6 ms·

Less than 24 hours on Udemy as an instructor and I’m close to leaving

293 points by baobaba 11y ago

anon6_ 11y ago
I can empathize with you. You don't need to go on the attack/defense, you need to move and regroup your forces. I don't see how you stand to benefit from writing a negative article. The problem is no one knows who you are. The first thing we hear is you attacking Udemy from a defensive posture. If you're going to present yourself to the world, I think the best way to do so is to show them who you really are. Tell your story. So how about we take this off the front page, then make a new post about how great your tutorials are, what value they bring... and starting immediately, they can stripe/paypal you and buy them from your website for the best experience. You can put up a paypal button now and email the videos by hand. Since you made a flask SAAS tutorial - you will probably be able to have a full video site up in a week or two.
- alexandros 11y ago
  You appear to believe the author is making a global appeal and has deliberately put this on the HN front page. Please remember that this is the author's personal blog, the readers there probably know who this is, and some of them shared the link which made it here. Take the content for what it's worth, spare the author the patronising lecture.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - anon6_ 11y ago
    I disagree with the approach heartily. It's hard to think big picture when you yourself feel or have been spurned. Even lawyers hire lawyers. This is a public post the whole world can read. It's now publicly exposed to thousands of readers. Most of which don't know him and are now getting a first impression. This doesn't put him in a position to gain anything. Even if his critique of udemy went viral and was taken in the most positive way, his reputation as a programmer and video content producer is damaged since he's seen as a spurned advocate. This is why Europa is so stoked on the "right to be forgotten". So many times we see a person who has dreams, but their temporary disagreement and power struggle personally ends up damaging their reputation. They are cast aside as trouble makers, and when it comes down to the decision of whether you want to work with someone, people's biases will tend to pick someone who won't potentially cause a stir. Their "15 minutes of fame" deafens future attempts at them building their identity and reputation in the field they want.
    - jacquesm 11y ago
      You're way off base. The author is free to do as he pleases and it's none of your business to tell him to retract his article. Anonymous cowards aplenty on the internet, anonymous cowards dictating what can and can not be discussed and what should be retracted is a bit much don't you think? I got a pretty positive first impression of the author, he's capable, he outlined his griefs, did so after actually spending considerable time to use the product, is balanced because he sees both the good and the bad. If I were in Udemy's shoes I'd love to receive feedback like this and I'd do what I could to address his very reasonable points. Oh, and this is not why Europe has a 'right to be forgotten'. Everything you've written actually applies to your own comments here, but since your anonymous you don't care about that either way but I though that was kind of funny. In short: OP's reputation is doing just fine.
      - anon6_ 11y ago
        Giving suggestions isn't dictating. That's what comments are for. He spent considerable amount of time which, in my opinion, would be better spent creating something superior. To reiterate, I empathize with his grievances. Outlining them doesn't serve to bolster the legitimacy of his brand or sell videos. If the intention is to get the pitchforks and sick them on Udemy, I also think I'm correct in pouring cold water on that too. I truly see things differently, I don't want an end game where mobbing and shaming - I want to key people coding and making things. He says he creates tutorials on SAAS platforms, yet he himself gives a critique to udemy on their site's performance and practices? To people's perceptions, that may send a conflicting message. Let's see this another way, author launches his own video website using his SAAS Flask skills and talents.
        jacquesm 11y ago
