5 ms·

Alas it happens all the time. See Gary Kildall (MS-DOS originated from from his CP/M but he never saw a dime of royalty) and Phil Katz (PKZIP, note how the Zip

Alas it happens all the time. See Gary Kildall (MS-DOS originated from from his CP/M but he never saw a dime of royalty) and Phil Katz (PKZIP, note how the Zip file format uses "PK" as magic number). I've always wondered if the bitterness of having lost their big occasion caused them to die prematurely, the former in a biker bar brawl and the latter of alcoholism at the age of 37.

TwoBit 11y ago
I'm pretty sure Phil Katz was rich from pkzip.
computator 11y ago
> Alas it happens all the time. In the field of computing, I think the greatest contribution to the world vs least fame & fortune goes to the inventor of the World Wide Web. It's sad that outside of the computing world, Tim Berners-Lee is unknown. Asking your dentist, aunt, or barber about who they think invented the web leads to some amusing replies. I've actually done this and after telling them about Berners-Lee, I found the following themes to be common: (1) Incredulousness that it was one person. People either think it had to be a big company or that it somehow "evolved" into existence (you know, the way television or photography just kind of happened without any particular persons being involved /irony). (2) Belief that he chose to not accept the money. That is, he could have made a fortune if he wanted to, but for unspecified reasons he didn't want the money. I've tried to explain that the web wouldn't have succeeded if he tried to charge for it (even assuming that CERN let him charge for it), but there's a popular belief that great work always gets rewarded unless one explicitly opts out of the reward. AN ASIDE: I think that in all human endeavor, the record for greatest contribution to the world vs least fame & fortune, where the inventor is truly known, should go to Cai Lun (also spelt Ts'ai Lun), the inventor of paper. He's a real person and historically well-documented as the actual inventor of paper: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cai_Lun https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cai_Lun
- alayne 11y ago
  Tim has received many, many honors. Please see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awards_and_honours_presented_to_Tim_Berners-Lee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awards_and_honours_presented_t... There was a large amount of right place/right time to what he did. It wouldn't have been possible without the Internet infrastructure. He didn't invent networking or hypertext.
  - computator 11y ago
    All that's true, but it doesn't contradict the basic point: Tim Berners-Lee has one of the greatest contribution to least fame & fortune ratios in the field of computing. > Tim has received many, many honors. The average person uses the web all the time but has never heard of Tim Berners-Lee or any of the awards you mention. But they know who won the Oscar for a movie they watched for 90 minutes. > There was a large amount of right place/right time to what he did. That's also true of (for example) Bill Gates, but he made a massive fortune and is well-known by the public. > He didn't invent networking or hypertext. You can make that kind of comment about everything ever invented in human history. Everyone builds on top of something.
    - alayne 11y ago
      Engelbart demoed hypertext in the 60s. There are many underappreciated people in history, but TBL is not one of them.
    - chrisseaton 11y ago
      > The average person uses the web all the time but has never heard of Tim Berners-Lee He was in the opening ceremony of the last olympics, right alongside the pop stars. I don't think any other computer scientist has ever been honoured in such a public, pop-culture way.
      - SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
