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Regardless of what you think about all the actors at play here, this is one of those stories to look back on that says... something... about the internet. A few

Regardless of what you think about all the actors at play here, this is one of those stories to look back on that says... something... about the internet. A few million tweets led to media attention, discourse about schools and race, meetings with presidents and scholarships to prestigious universities. All good things and all was once again well in the world and the internet won. However, with time, more details come out that make the whole thing not quite as clear cut and it becomes pretty obvious that there might be more than to one side of the story that we all jumped into. I don't pass any judgement, it just makes me wonder how to bring balance to the social media firestorms and convey a more nuanced perspective to stories like this.

hannibalhorn 11y ago
I wasn't sure what you were talking about, with respect to the other side of the story, but after searching ran across this article: http://blogs.artvoice.com/techvoice/2015/09/17/reverse-engineering-ahmed-mohameds-clock-and-ourselves/ http://blogs.artvoice.com/techvoice/2015/09/17/reverse-engin... Not sure how I missed it, but if anyone else did as well, it really looks like he just moved the guts of an old clock into a new casing. He didn't really design any circuitry at all.
- mcphage 11y ago
  > it really looks like he just moved the guts of an old clock into a new casing. He didn't really design any circuitry at all He's 14 years old and learning electronics—I'm not sure what light this sheds on anything?
  - fleitz 11y ago
    It sheds light on the issue in that his parents likely orchestrated the whole thing.
    - Ollinson 11y ago
      It's unfortunate that the "hoax" label on this clock story is being considered by some a conspiracy theory. All it takes is 15 minute to look into the political history of the kids father and the nature of the clock that he "built" to realize something is amiss.
      - fleitz 11y ago
        Yeah, his father is certainly a very savvy man, no doubt about that. I do think even orchestrated the police took it a little far, however, probably not $15m far.
    - mcphage 11y ago
      So this is your argument? 1. He got a bit overexcited about his electronic puttering. 2. something goes here 3. It must be a scam. I'm not sure what goes in the blank for you, but man, it must be a doozy.
      - robwilliams 11y ago
        That's not his argument at all; he's claiming that his parents orchestrated it, not that he "got a bit overexcited." The internals of another clock were put into a box. That's not electronic puttering.
        mcphage 11y ago
        > The internals of another clock were put into a box. That's not electronic puttering. Then maybe you're a lot better at electronics than I am, but that would have qualified for me when I was 14.
        robwilliams 11y ago
        You don't think his talk about soldering and "inventing" is a little suspicious considering what he actually did? Unscrew the back of a clock and put it in a box?
        mcphage 11y ago
        > You don't think his talk about soldering and "inventing" is a little suspicious considering what he actually did? Well, first off: you don't know what he actually did unless you see it up close. A couple of grainy photos won't show much. And secondly: No, absolutely not. Unequivocally not.
      - fleitz 11y ago
