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If I may, here is some of my protips: - The best route up is hitching your wagon to your bosses wagon. So yes doing some of his work will make him look like a

If I may, here is some of my protips: - The best route up is hitching your wagon to your bosses wagon. So yes doing some of his work will make him look like a hero, which will get him promoted, and he'll think who is his most valuable / productive underling, which will get you promoted. Hopefully you doing some of his work free's up his time to be more productive in other areas. If your boss is a lazy PHB (Dilbert), get another job. - It is far more difficult to try and get promoted around your boss. Don't try this, it doesn't work. - Reward isn't always immediate. A previous manager of mine's advice was: You can't keep a good man down. Eventually someone will see the extra effort you put in and reward you for it, even if it is an ex colleage getting you hired at another company.

danieltillett 11y ago
Great post. Make those above you look great and keep them looking great and you will go far assuming your boss is not a PHB.
saiya-jin 11y ago
It is for sure one way, but you have no idea how long it will take till somebody "picks you up". It might take few months or 5 years (or more), draining you of a lot of energy and time that you could spent actually having a life. Plus some people see good performers around as competition, depends how company is structured (ie if your manager is on same position/level you will be once promoted). My example - I have colleague like that didn't do proper research before interview and agreed on ridiculously low salary for job&area. I started 1 year after him, negotiated properly (when you don't care that much if you get it or not, it's amazing position for negotiation). He works hard and is clever, right now he is my line manager and guess what - gradually he reached same salary as me. Since nowadays any of us could be fired anytime (or not, big multinational corp, you never know, people are fired frequently). So result - he puts 50% more effort, does endless meetings/documents and presentations that nobody enjoys doing, looks completely drained from energy. I do the same +-fun dev work that I enjoy with gradually more responsibilities, and am earning the same. this all depends a lot on specific company, hierarchy, promotion processes, your specific boss etc. in good company for example, you discuss with your manager your desire for promotion, set objectives/expectations you should fulfill in incoming months, and unless there is promotional freeze (or you screw up), you'll get there.
- HeyLaughingBoy 11y ago
  you have no idea how long it will take till somebody "picks you up". This is exactly right. It's also exactly why you don't wait for someone to guide your career: you do it yourself. If you want to work for someone specific, why not just go to them and say so?
loopbit 11y ago
Maybe I've had more than my share of bad bosses, but I don't really agree with you here. I must say, also, that in my experience, it does depend on the company size, culture and abilities of said managers more often than not (big, hierarchical companies tend to be worse at this kind of thing, also, banking and financial, not sure why). - A good manager will notice, and appreciate, your effort. But promote you? You are one of his best tools, why should he? Usually he'll try everything he can to keep you where you are. If it's a bad manager, he won't even recognize your effort. - Yes, unless you work with mixed teams or on different projects. In that case, two managers might end up fighting to get you on their teams and it might be a good thing for you. - Nothing to say here, you are totally right, but depending on how you play your cards, the reward can come earlier. Only thing I'll point is that I've seen departments go to hell because managers failed to recognize this. My tip would be to communicate. If you have free time, don't wait for your boss to assign you work and ask. If you see something else that you can be doing (sometimes there are features or bugs that could be worked together), say so, but always comunicate first and wait for your managers decision. Of course, all this is IMHO and your results may vary.
- meric 11y ago
  - A good manager will notice, and appreciate, your effort. But promote you? You are one of his best tools, why should he? Usually he'll try everything he can to keep you where you are. If it's a bad manager, he won't even recognize your effort. Your parent comment: make him look like a hero, which will get him promoted, and he'll think who is his most valuable / productive underling, which will get you promoted So, your manager got promoted, so in order to keep you around, he'll try anything, including promoting you, to keep you as one of his best tools.
  - loopbit 11y ago
    Again, maybe I've had more bad managers than the average (in my 17 years of professional experience I've had 2, maybe 3, good managers), but there's no guarantee that will happen. Maybe in areas like SV, where good professionals with solid experience have no problem finding another role and companies are actually trying their best to keep good employees that happens more often. What I've seen is people skipped for promotion in favor of the manager's son friend. Or in favor of someone "recommended" from above. Or many other forms of nepotism. I've seen wonderful managers-to-be being kept in a lower role because the company didn't want to cough up the increase in salary. And, as said before, invariably I've seen these people end up leaving and going somewhere else, causing the department a few problems (organization, lost know-how...). BTW, reading my comments on this one might think I'm bitter and maybe I am: I worked 6 years in Spain and France, where nepotism is the norm and techies are considered second class citizens. I must say that I don't think I've been skipped for promotion many times and personally I haven't had many issues moving up (and down) the ladder in all the places I've worked. But I also know that one of the reasons for this is that I've never had a problem with getting up and leaving a company if I wasn't happy.
ap22213 11y ago
This advice and the advice of the parent are both very useful, in my experiences. One thing I would add is to make sure you love working for your boss. If you don't love working for your boss, get a new boss.
- lostcolony 11y ago
  This. So much this. The actual work, while important, is of less importance than your manager. Yes, find interesting work, but prioritize them, and consider outright declining them, if the manager does not seem like someone you can work with and can trust to be dealt fairly by.
  - jenshoop 11y ago
    Agreed. There was a crazy study that showed that 75% of American workers identify their boss as the worst and most stressful part of their job and that 60% of US workers would take a new boss over a pay raise. But you're at such a disadvantage when interviewing -- how do you vet your potential manager? And when your financial welfare is on the line, would you really pass up an opportunity on this count alone?
    - lostcolony 11y ago
      Yeah, it's hard. But it's worth keeping in the forefront of your mind. When interviewing, make sure you've met everyone above you you'll actually have to interact with. When contemplating a job change, keep that in the forefront of your mind, and make decisions accordingly. I know I could have avoided one disastrous job I took had I done so (while missing out on none of the good ones)
vinceguidry 11y ago
> The best route up is hitching your wagon to your bosses wagon. So yes doing some of his work will make him look like a hero, which will get him promoted, and he'll think who is his most valuable / productive underling, which will get you promoted. Hopefully you doing some of his work free's up his time to be more productive in other areas. If your boss is a lazy PHB (Dilbert), get another job. This is called loyalty, and it only really works in certain kinds of endeavors, and then only certain organizations doing them. TV shows depict loyalty a lot, the thing I notice about these shows is that the stories are always set in "meat-grinder" sorts of fields, and then at the tops of those fields. Suits, set in a high-powered corporate law firm. Entourage, set in Hollywood. Loyalty as a major theme to a show isn't interesting to watch otherwise. Everywhere else, an interested ladder-climber will always find that it's way easier and cheaper to change jobs than it is to move up in one. Hence the perennial advice to move to a city, where landing jobs is like shooting fish in a barrel for the ambitious. When you run out of steam at one company, get a fresh start somewhere else. Rinse and repeat until you're tired of moving around, then you can start the loyalty path. It's important to note that the skills you need to convince someone else that you can do a job are way different than the skills you need to convince a power broker to bequeath you with additional responsibilities and the commensurate titles and prestige. It so happens that years of experience working in organizations gives you those skills largely through osmosis. I like where I am now, so I investigated the possibility of sticking around and trying to move up rather than jump to another company. Even talked to my boss about it. But unless you're at a rapidly growing company, the opportunities for advancement just aren't going to be there and you might be waiting years for your turn. My boss specifically used the words, "you're comfortable" to describe my head space when he said he'd go around and ask if anyone else needed anything to do. You and everyone else can have the best of intentions, but opportunity is limited and it's hard to make more of it. There's only ever a limited amount of money and perks to go around, and its often politically unfeasible to start rocking a boat by democratizing something that was previously held feudally. Making the decision to stay at a company is giving up easy access to opportunity in exchange for security and stability. You can always unmake that decision by leaving, often times you can even unmake it the other way, companies will take people that leave back if they like them enough, but you and only you can decide what you want more out of your time on Earth.

