6 ms·

W – A simple programming language

56 points by networked 11y ago

reacweb 11y ago
According to http://gtello.pagesperso-orange.fr/hp200lx_f.htm http://gtello.pagesperso-orange.fr/hp200lx_f.htm turbo pascal works very well on HP 200LX.
- timonoko 11y ago
  Everything works on HP200LX. Except Emacs, but there was some C-script-based Emacs, which was OK. I think had Smalltalk and serial mouse at one time, as an extreme example. HP200LX was my only computer 1993-1995, if I wanted to see some color pictures I went to see library computer. It was my travelling companion for 20 years upto 2010, mostly as an E-book reader.
vorg 11y ago
I particularly like the keywordlessness of W's syntax. Virtually every other language divides identifiers into 2 arbitrarily defined classes: the somewhere from 20 to 100 special identifiers that mustn't be used, and all the others that can be used by the programmer. Because W's syntax uses punctuation and symbols for all its functionality, the programmer doesn't need to either remember which 50-ish identifiers not to ever use, or have a special IDE-like task running in the background to gives prompts whenever it detects an illegal identifier use. Very clean syntax!
- arethuza 11y ago
  I agree it's an interesting approach - but there is still a separation into two classes of lexical tokens: those made up of letters and numbers and those made from punctuation and other "special" characters.
- hacker_9 11y ago
  ..sorry but this is a non-problem. If you insist on not using an IDE, then the compiler will still catch any keyword clashes as errors. Also most languages use contextual keywords so it's even less of a problem.
  - sdegutis 11y ago
    Right. I think I've never wanted to name a variable "if".
    - paulddraper 11y ago
      But what about old, current, and new? Or int? Or class? There is more then one project out there with klass.
      - Retra 11y ago
        I name variables 'old', 'current', and 'new' all the time. Just not in C++/Java. And why would you want to name a variable 'int'?
        paulddraper 11y ago
        Or in JS. Or in C#. That covers a lot of the big ones. Perhaps you should name your language, so I can provide better examples.
        Retra 11y ago
        Examples of what? Ways to name variables so they look like keywords? I don't need your help with that. Even if I used a language that used keywords like 'ssalc' and 'wen', you could contrive some reason to be upset that you can't use those words in your code. The advantage offered by keywords is readability, and it comes at the expense of your ability to use those words for other purposes. If that's unacceptable, then your priorities are probably misplaced. Plus, you can always use a grammar that distinguishes between keyword rules and variable rules, and you'll never have any unambiguity. Even if popular languages don't do this, that's not a general problem for computer languages.
        paulddraper 11y ago
        > Ways to name variables so they look like keywords? I don't need your help with that. Oh good. My comment was in response to someone who doubt keywords would ever make good variable names (e.g. class). > you can always use a grammar that distinguishes between keyword rules and variable rules, and you'll never have any unambiguity. Yes, that is nice. And that's what W does. As an ancestor comment said, kudos for a "clean syntax"! (NOTE: there are alternatives, e.g. Scala's backticks. But W's choice is a good one.)
- srpeck 11y ago
  See also k (http://kparc.com/k.txt http://kparc.com/k.txt) for keywordlessness, though a few keywords are added for kdb database functions. Excerpt: 20 primitives/verbs, 6 operators/adverbs and 3 system functions. 1 control structure($) - rarely used - and no reserved words.
talideon 11y ago
Vaguely related (due to the similar naming): https://github.com/catseye/Specs-on-Spec/blob/master/star-w/star-w.markdown https://github.com/catseye/Specs-on-Spec/blob/master/star-w/...
Svip 11y ago
I think he needs to update his grammar.[0] The definition of program does not allow for anything but definitions (i.e. declarations), except in blocks (see compound-expression). So his examples in his tutorials[1] do not conform to the grammar described, e.g. conditional expressions. [0] https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/51-w-syntax-specifications https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/... [1] https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/50-w-a-brief-tutorial https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/...
mdjt 11y ago
We've almost run out of single letter programming language names!
- dagw 11y ago
  Assuming Wikipedia is up to date, we still have: A (there is however a A+ langugae),H,I,L,N,O,P,U,V,X,Y and Z left
  - taylorfausak 11y ago
    I know of a tiny language called Z: http://chrisdone.com/z/ http://chrisdone.com/z/
AstroJetson 11y ago
Interesting that he's making things to run on his HP200LX. I (still) have a Zeos Pocket PC that I used daily for about 2 years. MSDOS and MS-Works was my world. Ahh, good times... http://www.oldcomputers.net/zeos-ppc.html http://www.oldcomputers.net/zeos-ppc.html
d_theorist 11y ago
>So why would anyone in his right mind would create a whole new programming language? Isn't BASIC or C++ good enough already? Ha ha ha!