        Bomb in a briefcase is a common movie trope, since most people's working knowledge of explosives and bombs comes from movies it's reasonable to assume that an older style clock in a metal briefcase like they do in movies would be interpreted by a few people as a bomb, especially those in positions of authority who view everything that isn't 'normal' as a problem. Obviously Ahmed was aware enough of this to try to make the briefcase look less suspicious by wrapping it in wires which is generally how I try to make electronics in a brief case less suspicious. A few years ago in the winter I had an issue with the electronics in my car so coming home from Reno, I pulled the climate control panel out of my car so I could manually connect the wires to make the heat go. I ended up going across the border like this, and ended up explaining to the border guard the wiring of the car to assure her that nothing was amiss. The border guards suspicions were naturally raised because most people don't even know how to pull the panel out let alone jerry rig their own climate control system.
- ameen 11y ago
  That's how people learn things, by tinkering with existing stuff. Had the media not picked up this story, this kid would've been warned to stay away from doing such stuff, essentially killing any motivation he would've had. Hackers hack things, most of the time on things that exist.
- TeMPOraL 11y ago
  Yeah well, fuck it. I'm officially done with controversies on the Internet. I thought I was done already, but I fell for that one. Hell, I was even considering participating in "build a clock in support of that boy" Hackaday action (job stood in the way). That's why I keep complaining about manipulative and lying media. It really fucks up our society. Thanks for posting the link. It's really good.
  - stillsut 11y ago
    WOAH, You just saw someone just changed their mind based on new evidence. Didn't realize that happend IRL. But why are such important details left out of every media account? For the clockmaker sympathizers: What educational value is gained by taking an exisitng clock out of its normal casing?
mcphage 11y ago
> with time, more details come out that make the whole thing not quite as clear cut What details came out that made it less clear cut?
- unethical_ban 11y ago
  There are multiple comments in this thread that describe it. * He didn't really make a clock * His dad is an Islamic activist likely staging this whole thing for money and attention * His family intends to move to Qatar in order to be in a "more accepting" place * The kid was interviewed saying something about "soldering CPUs" or some crap. This isn't a 5 year old. He has no idea what he's talking about. TL;DR he's kind of a little shit, and his dad is using him for money and politics.
  - zem 11y ago
    none of which forced the school or the cops to march a kid out of the premises in handcuffs.
    - unethical_ban 11y ago
      Handcuffs might have been much, but the kid was instigating and did not deserve the praise and awards he got afterwards. Perhaps, as one of the parent comments said, the situation turned out not to be clear cut.
JeremyNT 11y ago
I too have been fascinated by this. It's always been true of human nature: the desire to reach some sort of conclusion as quickly as possible. Humans seem to have a lot of trouble with uncertainty, and when faced with uncertainty we tend to concoct narratives that are informed by our perceptions of reality. The danger of social media is that such narratives can spread quickly to others, and a mass delusion can be formed based on faulty or incomplete information. This is a lesson that shouldn't be new to social media, because "proper" news outlets have made horrible mistakes in early reporting many times as well, but it's worth noting: never, ever blindly assume that you've heard the whole story, no matter what the source. This is doubly true if the story you're hearing seems to imply that one or multiple actors are a combination of incompetent and malicious that stretches credulity. Humans make decisions for reasons, and although we all make mistakes, usually we're not malicious imbeciles.

