4 ms·

The "security line" is not simply a question of "doing a lot" and "giving a lot back", ex post facto, or setting an "example" in the "security industry". It al

The "security line" is not simply a question of "doing a lot" and "giving a lot back", ex post facto, or setting an "example" in the "security industry". It also has to do with design goals and priorities. Layer upon layer of cruft, with an OS weighing in at multiple GB, is not a confidence builder in the "security line". It also includes default configurations. There are reasons that so many Windows instances have been and are now part of botnets. There are reasons why the security updates have increased in quantity and frequency over the years and appear to be neverending. Some of those reasons have to do with design and priorities. Others with default configurations that Redmond assumes no user will ever change. No amount of PR can change reality (e.g., massive botnets of Windows users), although it might change people's perception of reality. Also, I never said "major competitors". I said "other OS". For example, the OS I use is probably not a "major competitor". It is much smaller and open source. That is what is important to me.

raesene9 11y ago
Sure design goals, well I'd argue that Windows has had "improving security" as a design goal for some time now, and that this has had measurable impacts on the security of their products. For example take SQL server as a good example, compare the number of RCE issues that it's had with say.... Oracle's Database server, another well funded company with loads of "PR" money. You'll find the SQL server has many fewer security issues than the competition, and I would suggest this is evidence of Microsofts improved attention to security... MS default configuration are really very good. I'd compare to your OS of choice, but you don't choose to disclose it :) So on the server-side I'd say that when I test modern default installs of windows based products they tend to have a good security posture out of the box. Security Updates, well everyone has a load of those, are you suggesting the MS is worse than their competition? Counting OS vulnerabilities is notoriously difficult to it's hard to get an Apples to Apples comparison here. Botnets, well there are botnets on linux for sure, and OSX has had it's share of malware to as has Android. If you like a small open source OS then that's fine, but it doesn't necessarily make another entirely different OS have bad security. now I know there's a reasonable chance you're thinking I'm an MS "fanboy" or similar at this point, but I'm not. I use OSX/Linux and Windows (as well as some iOS and Android) where they work best for me.
Sanddancer 11y ago
The reason is exactly why MS has improved their security over the years. One of the things they've done is made automatic updating a mandatory feature of the OS. People can't just lazily turn updates off anymore because they can't be hassled for a 45 second break for their computer to maintain itself. Were these people running Linux, a lot of them would be doing the same thing, with the same results. Windows has a lot of botnetted computers because Windows runs the vast majority of computer systems out there. The neverending security updates is part of the difficult balance MS has to take between compatibility and security. Fixing a security problem that breaks a buggy program written 20 years ago by a company that no longer exists suddenly becomes a support issue, because there are a lot of people who don't want to hear that they have to upgrade their copy of PrintShop. MS releases security updates in part because they audit their code, and are making strides to get rid of a lot of the cruft. Windows 10 pulled a lot more services out of kernel space and into user space, for example. They're doing so while being conscientious of user needs, instead of telling the user to just code the fix for older programs themselves. In your small OS, who do you go to for support if something breaks? Who will you go to for support when a program from today breaks ten years from now? These are responsibilities many open source programmers will slough onto the end user, while they're working on the Latest and Greatest PulseConsoleSystemAudioKitD.

raesene9 11y ago

Sure design goals, well I'd argue that Windows has had "improving security" as a design goal for some time now, and that this has had measurable impacts on the security of their products. For example take SQL server as a good example, compare the number of RCE issues that it's had with say.... Oracle's Database server, another well funded company with loads of "PR" money. You'll find the SQL server has many fewer security issues than the competition, and I would suggest this is evidence of Microsofts improved attention to security... MS default configuration are really very good. I'd compare to your OS of choice, but you don't choose to disclose it :) So on the server-side I'd say that when I test modern default installs of windows based products they tend to have a good security posture out of the box. Security Updates, well everyone has a load of those, are you suggesting the MS is worse than their competition? Counting OS vulnerabilities is notoriously difficult to it's hard to get an Apples to Apples comparison here. Botnets, well there are botnets on linux for sure, and OSX has had it's share of malware to as has Android. If you like a small open source OS then that's fine, but it doesn't necessarily make another entirely different OS have bad security. now I know there's a reasonable chance you're thinking I'm an MS "fanboy" or similar at this point, but I'm not. I use OSX/Linux and Windows (as well as some iOS and Android) where they work best for me.

Sanddancer 11y ago

The reason is exactly why MS has improved their security over the years. One of the things they've done is made automatic updating a mandatory feature of the OS. People can't just lazily turn updates off anymore because they can't be hassled for a 45 second break for their computer to maintain itself. Were these people running Linux, a lot of them would be doing the same thing, with the same results. Windows has a lot of botnetted computers because Windows runs the vast majority of computer systems out there. The neverending security updates is part of the difficult balance MS has to take between compatibility and security. Fixing a security problem that breaks a buggy program written 20 years ago by a company that no longer exists suddenly becomes a support issue, because there are a lot of people who don't want to hear that they have to upgrade their copy of PrintShop. MS releases security updates in part because they audit their code, and are making strides to get rid of a lot of the cruft. Windows 10 pulled a lot more services out of kernel space and into user space, for example. They're doing so while being conscientious of user needs, instead of telling the user to just code the fix for older programs themselves. In your small OS, who do you go to for support if something breaks? Who will you go to for support when a program from today breaks ten years from now? These are responsibilities many open source programmers will slough onto the end user, while they're working on the Latest and Greatest PulseConsoleSystemAudioKitD.