5 ms·

A spyware? Come on. To my experience it was the clear advantage on the design, security and speed (launch and JS speed). It was way ahead of Firefox or IE. I of

by afsina 11y ago

A spyware? Come on. To my experience it was the clear advantage on the design, security and speed (launch and JS speed). It was way ahead of Firefox or IE. I often asked people why they use Chrome they say it feels faster and not cluttered. Sure commercials helped but IMO, it was the word of mouth made it that popular.

josteink 11y ago
Again: When you bundle it as a unwanted drive-by install and steal users' data, it's hard to not call something spyware.
- afsina 11y ago
  >'steal users data' Please. Aren't we all tired of this?
  - josteink 11y ago
    If you download and install App A because you want App A, but unasked App B also gets installed as a paid-for drive-by installation which sets itself as your new default browser, which upon first launch (because its now default) imports all your data, history, bookmarks and passwords from your actual preferred browser and then proceeds to send all this data to App B's vendor without making it clear to you what just happened... How is that not stealing? How is that different from what we usually call spyware? There is nothing legitimate about how Chrome has hijacked a multitude of users' PCs and their data. There's no way to defend this behaviour.
    - yuhong 11y ago
      "proceeds to send all this data to App B's vendor" Proof?
      - josteink 11y ago
        It's called "sync" and you can bet everyone who has a Gmail account who gets asked to "log into Google" when Chrome is opened (as their new default browser) will enter their username and password without giving a second thought to it or realizing what they just authorized. That's ofcourse if they even noticed that their browser now looks slightly different at all. Voila. Data stolen. Or are you going to argue that this represents completely concentfull and legitimately syncing?
        yuhong 11y ago
        It is entirely optional, and don't fit normal definitions of "spyware".
        josteink 11y ago
        You mistakenly assume this feature which by default requests your google login for sync will be understood by users as this, when they open their browser and see "Log into google". Much more likely is that your casual user will think they're logging into Gmail. This is a dark UX anti-pattern, using the same technique as a regular scammer or phishing site. Google is absolutely, horrifyingly into evil territory here.
        yuhong 11y ago
        I think what Win8.1 does with pushing you to use MS accounts during OOBE is a much worse dark pattern than this.
        Excavator 11y ago
        "I think hanging someone is worse than just giving them poison." I don't particularly care about this spyware debate but I can't see how something bad being better than something else bad bears any relevance unless we are talking about choosing between two bad options.
        rmc 11y ago
    - Oletros 11y ago
      > which upon first launch (because its now default) imports all your data, history, bookmarks and passwords from your actual preferred browser Any source showing that it is put as default browser and imports everything without asking?
  - ionised 11y ago
    I am tired of them stealing user data, yes.
- pippy 11y ago
  According to wikipedia Google Chrome bundles: Randomly generated token included in installer. Used to measure success rate of Google Chrome once at installation.[99] Encoded string, according to Google, contains non-identifying information about where Chrome was downloaded from and its installation week, and is used to measure promotional campaigns.[99] Google provides the source code to decode this string.[95] On Google search query On first launch and first use of address bar[99] Optional. Unique identifier along with user preferences, logs of usage metrics and crashes. default disabled Text typed into the address bar. Optional Information about how often Chrome is used, details about the OS and Chrome version. used on update None of these things are "Stealing users data". From what I can see, you have to go out of your way to even send usage metrics and crashes to Google. All of these tracking metrics are similar, if not identical, to what other major browsers are currently doing.
  - josteink 11y ago
    I think you misunderstand me. See comment thread here for classification: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10631843 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10631843
pcwalton 11y ago
> speed (launch and JS speed). It was way ahead of Firefox or IE. By the time V8 shipped, SpiderMonkey's TraceMonkey (and not long thereafter JaegerMonkey) was pretty competitive. There were differences between the engines—TraceMonkey fell off fast paths more often while V8 sans Crankshaft had fewer optimizations for tight loops—but they weren't night and day differences. This is all history, of course. Nowadays, V8 and SpiderMonkey have essentially the same architecture (although as I understand things SpiderMonkey is more unified with the IonMonkey JIT core powering both Baseline and Ion, whereas Crankshaft and non-Crankshaft V8 are more divergent).