        Working on an actual NeXTCube as well. Now that's attention to detail! http://i.imgur.com/8KxqM.gif http://i.imgur.com/8KxqM.gif
- chubot 11y ago
  What's even more a shame is that many people in the computer industry don't respect TBL's invention and accomplishments either! I'll borrow a phrase from Paul Graham and call it the "middlebrow critique" of the web. Typically people think the design is naive and inefficient -- they think it should involve a stateful protocol, a turing-complete VM, or be more "statically typed". They also tend to believe in "global truth" and neglect backward compatibility / graceful upgrades. I've heard a variety of accomplished engineers -- including my coworkers at Google, whose riches were built on the web -- express these kinds of sentiments. I think the real disconnect is that TBL thinks about people just as much as he thinks about computers. He thinks about the ecosystem -- the whole rather than the parts. The inventions and design principles were not an accident; you can read about them in his book "Weaving the Web".
  - berntb 11y ago
    The whole stateful/stateless choice isn't intuitive unless you've at least read discussions about a few protocol designs/implementations which made these choices. It isn't about intelligence. No wait, I might be wrong here -- this ought to be obvious for people so young that they grew up doing web programming? Do educated developers really say that? (I haven't followed the rfcs for quite a long time, so I probably do lots Dunning–Krugers myself now. :-) ) Edit: I remember when WWW took over from Gopher. I thought "Damn, a superior alternative that won't win because a first-come implementation already filled the niche." Then came Mosaic which could show pictures -- and WWW took over. I was happy and disgusted at the shallowness. :-)
    - drumdance 11y ago
      One of my favorite Internet artifacts is Marc Andreessen's proposal for the IMG tag -- note he used all caps. http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.html http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.ht...
- aninhumer 11y ago
  >Incredulousness that it was one person. People either think it had to be a big company or that it somehow "evolved" into existence I think this is just because most people don't understand what the "world wide web" is. They think it's synonymous with "internet", and so are understandably incredulous.
- DanBC 11y ago
  > In the field of computing, I think the greatest contribution to the world vs least fame & fortune goes to the inventor of the World Wide Web. See also Clifford Cocks.
peteretep 11y ago
> Gary Kildall "Selling DRI to Novell had made Kildall a wealthy man, and he moved to the West Lake Hills suburb of Austin. His Austin house was a lakeside property, with stalls for several sports cars, plus a video studio in the basement. Kildall owned and flew his own Learjet private jet airplane and had at least one boat on the lake." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kildall https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kildall Gary was bitter about Bill Gates getting all the glory, but that's the opposite of what the original article is about > Phil Katz "PKWARE became a multimillion-dollar company" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Katz https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Katz
- mariuolo 11y ago
  I stand corrected.
drumdance 11y ago
Everything I've heard is that Phil Katz was deeply troubled. He had made millions by the time he succumbed to alcohol.
WalterBright 11y ago
CP/M looked a lot like DEC's RT-11 operating system, which also owed a lot to earlier systems. Also, CPM-86 did exist on the PC alongside MSDOS. I used both, and MSDOS was clearly significantly better. I'm not sure that CP/M was all that innovative or had crucial design properties.

