6 ms·

Ask HN: Full Stack developer offer from Berlin

10 points by haidrali 11y ago

Hello HN I am a full stack developer comfortable with working on FrontEnd, BackEnd and Deployment layers, have +3 years of experience working in industry and have few personnel products as well. I got offer from Berlin, Germany. The company is a Interior design company and have small development team.Should I accept offer or should I start my start up I am thinking about starting a start up. Please help me decide your advice will be highly appreciated, Also advice from anyone from Berlin, Germany will be good for me Thanks

orless 11y ago
Where are you now? In Germany? Which city? Do you have a permit to stay/work (Niederlassungserlaubnis or similar) or are you a "native"? I'm not from Berlin but my impression is that it's an interesting city to work and live. Has highest concentration of the startup scene in Germany. Cost of living is lower than in other places like Frankfurt or Munich, but salaries are also somewhat lower. So the whole thing really depends on your personal situation, your goals and the offer that you have. If you tell more about yourself you might get a better advice.
- haidrali 11y ago
  Currently I am in Pakistan and have two offers for full stack developer from Berlin, Germany. One from 1aim - Berlin, Germany and second from homify.de its also in Berlin, Germany. 1aim is providing me visa assistance, limited relocation support and free basic housing until I find my own place to live while homify.de providing assistance in relocation ( I have to apply for visa by myself ) I need to quote my expected salary to both, I would be thankful if you help me what should I ask for. My goal is to have my own startup in a year or so ... Thank you so much for reply
  - atroyn 11y ago
    How much experience do you have? 40K gross should be your floor (this is about 28k net which is plenty to live well in Berlin). I don't know either of these companies or their founders, but it sounds like 1aim is much more relocation friendly and therefore better established. Getting a residence permit for tech workers in Berlin is straightforward, and a company's willingness to walk you through the process is a good signal they care about their team.
    - haidrali 11y ago
      I have +3 year of experience. 40K ( per year right ?? ) Yes 1aim is looking much better and they have mostly people from outside Germany.
      - atroyn 11y ago
        40k Euro per year, gross. This comes out to about 28k after tax, depending on your marital and family status. This is more than enough to live on - if you're smart, you can easily save 50% of that every month, while still living the good life. You're at a career stage where you want to try to ramp up responsibility, so an established team that's in the process of scaling is where I'd want to be. Too early and you'll be too swamped to work effectively, too late and you won't get the responsibility you want.
  - atroyn 11y ago
    A few other notes. Don't have a goal to 'do a startup'. You'll try to force an idea for the sake of it, not because it makes business sense or is something you really care about. Berlin in winter is a cruel, cold, grey place to be, and Germany in general but Berlin in particular can be a severe culture shock. I'd recommend coming in March if you can. A bit of duolingo German will help quite a bit too, if only to fumble through asking for help! It's also one of the coolest cities on earth and after you've gotten past the honeymoon, the trough of disillusion, and really started living there, it's an experience all its own.
  - orless 11y ago
    Absolutely go for it. I've moved from Russia to Germany in 2001, it was one of the best decisions in my life. Check if you can get the "blue card": http://www.bluecard-eu.de/eu-blue-card-germany/ http://www.bluecard-eu.de/eu-blue-card-germany/ You can check if your degree is comparable to a German one here: http://anabin.kmk.org/ http://anabin.kmk.org/ I'd put salary expectation somewhere around 40-45 TEuro/year for starters. After some integration it should be no big deal to find a better paid position. I won't go for a startup for the sake of it. I'd go for a permanent position for a few years and use this time to secure my well-being (housing/visa/staying permits/unemployment insurance/savings/language/integration), gain more experience and make connections. A small warning. This might be just my impression but there are certain, let's say, "prejudices" againt Indians, Pakistan and Chinese IT specialists. Noone will ever tell you that in face (this is probably one of the biggest taboos in Germany), but a lot of anecdotes of that kind are told behind the closed doors. Having said that, you absolutely can prosper in German IT as a foreigner.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
playing_colours 11y ago
I am from Berlin working at some startup company. If I were you, I would go to Berlin, if you satisfy Blue Card requirements. Within 2-3 years you can learn how startup market works in Berlin, find good connections. In 3 years afair you can apply for permanent residency. It means you don't need to work for some company, and you can start your business / consultancy. I guess you may have better opportunities here to find investors, hire people and grow your business than in Pakistan. Berlin is a friendly city with a lot of foreigners from EU, Eastern Europe, Middle East, etc so you won't feel like a stranger here.
- haidrali 11y ago
  thanks for your comment. Can you please tell about how much is living costs/per month for a single person
  - atroyn 11y ago
    Single dude in mid 20s who likes to party - not more than 1.5k/month. 1k if you're frugal. Cost of living in Berlin is rising but still way below other Western European capitals. Housing is the biggest issue but your company can help.
  - playing_colours 11y ago
    A bit difficult to say about minimum costs as I moved with my wife, and we both work on senior engineering positions. I agree with atroyn - 1.5k would be enough. Remove about 40 percent from your brutto salary, and this is more or less what you ll have after the taxes.
  - orless 11y ago
    Around 1000-1500 would give you a pretty good quality of life, but you can also go lower than that. If you're single an young, consider finding a "WG" - it's when several people live together in a big appartment with own rooms but shared kitchen. That's normally a student thing but that's quite cheap and can help integration. But that's also does not suit everybody.
- atroyn 11y ago
tlubinski 11y ago
Do it. Great city, great way of living. Already a lot of good answers here. I spent more than 15 years here and still love it.