by afsina 11y ago

josteink 11y ago

Again: When you bundle it as a unwanted drive-by install and steal users' data, it's hard to not call something spyware.

afsina 11y ago
>'steal users data' Please. Aren't we all tired of this?
- josteink 11y ago
  If you download and install App A because you want App A, but unasked App B also gets installed as a paid-for drive-by installation which sets itself as your new default browser, which upon first launch (because its now default) imports all your data, history, bookmarks and passwords from your actual preferred browser and then proceeds to send all this data to App B's vendor without making it clear to you what just happened... How is that not stealing? How is that different from what we usually call spyware? There is nothing legitimate about how Chrome has hijacked a multitude of users' PCs and their data. There's no way to defend this behaviour.
  - yuhong 11y ago
    "proceeds to send all this data to App B's vendor" Proof?
    - josteink 11y ago
      It's called "sync" and you can bet everyone who has a Gmail account who gets asked to "log into Google" when Chrome is opened (as their new default browser) will enter their username and password without giving a second thought to it or realizing what they just authorized. That's ofcourse if they even noticed that their browser now looks slightly different at all. Voila. Data stolen. Or are you going to argue that this represents completely concentfull and legitimately syncing?
      - yuhong 11y ago
        It is entirely optional, and don't fit normal definitions of "spyware".
        josteink 11y ago
        You mistakenly assume this feature which by default requests your google login for sync will be understood by users as this, when they open their browser and see "Log into google". Much more likely is that your casual user will think they're logging into Gmail. This is a dark UX anti-pattern, using the same technique as a regular scammer or phishing site. Google is absolutely, horrifyingly into evil territory here.
        yuhong 11y ago
        I think what Win8.1 does with pushing you to use MS accounts during OOBE is a much worse dark pattern than this.
        Excavator 11y ago
        "I think hanging someone is worse than just giving them poison." I don't particularly care about this spyware debate but I can't see how something bad being better than something else bad bears any relevance unless we are talking about choosing between two bad options.
        rmc 11y ago
  - Oletros 11y ago
    > which upon first launch (because its now default) imports all your data, history, bookmarks and passwords from your actual preferred browser Any source showing that it is put as default browser and imports everything without asking?
- ionised 11y ago
  I am tired of them stealing user data, yes.
pippy 11y ago
According to wikipedia Google Chrome bundles: Randomly generated token included in installer. Used to measure success rate of Google Chrome once at installation.[99] Encoded string, according to Google, contains non-identifying information about where Chrome was downloaded from and its installation week, and is used to measure promotional campaigns.[99] Google provides the source code to decode this string.[95] On Google search query On first launch and first use of address bar[99] Optional. Unique identifier along with user preferences, logs of usage metrics and crashes. default disabled Text typed into the address bar. Optional Information about how often Chrome is used, details about the OS and Chrome version. used on update None of these things are "Stealing users data". From what I can see, you have to go out of your way to even send usage metrics and crashes to Google. All of these tracking metrics are similar, if not identical, to what other major browsers are currently doing.
- josteink 11y ago
  I think you misunderstand me. See comment thread here for classification: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10631843 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10631843

pcwalton 11y ago

> speed (launch and JS speed). It was way ahead of Firefox or IE. By the time V8 shipped, SpiderMonkey's TraceMonkey (and not long thereafter JaegerMonkey) was pretty competitive. There were differences between the engines—TraceMonkey fell off fast paths more often while V8 sans Crankshaft had fewer optimizations for tight loops—but they weren't night and day differences. This is all history, of course. Nowadays, V8 and SpiderMonkey have essentially the same architecture (although as I understand things SpiderMonkey is more unified with the IonMonkey JIT core powering both Baseline and Ion, whereas Crankshaft and non-Crankshaft V8 are more divergent).