hannibalhorn 11y ago

I wasn't sure what you were talking about, with respect to the other side of the story, but after searching ran across this article: http://blogs.artvoice.com/techvoice/2015/09/17/reverse-engineering-ahmed-mohameds-clock-and-ourselves/ http://blogs.artvoice.com/techvoice/2015/09/17/reverse-engin... Not sure how I missed it, but if anyone else did as well, it really looks like he just moved the guts of an old clock into a new casing. He didn't really design any circuitry at all.

mcphage 11y ago
> it really looks like he just moved the guts of an old clock into a new casing. He didn't really design any circuitry at all He's 14 years old and learning electronics—I'm not sure what light this sheds on anything?
- fleitz 11y ago
  It sheds light on the issue in that his parents likely orchestrated the whole thing.
  - Ollinson 11y ago
    It's unfortunate that the "hoax" label on this clock story is being considered by some a conspiracy theory. All it takes is 15 minute to look into the political history of the kids father and the nature of the clock that he "built" to realize something is amiss.
    - fleitz 11y ago
      Yeah, his father is certainly a very savvy man, no doubt about that. I do think even orchestrated the police took it a little far, however, probably not $15m far.
  - mcphage 11y ago
    So this is your argument? 1. He got a bit overexcited about his electronic puttering. 2. something goes here 3. It must be a scam. I'm not sure what goes in the blank for you, but man, it must be a doozy.
    - robwilliams 11y ago
      That's not his argument at all; he's claiming that his parents orchestrated it, not that he "got a bit overexcited." The internals of another clock were put into a box. That's not electronic puttering.
      - mcphage 11y ago
        > The internals of another clock were put into a box. That's not electronic puttering. Then maybe you're a lot better at electronics than I am, but that would have qualified for me when I was 14.
        robwilliams 11y ago
        You don't think his talk about soldering and "inventing" is a little suspicious considering what he actually did? Unscrew the back of a clock and put it in a box?
        mcphage 11y ago
        > You don't think his talk about soldering and "inventing" is a little suspicious considering what he actually did? Well, first off: you don't know what he actually did unless you see it up close. A couple of grainy photos won't show much. And secondly: No, absolutely not. Unequivocally not.
    - fleitz 11y ago
      Bomb in a briefcase is a common movie trope, since most people's working knowledge of explosives and bombs comes from movies it's reasonable to assume that an older style clock in a metal briefcase like they do in movies would be interpreted by a few people as a bomb, especially those in positions of authority who view everything that isn't 'normal' as a problem. Obviously Ahmed was aware enough of this to try to make the briefcase look less suspicious by wrapping it in wires which is generally how I try to make electronics in a brief case less suspicious. A few years ago in the winter I had an issue with the electronics in my car so coming home from Reno, I pulled the climate control panel out of my car so I could manually connect the wires to make the heat go. I ended up going across the border like this, and ended up explaining to the border guard the wiring of the car to assure her that nothing was amiss. The border guards suspicions were naturally raised because most people don't even know how to pull the panel out let alone jerry rig their own climate control system.
ameen 11y ago
That's how people learn things, by tinkering with existing stuff. Had the media not picked up this story, this kid would've been warned to stay away from doing such stuff, essentially killing any motivation he would've had. Hackers hack things, most of the time on things that exist.
TeMPOraL 11y ago
Yeah well, fuck it. I'm officially done with controversies on the Internet. I thought I was done already, but I fell for that one. Hell, I was even considering participating in "build a clock in support of that boy" Hackaday action (job stood in the way). That's why I keep complaining about manipulative and lying media. It really fucks up our society. Thanks for posting the link. It's really good.
- stillsut 11y ago
  WOAH, You just saw someone just changed their mind based on new evidence. Didn't realize that happend IRL. But why are such important details left out of every media account? For the clockmaker sympathizers: What educational value is gained by taking an exisitng clock out of its normal casing?

mcphage 11y ago

> with time, more details come out that make the whole thing not quite as clear cut What details came out that made it less clear cut?

unethical_ban 11y ago
There are multiple comments in this thread that describe it. * He didn't really make a clock * His dad is an Islamic activist likely staging this whole thing for money and attention * His family intends to move to Qatar in order to be in a "more accepting" place * The kid was interviewed saying something about "soldering CPUs" or some crap. This isn't a 5 year old. He has no idea what he's talking about. TL;DR he's kind of a little shit, and his dad is using him for money and politics.
- zem 11y ago
  none of which forced the school or the cops to march a kid out of the premises in handcuffs.
  - unethical_ban 11y ago
    Handcuffs might have been much, but the kid was instigating and did not deserve the praise and awards he got afterwards. Perhaps, as one of the parent comments said, the situation turned out not to be clear cut.

JeremyNT 11y ago

I too have been fascinated by this. It's always been true of human nature: the desire to reach some sort of conclusion as quickly as possible. Humans seem to have a lot of trouble with uncertainty, and when faced with uncertainty we tend to concoct narratives that are informed by our perceptions of reality. The danger of social media is that such narratives can spread quickly to others, and a mass delusion can be formed based on faulty or incomplete information. This is a lesson that shouldn't be new to social media, because "proper" news outlets have made horrible mistakes in early reporting many times as well, but it's worth noting: never, ever blindly assume that you've heard the whole story, no matter what the source. This is doubly true if the story you're hearing seems to imply that one or multiple actors are a combination of incompetent and malicious that stretches credulity. Humans make decisions for reasons, and although we all make mistakes, usually we're not malicious imbeciles.