        > He spent considerable amount of time which, in my opinion, would be better spent creating something superior. You decide what you want to do with your life, the author gets to decide what to do with theirs. It's not your call to make. > To reiterate, I empathize with his grievances. Outlining them doesn't serve to bolster the legitimacy of his brand or sell videos. To you. > If the intention is to get the pitchforks and sick them on Udemy, I also think I'm correct in pouring cold water on that too. I didn't see any pitchforks. Just a very detailed end-user report detailing a bunch of issues with an online service, provided free of charge. > I truly see things differently, I don't want an end game where mobbing and shaming - I want to key people coding and making things. Good, so go code stuff and make stuff. You're not doing either here you're telling someone to stop making stuff (writing is making stuff). > He says he creates tutorials on SAAS platforms, yet he himself gives a critique to udemy on their site's performance and practices? Who better than someone that has the experience? > To people's perceptions, that may send a conflicting message. HN is a pretty smart bunch I don't think we need you to interpret the message for us, we're quite capable of thinking for ourselves here. > Let's see this another way, author launches his own video website using his SAAS Flask skills and talents. He just might, time will tell. But at least he gave Udemy the benefit of his experience for which they are no doubt grateful.
  - blazespin 11y ago
    Actually, the author posted the link on HN in another HN thread.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
  - nickjj 11y ago
    Blog author here. The beginning of the article praises Udemy's student experience. Trust me, I'm not a competitor to them. If I were, I would have just hosted my course on my own platform without even thinking about Udemy.
    - sukulaku 11y ago
      For what it's worth, I thought the article was well written and useful.
    - jacquesm 11y ago
      You're doing just fine. I'd suggest you polish your own platform use it to showcase what it can do and charge a fee if others want to use it as a service. Competition is good for everybody, both the users, the course makers and eventually for the companies because it keeps them sharp.
    - tangled_zans 11y ago
      great article, lots of good insights!
mr_luc 11y ago
Wow! To some people, that article is going to seem like nit-picking, and insofar as it affects most people, it may be. But my feeling on reading this article is gratitude. Thanks for writing it. It's good for Udemy. If their business practices end up costing some content creators 87.5% of list price, then it's because the evil and/or lazy forces in the company have gained ground, and this kind of sunshine may weaken them. It's good for content creators. It's good for consumers. As a potential customer of courses like yours, I was discouraged at seeing their incentivization of cheaper, spammier courses. Why? Because even if education is turned into a product, it's is still a "buy-it-for-life" product where quality matters, and quality is the only metric I (and probably many of Udemy's shoppers!) really care about. Anything that could result in less noise/spam in their signal is appreciated. It'll be interesting to see how Udemy responds.
grogenaut 11y ago
takeaway: break you lessons up into $5 (to you) chunks and the let them go on sale for $10.
anderspitman 11y ago
The author raised $12,451 USD from 13 backers for a Flask course? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nickjj/build-a-saas-app-with-flask-and-deploy-it-with-doc?ref=nav_search https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nickjj/build-a-saas-app... Maybe I'm in the wrong line of work.
- stephengillie 11y ago
  The great majority of that came from 2 backers, who also received these services: - I will do a case study on your app and it will be featured on the project's website. - 1 hour remote consulting session to help you get unstuck with the project. - E-mail support within reason. - Both screencast series. - A PDF cheatsheet of all of the tasks and deploy commands you can run. - A Flask sticker that you can place anywhere! So essentially they paid a few grand for a Flask course, decent support package (1 hour live support, unlimited email support), some videos and swag.
