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After eight years in mining I made the jump to coding. However, my coding quickly changed to infosec. So definitely miners can make this jump. This is highly bi

by sprkyco 11y ago

After eight years in mining I made the jump to coding. However, my coding quickly changed to infosec. So definitely miners can make this jump. This is highly biased, but I would say that many blue collar workers bring a very different work ethic as compared to other workers in the software industry. Miners especially have a comradery that I have not heard of in other industries. In addition to this 80+ hour work weeks were definitely the norm in many mining industries. This type of work ethic has somewhat set me apart from many of my peers.

kolinko 11y ago
Interesting story. How did you find the transition from an active work style to a static/sitting one? I always say that programmers have it as hard as miners, but it's a different kind of challenge. One is more physical, another mental (not going insane from sitting in front of computer all the time). You have the comparison, What do you think?
- Jach 11y ago
  My favorite over the top rant on the pains of this profession: http://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks http://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks It's much more than just sitting in front of a screen all the time, which I think a lot of people can think isn't that bad either given they themselves spend so much time in front of their monitors and televisions... (That particular aspect doesn't bother me at all, I was a gamer before I was a programmer.)
- sprkyco 11y ago
  Really mining is seen as this hardcore active lifestyle when in reality it is rather sedentary. Typically there are jobs for jr. level positions which are very physically demanding. Afer about 2 years experience most people get "promoted" to driving some sort of heavy machinery. Often these positions are union jobs where the workers can easily dictate the pace at which they work. Typically I could spend 8 hours or more in some sort of seat forklift/haul truck/loader or whatever. This may not be the case in Coal Mines in Kentucky, but as you can tell from the pictures many of the workers in mining are not in peak physical condition. Even in the positions that were physically demanding your body "adjusts" to the workload and it becomes rather similar to sitting in front of a computer basically you go into periods of "auto-pilot" and then other times it was somewhat mentally demanding. Most mining operations are heavily automated requiring at least some knowledge of I.ndustrial C.ontrol S.systems ICS/SCADA is somewhat of a programming work flow. If this valve is open turn on this other valve once this sensor is tripped turn off this motor and close this valve. From a very simplistic manner this is similar to binary logic. At least from what I have experienced infosec is very mentally challenging, but it is not a constant demand there are definitely periods where I am in auto-pilot. The best solution for me having gone to a sedentary work life is to walk to work, drink lots of water at work (make you get up to pee alot) and to take walks at lunch.
  - kolinko 11y ago
    Thanks for the explanation.
socialist_coder 11y ago
I feel like your comment and the article in question are completely anecdotal. Sure, a subset of miners can learn to code. You can't argue against that. But, that really means absolutely nothing to the big picture. The real question is, what percentage of the entire out-of-work blue collar worker population can make the jump? I would agree with Bloomberg, it's probably fairly low. But, I might not be fully recognizing the software engineering jobs from huge companies that are vastly less demanding than your typical SV "rock star developer" job. Maybe there is enough of a market there...
- Jach 11y ago
  I'd bet it's pretty low, too. Even those less demanding BigCo jobs are often gated by a proxy IQ test in the form of coding challenges, and I'm not seeing any signs of those going away.
  - mindcrime 11y ago
    Even those less demanding BigCo jobs are often gated by a proxy IQ test I'd be way of assuming that anybody working a blue-collar job has a low IQ. There are lots of reasons people take the jobs they take, and IQ is only one of those reasons. I would wager that there are a significant number of coal miners, plumbers, auto mechanics, etc. who are just as "smart" in the general sense as the average HN reader. I obviously don't know an exact percentage, but the stereotype that "blue collar == dumb" is definitely not valid as a generalization.
    - Jach 11y ago
      Sure, plenty are smart, or at least not dumb. But the difference doesn't even have to be so simple as smart/dumb. If your hiring pool consists of two distinct sources, one with an average IQ of 98 (i.e. not dumb), and the other an average IQ of 105, the second source will probably have more hires. Increase the difference (say, to a full standard deviation) and it's only worse for the lower group.
      - 11y ago
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

by sprkyco 11y ago

kolinko 11y ago

Interesting story. How did you find the transition from an active work style to a static/sitting one? I always say that programmers have it as hard as miners, but it's a different kind of challenge. One is more physical, another mental (not going insane from sitting in front of computer all the time). You have the comparison, What do you think?

Jach 11y ago
My favorite over the top rant on the pains of this profession: http://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks http://www.stilldrinking.org/programming-sucks It's much more than just sitting in front of a screen all the time, which I think a lot of people can think isn't that bad either given they themselves spend so much time in front of their monitors and televisions... (That particular aspect doesn't bother me at all, I was a gamer before I was a programmer.)
sprkyco 11y ago
Really mining is seen as this hardcore active lifestyle when in reality it is rather sedentary. Typically there are jobs for jr. level positions which are very physically demanding. Afer about 2 years experience most people get "promoted" to driving some sort of heavy machinery. Often these positions are union jobs where the workers can easily dictate the pace at which they work. Typically I could spend 8 hours or more in some sort of seat forklift/haul truck/loader or whatever. This may not be the case in Coal Mines in Kentucky, but as you can tell from the pictures many of the workers in mining are not in peak physical condition. Even in the positions that were physically demanding your body "adjusts" to the workload and it becomes rather similar to sitting in front of a computer basically you go into periods of "auto-pilot" and then other times it was somewhat mentally demanding. Most mining operations are heavily automated requiring at least some knowledge of I.ndustrial C.ontrol S.systems ICS/SCADA is somewhat of a programming work flow. If this valve is open turn on this other valve once this sensor is tripped turn off this motor and close this valve. From a very simplistic manner this is similar to binary logic. At least from what I have experienced infosec is very mentally challenging, but it is not a constant demand there are definitely periods where I am in auto-pilot. The best solution for me having gone to a sedentary work life is to walk to work, drink lots of water at work (make you get up to pee alot) and to take walks at lunch.
- kolinko 11y ago
  Thanks for the explanation.

socialist_coder 11y ago

I feel like your comment and the article in question are completely anecdotal. Sure, a subset of miners can learn to code. You can't argue against that. But, that really means absolutely nothing to the big picture. The real question is, what percentage of the entire out-of-work blue collar worker population can make the jump? I would agree with Bloomberg, it's probably fairly low. But, I might not be fully recognizing the software engineering jobs from huge companies that are vastly less demanding than your typical SV "rock star developer" job. Maybe there is enough of a market there...

Jach 11y ago
I'd bet it's pretty low, too. Even those less demanding BigCo jobs are often gated by a proxy IQ test in the form of coding challenges, and I'm not seeing any signs of those going away.
- mindcrime 11y ago
  Even those less demanding BigCo jobs are often gated by a proxy IQ test I'd be way of assuming that anybody working a blue-collar job has a low IQ. There are lots of reasons people take the jobs they take, and IQ is only one of those reasons. I would wager that there are a significant number of coal miners, plumbers, auto mechanics, etc. who are just as "smart" in the general sense as the average HN reader. I obviously don't know an exact percentage, but the stereotype that "blue collar == dumb" is definitely not valid as a generalization.
  - Jach 11y ago
    Sure, plenty are smart, or at least not dumb. But the difference doesn't even have to be so simple as smart/dumb. If your hiring pool consists of two distinct sources, one with an average IQ of 98 (i.e. not dumb), and the other an average IQ of 105, the second source will probably have more hires. Increase the difference (say, to a full standard deviation) and it's only worse for the lower group.
    - 11y ago

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]