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Or we could just increase skilled immigration to maintain the population. Costs us nothing.

by aianus 11y ago

danieltillett 11y ago
Or we could just have fewer people living in the country. The population of Australia has expanded massively in my lifetime (it has about doubled) yet the infrastructure to support this higher population has not been built. Twice as many people trying to live using the same infrastructure does not make for a fun time.
- victorhooi 11y ago
  A lot of naive observers suggest this, without having thought through the demographical consequences. Go look at Japan to see what happens when you reduce both births and immigration. An aging population, combined with falling fertility rates and no immigration is a disaster waiting to happen. You need fresh blood to keep an economy going - they form the backbone of the workforce (read: taxes) - and in general, they're not scared of trying new things.
  - danieltillett 11y ago
    Japan is doing ok. What matters is per capita GDP not gross GDP.
    - joeclark77 11y ago
      Neither of those things could help Japan. Ultimately old people are going to need nurses and other people to provide services for them. If there are not enough young people willing to do those jobs, then all the money in the world is useless.
      - aianus 11y ago
        Nothing stopping them from importing nurses from abroad when and if they get to that desperate stage.
        joeclark77 11y ago
        The parent, parent, parent comment (by victorhooi) is stating that Japan's problems stem from its reluctance both to have children and to allow immigration. Your answer -- that they should change their attitude toward immigration -- doesn't refute him or me, it agrees with us.
  - nova 11y ago
    > An aging population, combined with falling fertility rates and no immigration is a disaster waiting to happen. No, that's what's going to happen in Europe. Japan will just have to make some deep, technical changes to budget and taxes in a culturally and ethnically homogeneous civilization, not have to deal with social upheaval.
joeclark77 11y ago
Also gains you nothing, if your civilization is extinct in a few generations.
- yongjik 11y ago
  Accepting immigrants is a pretty good insurance against your civilization going extinct, in fact. More diversity, more innovation. Sure, so the inheritors of my civilization might share like, only 99.95% of my DNA instead of 99.99%, but so what?
  - nova 11y ago
    > Accepting immigrants is a pretty good insurance against your civilization going extinct, in fact. Yeah, it only gets replaced. > More diversity, more innovation. Sure, sure.

Or we could just increase skilled immigration to maintain the population. Costs us nothing.

by aianus 11y ago

Or we could just increase skilled immigration to maintain the population. Costs us nothing.

Or we could just have fewer people living in the country. The population of Australia has expanded massively in my lifetime (it has about doubled) yet the infrastructure to support this higher population has not been built. Twice as many people trying to live using the same infrastructure does not make for a fun time.

victorhooi 11y ago
A lot of naive observers suggest this, without having thought through the demographical consequences. Go look at Japan to see what happens when you reduce both births and immigration. An aging population, combined with falling fertility rates and no immigration is a disaster waiting to happen. You need fresh blood to keep an economy going - they form the backbone of the workforce (read: taxes) - and in general, they're not scared of trying new things.
- danieltillett 11y ago
  Japan is doing ok. What matters is per capita GDP not gross GDP.
  - joeclark77 11y ago
    Neither of those things could help Japan. Ultimately old people are going to need nurses and other people to provide services for them. If there are not enough young people willing to do those jobs, then all the money in the world is useless.
    - aianus 11y ago
      Nothing stopping them from importing nurses from abroad when and if they get to that desperate stage.
      - joeclark77 11y ago
        The parent, parent, parent comment (by victorhooi) is stating that Japan's problems stem from its reluctance both to have children and to allow immigration. Your answer -- that they should change their attitude toward immigration -- doesn't refute him or me, it agrees with us.
- nova 11y ago
  > An aging population, combined with falling fertility rates and no immigration is a disaster waiting to happen. No, that's what's going to happen in Europe. Japan will just have to make some deep, technical changes to budget and taxes in a culturally and ethnically homogeneous civilization, not have to deal with social upheaval.

joeclark77 11y ago

Also gains you nothing, if your civilization is extinct in a few generations.

yongjik 11y ago
Accepting immigrants is a pretty good insurance against your civilization going extinct, in fact. More diversity, more innovation. Sure, so the inheritors of my civilization might share like, only 99.95% of my DNA instead of 99.99%, but so what?
- nova 11y ago
  > Accepting immigrants is a pretty good insurance against your civilization going extinct, in fact. Yeah, it only gets replaced. > More diversity, more innovation. Sure, sure.