TwoBit 11y ago

I'm pretty sure Phil Katz was rich from pkzip.

computator 11y ago

> Alas it happens all the time. In the field of computing, I think the greatest contribution to the world vs least fame & fortune goes to the inventor of the World Wide Web. It's sad that outside of the computing world, Tim Berners-Lee is unknown. Asking your dentist, aunt, or barber about who they think invented the web leads to some amusing replies. I've actually done this and after telling them about Berners-Lee, I found the following themes to be common: (1) Incredulousness that it was one person. People either think it had to be a big company or that it somehow "evolved" into existence (you know, the way television or photography just kind of happened without any particular persons being involved /irony). (2) Belief that he chose to not accept the money. That is, he could have made a fortune if he wanted to, but for unspecified reasons he didn't want the money. I've tried to explain that the web wouldn't have succeeded if he tried to charge for it (even assuming that CERN let him charge for it), but there's a popular belief that great work always gets rewarded unless one explicitly opts out of the reward. AN ASIDE: I think that in all human endeavor, the record for greatest contribution to the world vs least fame & fortune, where the inventor is truly known, should go to Cai Lun (also spelt Ts'ai Lun), the inventor of paper. He's a real person and historically well-documented as the actual inventor of paper: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cai_Lun https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cai_Lun

alayne 11y ago
Tim has received many, many honors. Please see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awards_and_honours_presented_to_Tim_Berners-Lee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awards_and_honours_presented_t... There was a large amount of right place/right time to what he did. It wouldn't have been possible without the Internet infrastructure. He didn't invent networking or hypertext.
- computator 11y ago
  All that's true, but it doesn't contradict the basic point: Tim Berners-Lee has one of the greatest contribution to least fame & fortune ratios in the field of computing. > Tim has received many, many honors. The average person uses the web all the time but has never heard of Tim Berners-Lee or any of the awards you mention. But they know who won the Oscar for a movie they watched for 90 minutes. > There was a large amount of right place/right time to what he did. That's also true of (for example) Bill Gates, but he made a massive fortune and is well-known by the public. > He didn't invent networking or hypertext. You can make that kind of comment about everything ever invented in human history. Everyone builds on top of something.
  - alayne 11y ago
    Engelbart demoed hypertext in the 60s. There are many underappreciated people in history, but TBL is not one of them.
  - chrisseaton 11y ago
    > The average person uses the web all the time but has never heard of Tim Berners-Lee He was in the opening ceremony of the last olympics, right alongside the pop stars. I don't think any other computer scientist has ever been honoured in such a public, pop-culture way.
    - SmellyGeekBoy 11y ago
      Working on an actual NeXTCube as well. Now that's attention to detail! http://i.imgur.com/8KxqM.gif http://i.imgur.com/8KxqM.gif
chubot 11y ago
What's even more a shame is that many people in the computer industry don't respect TBL's invention and accomplishments either! I'll borrow a phrase from Paul Graham and call it the "middlebrow critique" of the web. Typically people think the design is naive and inefficient -- they think it should involve a stateful protocol, a turing-complete VM, or be more "statically typed". They also tend to believe in "global truth" and neglect backward compatibility / graceful upgrades. I've heard a variety of accomplished engineers -- including my coworkers at Google, whose riches were built on the web -- express these kinds of sentiments. I think the real disconnect is that TBL thinks about people just as much as he thinks about computers. He thinks about the ecosystem -- the whole rather than the parts. The inventions and design principles were not an accident; you can read about them in his book "Weaving the Web".
- berntb 11y ago
  The whole stateful/stateless choice isn't intuitive unless you've at least read discussions about a few protocol designs/implementations which made these choices. It isn't about intelligence. No wait, I might be wrong here -- this ought to be obvious for people so young that they grew up doing web programming? Do educated developers really say that? (I haven't followed the rfcs for quite a long time, so I probably do lots Dunning–Krugers myself now. :-) ) Edit: I remember when WWW took over from Gopher. I thought "Damn, a superior alternative that won't win because a first-come implementation already filled the niche." Then came Mosaic which could show pictures -- and WWW took over. I was happy and disgusted at the shallowness. :-)
  - drumdance 11y ago
    One of my favorite Internet artifacts is Marc Andreessen's proposal for the IMG tag -- note he used all caps. http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.html http://1997.webhistory.org/www.lists/www-talk.1993q1/0182.ht...
aninhumer 11y ago
>Incredulousness that it was one person. People either think it had to be a big company or that it somehow "evolved" into existence I think this is just because most people don't understand what the "world wide web" is. They think it's synonymous with "internet", and so are understandably incredulous.
DanBC 11y ago
> In the field of computing, I think the greatest contribution to the world vs least fame & fortune goes to the inventor of the World Wide Web. See also Clifford Cocks.

peteretep 11y ago

> Gary Kildall "Selling DRI to Novell had made Kildall a wealthy man, and he moved to the West Lake Hills suburb of Austin. His Austin house was a lakeside property, with stalls for several sports cars, plus a video studio in the basement. Kildall owned and flew his own Learjet private jet airplane and had at least one boat on the lake." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kildall https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kildall Gary was bitter about Bill Gates getting all the glory, but that's the opposite of what the original article is about > Phil Katz "PKWARE became a multimillion-dollar company" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Katz https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Katz

mariuolo 11y ago
I stand corrected.

drumdance 11y ago

Everything I've heard is that Phil Katz was deeply troubled. He had made millions by the time he succumbed to alcohol.

WalterBright 11y ago

CP/M looked a lot like DEC's RT-11 operating system, which also owed a lot to earlier systems. Also, CPM-86 did exist on the PC alongside MSDOS. I used both, and MSDOS was clearly significantly better. I'm not sure that CP/M was all that innovative or had crucial design properties.