10 points by haidrali 11y ago

orless 11y ago

Where are you now? In Germany? Which city? Do you have a permit to stay/work (Niederlassungserlaubnis or similar) or are you a "native"? I'm not from Berlin but my impression is that it's an interesting city to work and live. Has highest concentration of the startup scene in Germany. Cost of living is lower than in other places like Frankfurt or Munich, but salaries are also somewhat lower. So the whole thing really depends on your personal situation, your goals and the offer that you have. If you tell more about yourself you might get a better advice.

haidrali 11y ago
Currently I am in Pakistan and have two offers for full stack developer from Berlin, Germany. One from 1aim - Berlin, Germany and second from homify.de its also in Berlin, Germany. 1aim is providing me visa assistance, limited relocation support and free basic housing until I find my own place to live while homify.de providing assistance in relocation ( I have to apply for visa by myself ) I need to quote my expected salary to both, I would be thankful if you help me what should I ask for. My goal is to have my own startup in a year or so ... Thank you so much for reply
- atroyn 11y ago
  How much experience do you have? 40K gross should be your floor (this is about 28k net which is plenty to live well in Berlin). I don't know either of these companies or their founders, but it sounds like 1aim is much more relocation friendly and therefore better established. Getting a residence permit for tech workers in Berlin is straightforward, and a company's willingness to walk you through the process is a good signal they care about their team.
  - haidrali 11y ago
    I have +3 year of experience. 40K ( per year right ?? ) Yes 1aim is looking much better and they have mostly people from outside Germany.
    - atroyn 11y ago
      40k Euro per year, gross. This comes out to about 28k after tax, depending on your marital and family status. This is more than enough to live on - if you're smart, you can easily save 50% of that every month, while still living the good life. You're at a career stage where you want to try to ramp up responsibility, so an established team that's in the process of scaling is where I'd want to be. Too early and you'll be too swamped to work effectively, too late and you won't get the responsibility you want.
- atroyn 11y ago
  A few other notes. Don't have a goal to 'do a startup'. You'll try to force an idea for the sake of it, not because it makes business sense or is something you really care about. Berlin in winter is a cruel, cold, grey place to be, and Germany in general but Berlin in particular can be a severe culture shock. I'd recommend coming in March if you can. A bit of duolingo German will help quite a bit too, if only to fumble through asking for help! It's also one of the coolest cities on earth and after you've gotten past the honeymoon, the trough of disillusion, and really started living there, it's an experience all its own.
- orless 11y ago
  Absolutely go for it. I've moved from Russia to Germany in 2001, it was one of the best decisions in my life. Check if you can get the "blue card": http://www.bluecard-eu.de/eu-blue-card-germany/ http://www.bluecard-eu.de/eu-blue-card-germany/ You can check if your degree is comparable to a German one here: http://anabin.kmk.org/ http://anabin.kmk.org/ I'd put salary expectation somewhere around 40-45 TEuro/year for starters. After some integration it should be no big deal to find a better paid position. I won't go for a startup for the sake of it. I'd go for a permanent position for a few years and use this time to secure my well-being (housing/visa/staying permits/unemployment insurance/savings/language/integration), gain more experience and make connections. A small warning. This might be just my impression but there are certain, let's say, "prejudices" againt Indians, Pakistan and Chinese IT specialists. Noone will ever tell you that in face (this is probably one of the biggest taboos in Germany), but a lot of anecdotes of that kind are told behind the closed doors. Having said that, you absolutely can prosper in German IT as a foreigner.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

playing_colours 11y ago

I am from Berlin working at some startup company. If I were you, I would go to Berlin, if you satisfy Blue Card requirements. Within 2-3 years you can learn how startup market works in Berlin, find good connections. In 3 years afair you can apply for permanent residency. It means you don't need to work for some company, and you can start your business / consultancy. I guess you may have better opportunities here to find investors, hire people and grow your business than in Pakistan. Berlin is a friendly city with a lot of foreigners from EU, Eastern Europe, Middle East, etc so you won't feel like a stranger here.

haidrali 11y ago
thanks for your comment. Can you please tell about how much is living costs/per month for a single person
- atroyn 11y ago
  Single dude in mid 20s who likes to party - not more than 1.5k/month. 1k if you're frugal. Cost of living in Berlin is rising but still way below other Western European capitals. Housing is the biggest issue but your company can help.
- playing_colours 11y ago
  A bit difficult to say about minimum costs as I moved with my wife, and we both work on senior engineering positions. I agree with atroyn - 1.5k would be enough. Remove about 40 percent from your brutto salary, and this is more or less what you ll have after the taxes.
- orless 11y ago
  Around 1000-1500 would give you a pretty good quality of life, but you can also go lower than that. If you're single an young, consider finding a "WG" - it's when several people live together in a big appartment with own rooms but shared kitchen. That's normally a student thing but that's quite cheap and can help integration. But that's also does not suit everybody.
atroyn 11y ago

tlubinski 11y ago

Do it. Great city, great way of living. Already a lot of good answers here. I spent more than 15 years here and still love it.