  - logicallee 11y ago
    wait, wait, wait on your third point - a whole hour for each of all two backers you mention?
    - tymekpavel 11y ago
      I think I detect sarcasm? That seems like a fairly reasonable rate.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
- mr_luc 11y ago
  While that obviously works out to a surprising amount from each individual, if the author really spent two months putting the course together, well ... it wouldn't be particularly well-paid client work for a contractor in the Bay Area.
  - 11y ago
pg_is_a_butt 11y ago
what is a udemy?
listic 11y ago
I don't know if it's an open course hosting platform, but there's http://02geek.com/ http://02geek.com/
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
mmaunder 11y ago
As someone who has been doing screencasts with voice, I can tell you the mic is really important. If you use a headset, even a good one, you can generally hear the spit swishing around in your mouth. It's awful. A buddy runs a pro recording studio and recommended Aphex Microphone X. I haven't looked back. Aphex makes amazing pro microphone preamps that are pricey. They launched something called Microphone X which has a compressor and a "big bottom" feature that were previously only in their high end pro gear. It's quite affordable - about $200 compared to an EV RE20 broadcaster mic for $600. It's a USB mic, so you don't need a preamp or digi interface. You just plug it into your computer and you're all set. I use it with a boom stand and pop filter. I love them so much I use them for everything including skype calls. What this does is negate the changes in volume as you get closer or further from the mic (compressor). Add some nice radio bass to your voice with the big bottom effect. And generally give you a pro quality mic with a USB interface. Here are all three: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B73OJT2?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B73OJT2?psc=1&redirect=t... http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DY1F2CS?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DY1F2CS?psc=1&redirect=t... http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008AOH1O6?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008AOH1O6?psc=1&redirect=t... Sure, purists will argue the EV20 is worth every penny. But pre's like the aphex have gotten so good that they've made the gains from a high-end source mic worth a lot less, if anything.
- jacquesm 11y ago
  Thanks for that. I really hate the sound of my own voice when I hear a recording back. The only microphone I did not have that with was an AKG that was priced way out of the ballpark and it needed an equally expensive pre-amp to go with it. Nice to see a reasonably affordable ($200 is still quite a bit of money) alternative.
- DrScump 11y ago
  What do you think of this review? https://fizzle.co/sparkline/podcast-high-quality-microphone-shootout https://fizzle.co/sparkline/podcast-high-quality-microphone-...
- 11y ago
ivan_ah 11y ago
Very informative writup about a platform I had only heard of before. Some comments on book publishers: > A book publisher will happily give you better margins > No. If, an author makes 5% royalties on their book sales they're really lucky! Mainstream publishers must make a cut, so they'll only fork out a tiny percentage of the profits, which is a tiny percentage of the wholesale price, which is 45% of the list price (standard wholesale discount). So 12% royalties, is really like 4-5% of profits, and if the book is sold with extra discount, we're dropping into the 2-3% range. > than that AND print you high quality hard cover books > while bending the world to sell it for you in the process. > More no. They'll put the book in a few catalogues, and maybe make a flyer or two. No world bending stuff.
devonoel 11y ago
Udemy's getting absolutely slammed today on HN. I wonder if they're paying attention.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
kkt262 11y ago
Udemy is a TERRIBLE platform. I'm surprised that so many instructors consent to putting their stuff on there. It's so much better to just have your content on your own hosted solution or Teachable (previously Fedora). Looks like there's a lot of room to innovate in this space.

