling design as a difference short, for Apple design is holistic and affects the entire product experience not just the look and feel or the entertainment ux. They design the manufacturing process to squeeze out nickels on the dollar and using CM means they avoid legacy overhead that weighs down behemoths like GM, VW and Toyota. They also don't have any legacy overhead tied to engineering around ICE. As we've seen with Tesla, they had to reinvent almost everything because most of the problems traditional car companies had been working on don't exist in an all-electric vehicle. Apple designs the buying process, which for cars is nightmare fuel for most people. Even in their normal retail stores, buying is easier, you can pick up some things off the shelf, ring it up yourself right where you're standing with the Store app and then walk out. This may be Apple's biggest advantage from the customer's perspective. Carplay I haven't used but I think you may be selling this short too, on /r/cars when an industry entertainment guy asked what they should be doing the most upvoted response was: get out of the way and make dumb screens for Android Auto and CarPlay [1]. Maybe you're right though and it is outclassed by some current offerings. Perhaps this area is an Apple weakness but another possibly is that CarPlay is to iCar as the Motorola ROKR was to the iphone. [1] https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/2vfubz/i_am_one_of_the_lead_engineers_responsible_for/ https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/2vfubz/i_am_one_of_th... You talk about Apple's materials being shoddy but that is not the impression I have (outside of charging cables). My iphone 3gs and 4s have held up very well and metal frame ipads, macbooks and iphones seem to do even better. Greg Koenig's much linked post about their Watch manufacturing [2] basically said Apple is operating at the pinnacle of craftsmanship when it comes to materials, precision and finish. One quote of many possible: "I see a process that could only have been created by a team looking to execute on a level far beyond what was necessary or what will be noticed. This isn't a supply chain, it is a ritual Apple is performing to bring themselves up to the standards necessary to compete against companies with centuries of experience." There is plenty of room for technical gimmicks here in the auto industry and I fully expect a video of Jony Ive explaining how revolutionary it is for safety when the entire carframe is milled from a single piece of aluminum. [2] http://atomicdelights.com/blog/a-glimpse-at-how-the-apple-watch-is-made http://atomicdelights.com/blog/a-glimpse-at-how-the-apple-wa...