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As Iranian (I am commenting from Tehran) I completely approve your point of view.I even explained in long comment in this post(you can find it in bottom).Irania

by 0xFFC 11y ago

As Iranian (I am commenting from Tehran) I completely approve your point of view.I even explained in long comment in this post(you can find it in bottom).Iranian regime nightmare is liberal people( because they are the most effective opposition to current regime, all of other opposition's dismantled by regime very easily they don't even exist in society). you know why? Because they are only threat to nature of this unbeatable regime(which have money manpower and religion).but west politicians keep ignoring this fact.Iran society is way ahead of its regime.Maybe far better than turkey in term of progressiveness And regime knows perfectly. Not Isis.not USA.not Israel.non of them is serious threat for them in long term.but a huge young population with secular believes is THE most threat for regime nature.people who use internet and spend time behind porn sites and don't give fuck about Islam is the most threat (and lose) for Iran regime. You want change middle east . change their fucking -stupid- culture with internet, with porn.

msoad 11y ago
Well, porn usually doesn't help much. How about proper education and teaching people to respect women and minorities?
- 0xFFC 11y ago
  Of course , I am using porn as notion, because it is such red line in Iran's(or broadly in Islamic) culture. It is the most - and first - effective attack to the stupid Islamic culture.Of course science is the best alternative. I just want show people the hardware -military,sanction, etc- is not answer . the best answer is software -culture,education,etc-.
  - msoad 11y ago
    Western countries are not interested in investing in Middle Eastern countries to achieve long term goals.
- lotux 11y ago
  We all get free or almost free or cheap, decent education in Iran, how about you? how much university debt do you have?
  - 001sky 11y ago
    no gift is ever free. that is the problem.
    - jacquesm 11y ago
      I fail to see the downside of a free education. The questions you might ask is what it is exactly that is being taught but in general a free education is a good thing.
      - 001sky 11y ago
        "Since the act of accepting a gift can create a sense of unfulfilled obligation on the part of the receiver, gifts are sometimes refused, depending on the situation." This notion from an etiquette guide to foreign culture I think is relevant.
        lotux 11y ago
        No, this one does not apply for free gift of education, but it applies to any gift that have some sort of monetary value, because when you educate people you enlighten them and give them ability of understanding true value of what they are receiving too. so you are wrong again. you give a man fish you feed him for a day ( your case ), you teach him fishing, you feed him for life ( education case ).
        001sky 11y ago
        you're incredibly overconfident. I'll leave it at that. good luck.
        11y ago
sampo 11y ago
Now that there are negative experiences on the consequences of overthrowing the regime in Iraq, Libya, Syria, it might unfortunately take a long time before the West will have courage to support a regime change in Iran.
- jacquesm 11y ago
  Why would the West have to support such a change? It can only happen from within, just like that last time that Iran decided on Regime Change and showed they were perfectly capable of getting rid of their leader of the day (the Shah). Persia ceased to exist and Iran was born, much against the wish of the West and without any of its support (rather the opposite). I'm pretty sure that Iran can manage the next transition just fine. Though it may be a while. If we want to expand IS territory then by all means, let's mess in Irans internal affairs.
nickff 11y ago
From the perspective of a Western government, Iran's international relations are the problem.[1] The fact that Iran's society is relatively advanced does little to console the families of the 1100 American soldiers killed by Iranian proxies in Iraq; nor does it console the families of the hundreds (if not thousands) of Israeli civilians killed by (Iranian government supported) Hamas. State support for the Assad regime isn't helping the Iranian government's international reputation either.[2] If you want to change the West's attitude towards Iran, a good first step would be to push for the release of Jason Rezaian, and the end of state support for terrorism.[3] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terrorism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terro... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_involvement_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_involvement_in_the_Syr... [3] https://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/stories-jason-rezaian/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/stories-jason-rezaian/
- jacquesm 11y ago
  I think the US/Iran resentment goes back a bit further, roughly to the time that Iran took a whole pile of US hostages that were held for more than a year. That's not the sort of thing that is easily forgotten and it is one of the cornerstones of West/Islam conflict. After that it was mostly a downward spiral, with some recent relaxation on both sides of the line.
  - nickff 11y ago
    That's certainly a good point, but they can do little to change their history, other than plead for forgiveness, which the state is unlikely to do, as that is now part of their origin myth.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_myth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_myth
  - natrius 11y ago
    That was a while after we deposed their democratically elected leader. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9ta...
rezashirazian 11y ago
I always thought Iranians saw Islam as a tradition, not so much a defining aspect of their identity.
- abalashov 11y ago
  For a large and influential constituency in Iran, this is true. Iran is a very complex, multipolar environment, in contrast to the facile way it is generally presented as a monolith ruled in an absolutist way by mad mullahs or whatever. There are at least three significant camps in Iran.

by 0xFFC 11y ago

msoad 11y ago

Well, porn usually doesn't help much. How about proper education and teaching people to respect women and minorities?