293 points by baobaba 11y ago

I can empathize with you. You don't need to go on the attack/defense, you need to move and regroup your forces. I don't see how you stand to benefit from writing a negative article. The problem is no one knows who you are. The first thing we hear is you attacking Udemy from a defensive posture. If you're going to present yourself to the world, I think the best way to do so is to show them who you really are. Tell your story. So how about we take this off the front page, then make a new post about how great your tutorials are, what value they bring... and starting immediately, they can stripe/paypal you and buy them from your website for the best experience. You can put up a paypal button now and email the videos by hand. Since you made a flask SAAS tutorial - you will probably be able to have a full video site up in a week or two.

alexandros 11y ago
You appear to believe the author is making a global appeal and has deliberately put this on the HN front page. Please remember that this is the author's personal blog, the readers there probably know who this is, and some of them shared the link which made it here. Take the content for what it's worth, spare the author the patronising lecture.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- anon6_ 11y ago
  I disagree with the approach heartily. It's hard to think big picture when you yourself feel or have been spurned. Even lawyers hire lawyers. This is a public post the whole world can read. It's now publicly exposed to thousands of readers. Most of which don't know him and are now getting a first impression. This doesn't put him in a position to gain anything. Even if his critique of udemy went viral and was taken in the most positive way, his reputation as a programmer and video content producer is damaged since he's seen as a spurned advocate. This is why Europa is so stoked on the "right to be forgotten". So many times we see a person who has dreams, but their temporary disagreement and power struggle personally ends up damaging their reputation. They are cast aside as trouble makers, and when it comes down to the decision of whether you want to work with someone, people's biases will tend to pick someone who won't potentially cause a stir. Their "15 minutes of fame" deafens future attempts at them building their identity and reputation in the field they want.
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    You're way off base. The author is free to do as he pleases and it's none of your business to tell him to retract his article. Anonymous cowards aplenty on the internet, anonymous cowards dictating what can and can not be discussed and what should be retracted is a bit much don't you think? I got a pretty positive first impression of the author, he's capable, he outlined his griefs, did so after actually spending considerable time to use the product, is balanced because he sees both the good and the bad. If I were in Udemy's shoes I'd love to receive feedback like this and I'd do what I could to address his very reasonable points. Oh, and this is not why Europe has a 'right to be forgotten'. Everything you've written actually applies to your own comments here, but since your anonymous you don't care about that either way but I though that was kind of funny. In short: OP's reputation is doing just fine.
    - anon6_ 11y ago
      Giving suggestions isn't dictating. That's what comments are for. He spent considerable amount of time which, in my opinion, would be better spent creating something superior. To reiterate, I empathize with his grievances. Outlining them doesn't serve to bolster the legitimacy of his brand or sell videos. If the intention is to get the pitchforks and sick them on Udemy, I also think I'm correct in pouring cold water on that too. I truly see things differently, I don't want an end game where mobbing and shaming - I want to key people coding and making things. He says he creates tutorials on SAAS platforms, yet he himself gives a critique to udemy on their site's performance and practices? To people's perceptions, that may send a conflicting message. Let's see this another way, author launches his own video website using his SAAS Flask skills and talents.
      - jacquesm 11y ago
        > He spent considerable amount of time which, in my opinion, would be better spent creating something superior. You decide what you want to do with your life, the author gets to decide what to do with theirs. It's not your call to make. > To reiterate, I empathize with his grievances. Outlining them doesn't serve to bolster the legitimacy of his brand or sell videos. To you. > If the intention is to get the pitchforks and sick them on Udemy, I also think I'm correct in pouring cold water on that too. I didn't see any pitchforks. Just a very detailed end-user report detailing a bunch of issues with an online service, provided free of charge. > I truly see things differently, I don't want an end game where mobbing and shaming - I want to key people coding and making things. Good, so go code stuff and make stuff. You're not doing either here you're telling someone to stop making stuff (writing is making stuff). > He says he creates tutorials on SAAS platforms, yet he himself gives a critique to udemy on their site's performance and practices? Who better than someone that has the experience? > To people's perceptions, that may send a conflicting message. HN is a pretty smart bunch I don't think we need you to interpret the message for us, we're quite capable of thinking for ourselves here. > Let's see this another way, author launches his own video website using his SAAS Flask skills and talents. He just might, time will tell. But at least he gave Udemy the benefit of his experience for which they are no doubt grateful.
- blazespin 11y ago
  Actually, the author posted the link on HN in another HN thread.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
- nickjj 11y ago
  Blog author here. The beginning of the article praises Udemy's student experience. Trust me, I'm not a competitor to them. If I were, I would have just hosted my course on my own platform without even thinking about Udemy.
  - sukulaku 11y ago
    For what it's worth, I thought the article was well written and useful.
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    You're doing just fine. I'd suggest you polish your own platform use it to showcase what it can do and charge a fee if others want to use it as a service. Competition is good for everybody, both the users, the course makers and eventually for the companies because it keeps them sharp.
  - tangled_zans 11y ago
    great article, lots of good insights!

mr_luc 11y ago

Wow! To some people, that article is going to seem like nit-picking, and insofar as it affects most people, it may be. But my feeling on reading this article is gratitude. Thanks for writing it. It's good for Udemy. If their business practices end up costing some content creators 87.5% of list price, then it's because the evil and/or lazy forces in the company have gained ground, and this kind of sunshine may weaken them. It's good for content creators. It's good for consumers. As a potential customer of courses like yours, I was discouraged at seeing their incentivization of cheaper, spammier courses. Why? Because even if education is turned into a product, it's is still a "buy-it-for-life" product where quality matters, and quality is the only metric I (and probably many of Udemy's shoppers!) really care about. Anything that could result in less noise/spam in their signal is appreciated. It'll be interesting to see how Udemy responds.

grogenaut 11y ago

takeaway: break you lessons up into $5 (to you) chunks and the let them go on sale for $10.

