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I wish down-voters would take a moment to explain why they think a $5 crippled computer is better than a $39 full-featured board. The context is that, in order

I wish down-voters would take a moment to explain why they think a $5 crippled computer is better than a $39 full-featured board. The context is that, in order to make use of the $5 crippled computer you have to spend, at a minimum, $100 in a keyboard, mouse monitor and power adapter. I'm sure someone will say you can build little sprinkler system controllers and LED light blinkers and all all manner of other little projects. Well, here's the problem: Why aren't we teaching our kids to do just that with little $0.50 microcontrollers? Why do we need a HUGE operating system running a gigahertz to teach or build the simplest things? Here's a over 1,000 microcontrollers from $0.55 upwards with peripherals ranging from CAN, I2C, SPI, UART, USB, USB-OTG, A/D, D/A, Timers, Counters, PWM, WDT, Motor Control, LCD, etc. http://goo.gl/Lc5gP6 http://goo.gl/Lc5gP6 What I see on my end, working with lots of kids, are a bunch of Pi's being bought only to collect dust. The idea of a super-cheap computer on a bubblegum stick might be interesting and heart-warming but the reality I see is that the vast majority of them are bought because of the novelty factor and they set aside and ignored. I've had far more success with the kids by adopting a simple little 8 bit microprocessor and then teaching them how to do all kinds of interesting things with them in assembler at first and C later. Their eyes and minds really open up and they gain an understanding that simply cannot be had by having a bubblegum computer with Linux that comes up to a command prompt. Worlds apart. And, oh, yes, none of my kids will ever be confused about pointers, stacks, memory management and a whole host of topics that confuse those who's first contact with computing is running Python on a stick computer of some sort...to turn on a sprinklers valve using a bunch of libraries and megabytes of coder running on a GHz processor. It's a lot more work as a mentor, but if you really care about the kids and want them to learn and engage their brains, you can't throw a "done for you" solution at them.

walterbell 11y ago
Bravo. Even more infantilizing are the electronic kits from http://littlebits.cc http://littlebits.cc.
- rebootthesystem 11y ago
  The weak link is always curriculum. Without a "plan" and mentorship kids learn very little. Sure, they can follow step by step instructions, click things together but they are learning very little. Most kids learn nothing about strength of mechanical shapes by clicking together lego blocks. However, a curriculum that explicitly teaches how different structural shapes behave under various loads does teach them a lot. Ergo, the vast majority of kids only learn so much by following lego assembly instructions kit after kit. That's not to say that these toys are not useful. They are. What I am pushing back against is that the cost of the educational toy or tool is directly related to the level of learning it can provide. BTW, I do think that "little bits" can be useful with the right curriculum. Yet, we are talking about $200 again. This only strengthens my argument that a dive for the bottom it utterly meaningless when it comes to delivering usable value, either for education or for other applications. In the case of poor countries or really poor people, yes, of course, lower cost could be the difference between access and no access. Yet, that's not the whole story because they need to spend at least $100 to play. Is that the primary argument and mission of the various Pi boards? To serve the poor? Because, if it is, then I'd like to understand why it uses a video interface that requires fairly recent monitor that will cost somewhere around $80 and $100 in the US. Anyone who can spend that kind of money can afford something much better than a Pi. And far more useful... Something like this: http://goo.gl/QnkvrS http://goo.gl/QnkvrS or this: http://goo.gl/Mrgatw http://goo.gl/Mrgatw Most Pi's end-up off in a corner collecting dust or in landfills. They are neat, but I have yet to find them useful. They are not the best financial investment in terms of education. And they are certainly not good enough to be used in commercial or industrial systems. I think their popularity is more of an emotional reaction than a rational decision. You can buy a fully functional Windows laptop for $100. And, if want to run Linux you can dual boot or install a VM. I just don't see it. And I am talking out of experience with kids from ages 9 up to 17.
  - walterbell 11y ago
    Do you recommend any sources on kid-friendly electronics curriculum development, either for homeschooling or as a hobby?
    - 11y ago

walterbell 11y ago

Bravo. Even more infantilizing are the electronic kits from http://littlebits.cc http://littlebits.cc.

rebootthesystem 11y ago
The weak link is always curriculum. Without a "plan" and mentorship kids learn very little. Sure, they can follow step by step instructions, click things together but they are learning very little. Most kids learn nothing about strength of mechanical shapes by clicking together lego blocks. However, a curriculum that explicitly teaches how different structural shapes behave under various loads does teach them a lot. Ergo, the vast majority of kids only learn so much by following lego assembly instructions kit after kit. That's not to say that these toys are not useful. They are. What I am pushing back against is that the cost of the educational toy or tool is directly related to the level of learning it can provide. BTW, I do think that "little bits" can be useful with the right curriculum. Yet, we are talking about $200 again. This only strengthens my argument that a dive for the bottom it utterly meaningless when it comes to delivering usable value, either for education or for other applications. In the case of poor countries or really poor people, yes, of course, lower cost could be the difference between access and no access. Yet, that's not the whole story because they need to spend at least $100 to play. Is that the primary argument and mission of the various Pi boards? To serve the poor? Because, if it is, then I'd like to understand why it uses a video interface that requires fairly recent monitor that will cost somewhere around $80 and $100 in the US. Anyone who can spend that kind of money can afford something much better than a Pi. And far more useful... Something like this: http://goo.gl/QnkvrS http://goo.gl/QnkvrS or this: http://goo.gl/Mrgatw http://goo.gl/Mrgatw Most Pi's end-up off in a corner collecting dust or in landfills. They are neat, but I have yet to find them useful. They are not the best financial investment in terms of education. And they are certainly not good enough to be used in commercial or industrial systems. I think their popularity is more of an emotional reaction than a rational decision. You can buy a fully functional Windows laptop for $100. And, if want to run Linux you can dual boot or install a VM. I just don't see it. And I am talking out of experience with kids from ages 9 up to 17.
- walterbell 11y ago
  Do you recommend any sources on kid-friendly electronics curriculum development, either for homeschooling or as a hobby?
  - 11y ago