4 ms·

I stopped using Yelp and uninstalled it from my iPhone when I read the article last year. Yelp's business model doesn't sit well with me. Even if the allegatio

I stopped using Yelp and uninstalled it from my iPhone when I read the article last year. Yelp's business model doesn't sit well with me. Even if the allegations of good reviews disappearing for businesses who don't pay up aren't true, the idea that there is a service out there that you don't want but you're almost forced into paying for since it's affecting your business directly feels to me like paying the mafia to 'protect' your business. If Yelp really does want to help both businesses and consumers, give businesses the ability to respond to reviews for free and don't artificially alter results, be like Google and let your algorithm work. Make money selling ads. It reminds me of the whole GetSatisfaction drama with 37 Signals from a few months ago (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=540540 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=540540). This type of business model where you provide a business a "service" they didn't ask for then try to charge them for it will never go over well. [Edit] FWIW this page, found below in relme's comment (http://www.yelp.com/myths http://www.yelp.com/myths) directly answers every one of my concerns with Yelp. If it's true then great, sounds like they're doing things well. I find it hard to write off all the complaints as fictional though.

chaosprophet 17y ago
So are there any similar services which do offer business owners a chance to respond for free? If not, wouldn't this be a good opportunity for a startup? You could probably advertise yourself as the 'dont-be-evil' version of yelp.
- markerdmann 17y ago
  This is basically the project I started working on a few weeks ago. If anyone is interested in getting together on this, feel free to get in touch (my email address is in my profile). I'm a programmer located in the Mission district of San Francisco. It would be a nice to have a Craigslist or Wikipedia-style Yelp (fast, lightweight, and non-evil).
- wonlove 17y ago
  Yelp doesn't charge biz owners to respond to reviews, in public or in private. I'm pretty sure about this because I built the feature.
  - markerdmann 17y ago
    The source of the negative sentiment may boil down to the cold calling. It seems to be one of those things that just hits a nerve, and I wouldn't be surprised if you could trace the anti-Yelp movement to this business practice. The other thing people complain about a lot is that their reviews aren't counted (presumably because of the anti-spam filter). If Yelp fixes those two major problems, it will be in much better shape.
  - chaosprophet 17y ago
    My bad, my bad, what I should have said was something that allows businesses to opt-out of the service.
    - wonlove 17y ago
      you want a business with poor consumer reviews to be able to delist itself? Isn't that like being able to delete your case record with the Better Business Bureau?
poutine 17y ago
I seriously doubt good reviews would just disappear. The reviewer would complain. I'm a Yelp Elite in my city and I'd scream murder if any of my reviews disappeared.
- zzzmarcus 17y ago
  See timcederman's post below. Reviews can, and do disappear apparently. Yelp admits the "spam algorithm" can be aggressive on new reviewers. >>"[The] spam algorithm can filter based on how established user is. [Your post was] not deleted & can re-appear on biz page. Still live on your profile." It sounds fishy to me. Who cares if the review is "still live on your profile" if it's not live on the business page. It doesn't sound like a spam filter to me, it sounds like selective removal of reviews.
  - poutine 17y ago
    There's a lot of spammers on Yelp. I have no problem with this on new users as businesses will often post reviews of themselves to drive up traffic.
    - pyre 17y ago
      But why not tell the user that it was flagged as spam and/or delete it from their profile page? Why let the user believe that their review is still there when it isn't? Maybe this is a way to fool the spammers into believing that their spamming is working, but it really is a poor experience for legitimate users, no?
- gsmaverick 17y ago
  They may show your review to you but not others.
  - tumult 17y ago
    Bingo. Ever try logging out, clearing cookies and then looking at a view again?
newhouseb 17y ago
> "give businesses the ability to respond to reviews for free and " Yelp has had the ability for businesses to respond publicly or privately to a review for almost a year now I believe. > "don't artificially alter results, be like Google and let your algorithm work." The same game happens in the web search world - it's called SEO. Yelp's spam algorithm is decoupled from any advertising, yet since business owners don't write their own reviews, they have less control over their reputation (as opposed to webmasters who change their page content), and are much more likely to come up with conspiracy theories as to why things happen the way they do and consequently often get very frustrated.
city41 17y ago
The fact that myths page even exists at all, with 9 rather damning myths, is enough of a red flag.

chaosprophet 17y ago

So are there any similar services which do offer business owners a chance to respond for free? If not, wouldn't this be a good opportunity for a startup? You could probably advertise yourself as the 'dont-be-evil' version of yelp.

markerdmann 17y ago
This is basically the project I started working on a few weeks ago. If anyone is interested in getting together on this, feel free to get in touch (my email address is in my profile). I'm a programmer located in the Mission district of San Francisco. It would be a nice to have a Craigslist or Wikipedia-style Yelp (fast, lightweight, and non-evil).
wonlove 17y ago
Yelp doesn't charge biz owners to respond to reviews, in public or in private. I'm pretty sure about this because I built the feature.
- markerdmann 17y ago
  The source of the negative sentiment may boil down to the cold calling. It seems to be one of those things that just hits a nerve, and I wouldn't be surprised if you could trace the anti-Yelp movement to this business practice. The other thing people complain about a lot is that their reviews aren't counted (presumably because of the anti-spam filter). If Yelp fixes those two major problems, it will be in much better shape.
- chaosprophet 17y ago
  My bad, my bad, what I should have said was something that allows businesses to opt-out of the service.
  - wonlove 17y ago
    you want a business with poor consumer reviews to be able to delist itself? Isn't that like being able to delete your case record with the Better Business Bureau?

poutine 17y ago

I seriously doubt good reviews would just disappear. The reviewer would complain. I'm a Yelp Elite in my city and I'd scream murder if any of my reviews disappeared.

zzzmarcus 17y ago
See timcederman's post below. Reviews can, and do disappear apparently. Yelp admits the "spam algorithm" can be aggressive on new reviewers. >>"[The] spam algorithm can filter based on how established user is. [Your post was] not deleted & can re-appear on biz page. Still live on your profile." It sounds fishy to me. Who cares if the review is "still live on your profile" if it's not live on the business page. It doesn't sound like a spam filter to me, it sounds like selective removal of reviews.
- poutine 17y ago
  There's a lot of spammers on Yelp. I have no problem with this on new users as businesses will often post reviews of themselves to drive up traffic.
  - pyre 17y ago
    But why not tell the user that it was flagged as spam and/or delete it from their profile page? Why let the user believe that their review is still there when it isn't? Maybe this is a way to fool the spammers into believing that their spamming is working, but it really is a poor experience for legitimate users, no?
gsmaverick 17y ago
They may show your review to you but not others.
- tumult 17y ago
  Bingo. Ever try logging out, clearing cookies and then looking at a view again?

newhouseb 17y ago

> "give businesses the ability to respond to reviews for free and " Yelp has had the ability for businesses to respond publicly or privately to a review for almost a year now I believe. > "don't artificially alter results, be like Google and let your algorithm work." The same game happens in the web search world - it's called SEO. Yelp's spam algorithm is decoupled from any advertising, yet since business owners don't write their own reviews, they have less control over their reputation (as opposed to webmasters who change their page content), and are much more likely to come up with conspiracy theories as to why things happen the way they do and consequently often get very frustrated.

city41 17y ago

The fact that myths page even exists at all, with 9 rather damning myths, is enough of a red flag.