56 points by networked 11y ago

According to http://gtello.pagesperso-orange.fr/hp200lx_f.htm http://gtello.pagesperso-orange.fr/hp200lx_f.htm turbo pascal works very well on HP 200LX.

timonoko 11y ago
Everything works on HP200LX. Except Emacs, but there was some C-script-based Emacs, which was OK. I think had Smalltalk and serial mouse at one time, as an extreme example. HP200LX was my only computer 1993-1995, if I wanted to see some color pictures I went to see library computer. It was my travelling companion for 20 years upto 2010, mostly as an E-book reader.

vorg 11y ago

I particularly like the keywordlessness of W's syntax. Virtually every other language divides identifiers into 2 arbitrarily defined classes: the somewhere from 20 to 100 special identifiers that mustn't be used, and all the others that can be used by the programmer. Because W's syntax uses punctuation and symbols for all its functionality, the programmer doesn't need to either remember which 50-ish identifiers not to ever use, or have a special IDE-like task running in the background to gives prompts whenever it detects an illegal identifier use. Very clean syntax!

arethuza 11y ago
I agree it's an interesting approach - but there is still a separation into two classes of lexical tokens: those made up of letters and numbers and those made from punctuation and other "special" characters.
hacker_9 11y ago
..sorry but this is a non-problem. If you insist on not using an IDE, then the compiler will still catch any keyword clashes as errors. Also most languages use contextual keywords so it's even less of a problem.
- sdegutis 11y ago
  Right. I think I've never wanted to name a variable "if".
  - paulddraper 11y ago
    But what about old, current, and new? Or int? Or class? There is more then one project out there with klass.
    - Retra 11y ago
      I name variables 'old', 'current', and 'new' all the time. Just not in C++/Java. And why would you want to name a variable 'int'?
      - paulddraper 11y ago
        Or in JS. Or in C#. That covers a lot of the big ones. Perhaps you should name your language, so I can provide better examples.
        Retra 11y ago
        Examples of what? Ways to name variables so they look like keywords? I don't need your help with that. Even if I used a language that used keywords like 'ssalc' and 'wen', you could contrive some reason to be upset that you can't use those words in your code. The advantage offered by keywords is readability, and it comes at the expense of your ability to use those words for other purposes. If that's unacceptable, then your priorities are probably misplaced. Plus, you can always use a grammar that distinguishes between keyword rules and variable rules, and you'll never have any unambiguity. Even if popular languages don't do this, that's not a general problem for computer languages.
        paulddraper 11y ago
        > Ways to name variables so they look like keywords? I don't need your help with that. Oh good. My comment was in response to someone who doubt keywords would ever make good variable names (e.g. class). > you can always use a grammar that distinguishes between keyword rules and variable rules, and you'll never have any unambiguity. Yes, that is nice. And that's what W does. As an ancestor comment said, kudos for a "clean syntax"! (NOTE: there are alternatives, e.g. Scala's backticks. But W's choice is a good one.)
srpeck 11y ago
See also k (http://kparc.com/k.txt http://kparc.com/k.txt) for keywordlessness, though a few keywords are added for kdb database functions. Excerpt: 20 primitives/verbs, 6 operators/adverbs and 3 system functions. 1 control structure($) - rarely used - and no reserved words.

talideon 11y ago

Vaguely related (due to the similar naming): https://github.com/catseye/Specs-on-Spec/blob/master/star-w/star-w.markdown https://github.com/catseye/Specs-on-Spec/blob/master/star-w/...

Svip 11y ago

I think he needs to update his grammar.[0] The definition of program does not allow for anything but definitions (i.e. declarations), except in blocks (see compound-expression). So his examples in his tutorials[1] do not conform to the grammar described, e.g. conditional expressions. [0] https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/51-w-syntax-specifications https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/... [1] https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/50-w-a-brief-tutorial https://www.vttoth.com/CMS/index.php/projects/14-w-compiler/...

mdjt 11y ago

We've almost run out of single letter programming language names!

dagw 11y ago
Assuming Wikipedia is up to date, we still have: A (there is however a A+ langugae),H,I,L,N,O,P,U,V,X,Y and Z left
- taylorfausak 11y ago
  I know of a tiny language called Z: http://chrisdone.com/z/ http://chrisdone.com/z/

AstroJetson 11y ago

Interesting that he's making things to run on his HP200LX. I (still) have a Zeos Pocket PC that I used daily for about 2 years. MSDOS and MS-Works was my world. Ahh, good times... http://www.oldcomputers.net/zeos-ppc.html http://www.oldcomputers.net/zeos-ppc.html

d_theorist 11y ago

>So why would anyone in his right mind would create a whole new programming language? Isn't BASIC or C++ good enough already? Ha ha ha!