anderspitman 11y ago

The author raised $12,451 USD from 13 backers for a Flask course? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nickjj/build-a-saas-app-with-flask-and-deploy-it-with-doc?ref=nav_search https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/nickjj/build-a-saas-app... Maybe I'm in the wrong line of work.

stephengillie 11y ago
The great majority of that came from 2 backers, who also received these services: - I will do a case study on your app and it will be featured on the project's website. - 1 hour remote consulting session to help you get unstuck with the project. - E-mail support within reason. - Both screencast series. - A PDF cheatsheet of all of the tasks and deploy commands you can run. - A Flask sticker that you can place anywhere! So essentially they paid a few grand for a Flask course, decent support package (1 hour live support, unlimited email support), some videos and swag.
- logicallee 11y ago
  wait, wait, wait on your third point - a whole hour for each of all two backers you mention?
  - tymekpavel 11y ago
    I think I detect sarcasm? That seems like a fairly reasonable rate.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
mr_luc 11y ago
While that obviously works out to a surprising amount from each individual, if the author really spent two months putting the course together, well ... it wouldn't be particularly well-paid client work for a contractor in the Bay Area.
- 11y ago

pg_is_a_butt 11y ago

what is a udemy?

listic 11y ago

I don't know if it's an open course hosting platform, but there's http://02geek.com/ http://02geek.com/

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

mmaunder 11y ago

As someone who has been doing screencasts with voice, I can tell you the mic is really important. If you use a headset, even a good one, you can generally hear the spit swishing around in your mouth. It's awful. A buddy runs a pro recording studio and recommended Aphex Microphone X. I haven't looked back. Aphex makes amazing pro microphone preamps that are pricey. They launched something called Microphone X which has a compressor and a "big bottom" feature that were previously only in their high end pro gear. It's quite affordable - about $200 compared to an EV RE20 broadcaster mic for $600. It's a USB mic, so you don't need a preamp or digi interface. You just plug it into your computer and you're all set. I use it with a boom stand and pop filter. I love them so much I use them for everything including skype calls. What this does is negate the changes in volume as you get closer or further from the mic (compressor). Add some nice radio bass to your voice with the big bottom effect. And generally give you a pro quality mic with a USB interface. Here are all three: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B73OJT2?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00B73OJT2?psc=1&redirect=t... http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DY1F2CS?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DY1F2CS?psc=1&redirect=t... http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008AOH1O6?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_search_detailpage http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008AOH1O6?psc=1&redirect=t... Sure, purists will argue the EV20 is worth every penny. But pre's like the aphex have gotten so good that they've made the gains from a high-end source mic worth a lot less, if anything.

jacquesm 11y ago
Thanks for that. I really hate the sound of my own voice when I hear a recording back. The only microphone I did not have that with was an AKG that was priced way out of the ballpark and it needed an equally expensive pre-amp to go with it. Nice to see a reasonably affordable ($200 is still quite a bit of money) alternative.
DrScump 11y ago
What do you think of this review? https://fizzle.co/sparkline/podcast-high-quality-microphone-shootout https://fizzle.co/sparkline/podcast-high-quality-microphone-...
11y ago

ivan_ah 11y ago

Very informative writup about a platform I had only heard of before. Some comments on book publishers: > A book publisher will happily give you better margins > No. If, an author makes 5% royalties on their book sales they're really lucky! Mainstream publishers must make a cut, so they'll only fork out a tiny percentage of the profits, which is a tiny percentage of the wholesale price, which is 45% of the list price (standard wholesale discount). So 12% royalties, is really like 4-5% of profits, and if the book is sold with extra discount, we're dropping into the 2-3% range. > than that AND print you high quality hard cover books > while bending the world to sell it for you in the process. > More no. They'll put the book in a few catalogues, and maybe make a flyer or two. No world bending stuff.

devonoel 11y ago

Udemy's getting absolutely slammed today on HN. I wonder if they're paying attention.

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

kkt262 11y ago

Udemy is a TERRIBLE platform. I'm surprised that so many instructors consent to putting their stuff on there. It's so much better to just have your content on your own hosted solution or Teachable (previously Fedora). Looks like there's a lot of room to innovate in this space.