danieltillett 11y ago

Great post. Make those above you look great and keep them looking great and you will go far assuming your boss is not a PHB.

saiya-jin 11y ago

It is for sure one way, but you have no idea how long it will take till somebody "picks you up". It might take few months or 5 years (or more), draining you of a lot of energy and time that you could spent actually having a life. Plus some people see good performers around as competition, depends how company is structured (ie if your manager is on same position/level you will be once promoted). My example - I have colleague like that didn't do proper research before interview and agreed on ridiculously low salary for job&area. I started 1 year after him, negotiated properly (when you don't care that much if you get it or not, it's amazing position for negotiation). He works hard and is clever, right now he is my line manager and guess what - gradually he reached same salary as me. Since nowadays any of us could be fired anytime (or not, big multinational corp, you never know, people are fired frequently). So result - he puts 50% more effort, does endless meetings/documents and presentations that nobody enjoys doing, looks completely drained from energy. I do the same +-fun dev work that I enjoy with gradually more responsibilities, and am earning the same. this all depends a lot on specific company, hierarchy, promotion processes, your specific boss etc. in good company for example, you discuss with your manager your desire for promotion, set objectives/expectations you should fulfill in incoming months, and unless there is promotional freeze (or you screw up), you'll get there.

HeyLaughingBoy 11y ago
you have no idea how long it will take till somebody "picks you up". This is exactly right. It's also exactly why you don't wait for someone to guide your career: you do it yourself. If you want to work for someone specific, why not just go to them and say so?

loopbit 11y ago

Maybe I've had more than my share of bad bosses, but I don't really agree with you here. I must say, also, that in my experience, it does depend on the company size, culture and abilities of said managers more often than not (big, hierarchical companies tend to be worse at this kind of thing, also, banking and financial, not sure why). - A good manager will notice, and appreciate, your effort. But promote you? You are one of his best tools, why should he? Usually he'll try everything he can to keep you where you are. If it's a bad manager, he won't even recognize your effort. - Yes, unless you work with mixed teams or on different projects. In that case, two managers might end up fighting to get you on their teams and it might be a good thing for you. - Nothing to say here, you are totally right, but depending on how you play your cards, the reward can come earlier. Only thing I'll point is that I've seen departments go to hell because managers failed to recognize this. My tip would be to communicate. If you have free time, don't wait for your boss to assign you work and ask. If you see something else that you can be doing (sometimes there are features or bugs that could be worked together), say so, but always comunicate first and wait for your managers decision. Of course, all this is IMHO and your results may vary.