0xFFC 11y ago
Of course , I am using porn as notion, because it is such red line in Iran's(or broadly in Islamic) culture. It is the most - and first - effective attack to the stupid Islamic culture.Of course science is the best alternative. I just want show people the hardware -military,sanction, etc- is not answer . the best answer is software -culture,education,etc-.
- msoad 11y ago
  Western countries are not interested in investing in Middle Eastern countries to achieve long term goals.
lotux 11y ago
We all get free or almost free or cheap, decent education in Iran, how about you? how much university debt do you have?
- 001sky 11y ago
  no gift is ever free. that is the problem.
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    I fail to see the downside of a free education. The questions you might ask is what it is exactly that is being taught but in general a free education is a good thing.
    - 001sky 11y ago
      "Since the act of accepting a gift can create a sense of unfulfilled obligation on the part of the receiver, gifts are sometimes refused, depending on the situation." This notion from an etiquette guide to foreign culture I think is relevant.
      - lotux 11y ago
        No, this one does not apply for free gift of education, but it applies to any gift that have some sort of monetary value, because when you educate people you enlighten them and give them ability of understanding true value of what they are receiving too. so you are wrong again. you give a man fish you feed him for a day ( your case ), you teach him fishing, you feed him for life ( education case ).
        001sky 11y ago
        you're incredibly overconfident. I'll leave it at that. good luck.
        11y ago

sampo 11y ago

Now that there are negative experiences on the consequences of overthrowing the regime in Iraq, Libya, Syria, it might unfortunately take a long time before the West will have courage to support a regime change in Iran.

jacquesm 11y ago
Why would the West have to support such a change? It can only happen from within, just like that last time that Iran decided on Regime Change and showed they were perfectly capable of getting rid of their leader of the day (the Shah). Persia ceased to exist and Iran was born, much against the wish of the West and without any of its support (rather the opposite). I'm pretty sure that Iran can manage the next transition just fine. Though it may be a while. If we want to expand IS territory then by all means, let's mess in Irans internal affairs.

nickff 11y ago

From the perspective of a Western government, Iran's international relations are the problem.[1] The fact that Iran's society is relatively advanced does little to console the families of the 1100 American soldiers killed by Iranian proxies in Iraq; nor does it console the families of the hundreds (if not thousands) of Israeli civilians killed by (Iranian government supported) Hamas. State support for the Assad regime isn't helping the Iranian government's international reputation either.[2] If you want to change the West's attitude towards Iran, a good first step would be to push for the release of Jason Rezaian, and the end of state support for terrorism.[3] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terrorism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terro... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_involvement_in_the_Syrian_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_involvement_in_the_Syr... [3] https://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/stories-jason-rezaian/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/pb/stories-jason-rezaian/

jacquesm 11y ago
I think the US/Iran resentment goes back a bit further, roughly to the time that Iran took a whole pile of US hostages that were held for more than a year. That's not the sort of thing that is easily forgotten and it is one of the cornerstones of West/Islam conflict. After that it was mostly a downward spiral, with some recent relaxation on both sides of the line.
- nickff 11y ago
  That's certainly a good point, but they can do little to change their history, other than plead for forgiveness, which the state is unlikely to do, as that is now part of their origin myth.[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_myth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_myth
- natrius 11y ago
  That was a while after we deposed their democratically elected leader. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9tat https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1953_Iranian_coup_d%27%C3%A9ta...

rezashirazian 11y ago

I always thought Iranians saw Islam as a tradition, not so much a defining aspect of their identity.

abalashov 11y ago
For a large and influential constituency in Iran, this is true. Iran is a very complex, multipolar environment, in contrast to the facile way it is generally presented as a monolith ruled in an absolutist way by mad mullahs or whatever. There are at least three significant camps in Iran.