meric 11y ago
- A good manager will notice, and appreciate, your effort. But promote you? You are one of his best tools, why should he? Usually he'll try everything he can to keep you where you are. If it's a bad manager, he won't even recognize your effort. Your parent comment: make him look like a hero, which will get him promoted, and he'll think who is his most valuable / productive underling, which will get you promoted So, your manager got promoted, so in order to keep you around, he'll try anything, including promoting you, to keep you as one of his best tools.
- loopbit 11y ago
  Again, maybe I've had more bad managers than the average (in my 17 years of professional experience I've had 2, maybe 3, good managers), but there's no guarantee that will happen. Maybe in areas like SV, where good professionals with solid experience have no problem finding another role and companies are actually trying their best to keep good employees that happens more often. What I've seen is people skipped for promotion in favor of the manager's son friend. Or in favor of someone "recommended" from above. Or many other forms of nepotism. I've seen wonderful managers-to-be being kept in a lower role because the company didn't want to cough up the increase in salary. And, as said before, invariably I've seen these people end up leaving and going somewhere else, causing the department a few problems (organization, lost know-how...). BTW, reading my comments on this one might think I'm bitter and maybe I am: I worked 6 years in Spain and France, where nepotism is the norm and techies are considered second class citizens. I must say that I don't think I've been skipped for promotion many times and personally I haven't had many issues moving up (and down) the ladder in all the places I've worked. But I also know that one of the reasons for this is that I've never had a problem with getting up and leaving a company if I wasn't happy.

ap22213 11y ago

This advice and the advice of the parent are both very useful, in my experiences. One thing I would add is to make sure you love working for your boss. If you don't love working for your boss, get a new boss.

lostcolony 11y ago
This. So much this. The actual work, while important, is of less importance than your manager. Yes, find interesting work, but prioritize them, and consider outright declining them, if the manager does not seem like someone you can work with and can trust to be dealt fairly by.
- jenshoop 11y ago
  Agreed. There was a crazy study that showed that 75% of American workers identify their boss as the worst and most stressful part of their job and that 60% of US workers would take a new boss over a pay raise. But you're at such a disadvantage when interviewing -- how do you vet your potential manager? And when your financial welfare is on the line, would you really pass up an opportunity on this count alone?
  - lostcolony 11y ago
    Yeah, it's hard. But it's worth keeping in the forefront of your mind. When interviewing, make sure you've met everyone above you you'll actually have to interact with. When contemplating a job change, keep that in the forefront of your mind, and make decisions accordingly. I know I could have avoided one disastrous job I took had I done so (while missing out on none of the good ones)

vinceguidry 11y ago

> The best route up is hitching your wagon to your bosses wagon. So yes doing some of his work will make him look like a hero, which will get him promoted, and he'll think who is his most valuable / productive underling, which will get you promoted. Hopefully you doing some of his work free's up his time to be more productive in other areas. If your boss is a lazy PHB (Dilbert), get another job. This is called loyalty, and it only really works in certain kinds of endeavors, and then only certain organizations doing them. TV shows depict loyalty a lot, the thing I notice about these shows is that the stories are always set in "meat-grinder" sorts of fields, and then at the tops of those fields. Suits, set in a high-powered corporate law firm. Entourage, set in Hollywood. Loyalty as a major theme to a show isn't interesting to watch otherwise. Everywhere else, an interested ladder-climber will always find that it's way easier and cheaper to change jobs than it is to move up in one. Hence the perennial advice to move to a city, where landing jobs is like shooting fish in a barrel for the ambitious. When you run out of steam at one company, get a fresh start somewhere else. Rinse and repeat until you're tired of moving around, then you can start the loyalty path. It's important to note that the skills you need to convince someone else that you can do a job are way different than the skills you need to convince a power broker to bequeath you with additional responsibilities and the commensurate titles and prestige. It so happens that years of experience working in organizations gives you those skills largely through osmosis. I like where I am now, so I investigated the possibility of sticking around and trying to move up rather than jump to another company. Even talked to my boss about it. But unless you're at a rapidly growing company, the opportunities for advancement just aren't going to be there and you might be waiting years for your turn. My boss specifically used the words, "you're comfortable" to describe my head space when he said he'd go around and ask if anyone else needed anything to do. You and everyone else can have the best of intentions, but opportunity is limited and it's hard to make more of it. There's only ever a limited amount of money and perks to go around, and its often politically unfeasible to start rocking a boat by democratizing something that was previously held feudally. Making the decision to stay at a company is giving up easy access to opportunity in exchange for security and stability. You can always unmake that decision by leaving, often times you can even unmake it the other way, companies will take people that leave back if they like them enough, but you and only you can decide what you want more out of your time on Earth.