7 ms·

Teaching a 3-Year-Old to Program Without a Computer Screen

97 points by HugoDaniel 11y ago

kenbellows 11y ago
I love the concept of building more hands-on toys to teach STEM concepts without requiring use of a screen, especially when dealing with kids. If nothing else, screens are expensive; blocks of wood, less so. I'd really like to see where this goes, some videos of kids playing with it, some studies done to determine if the kids get out of it what the founder (Filippo Yacob) thinks they will.
cdnsteve 11y ago
Sounds great except the price. $179? Ouch.
scrumper 11y ago
$180 on a toy for a 3 year old? No. We would absolutely play with this at our local library if they had one though. I love the screenless programming idea, embedding those concepts early.
- beachstartup 11y ago
  it's a robot for urban tech-focused dual-income families with probably 1 young child, their first (which means everything they buy is top of the line). honestly they probably could have priced it at $199 or more. witness: http://www.toysrus.com/products/luxury-strollers.jsp http://www.toysrus.com/products/luxury-strollers.jsp http://www.thebump.com/a/25-hottest-baby-products http://www.thebump.com/a/25-hottest-baby-products do you know how much these kinds of people spend on their babies? it's astronomical.
  - maaku 11y ago
    stupid people will be stupid. news at 11.
    - beachstartup 11y ago
      they're not stupid. they just make and spend a lot more money than you.
    - thejosh 11y ago
      yes how dare they spend their money on their first born!
      - maaku 11y ago
        If they want to spend money on their first born, there are far better, more rational ways to do it. $199 in a 529 plan turns into $2k by college time. $199 in used clothes or legos will go a lot further at that age.
        mcv 11y ago
        I believe programmable lego starts at $300 or more. I also don't think the people who buy this buy it as the only toy for their kid. They probably already have spent plenty on other stuff.
        beachstartup 11y ago
        at some point you need to come to grips with the fact that some people are just wealthier than you, and don't really care about that $2k in 18 years because they or their parents, or grand-parents, or great great great grand-parents already solved that pesky 'lack of money for the kids' issue. you're projecting your own financial situation onto others in the demographic buying disposable $180 doo-dads for their kids. it's like getting mad at the rain.
    - gohrt 11y ago
      Clannish and wasteful, not stupid.
      - maaku 11y ago
        that meets my definition of stupidity :)
  - samstave 11y ago
    as a father of three, I totally agree. Unicorn idea: As soon as you feel you have too much stuff/outgrown it, you give it to my startup that takes your hand-me-UPs! and cleans them and sorts them and then posts them to our tinder-like UI where you can browse based on categories and your "discovery prefs" are your kids age... you then look through a range of various baby hand-me-ups and swipe right to add to cart and have shipped to you. you can return them later and if they are in good enough condition, you get a restock credit (think CrossRoads in SF (your lady friend may know this store).... And yeah - why do you think diapers.com and Jessica Alba are all trying to get into the market...
    - jbarham 11y ago
      They already have this in Australia (minus the app). They're called "toy libraries" and are great.
_chinchillin 11y ago
Are they alternative methods of teaching logic? I myself find code drab and cant stand it
thehoff 11y ago
http://www.primotoys.com/ http://www.primotoys.com/ looks like the direct site. I thought $180 seemed like a lot but it does look like you get a lot of stuff (including a simple robot). A toy lawn mower, a wooden toy train set, a toy truck, and maybe another one or two toys is already pushing $100, most of which end up in a bin to be barely played with after the first day.
- thehoff 11y ago
  Hrrm, I misread. Looks like the $ doesn't go as far as I thought (for $180 you get the playset, not the world kit). Interesting concept but on second pass this is a little steep.
0xcde4c3db 11y ago
> My main objection to pushing STEM down to the diaper set is that it all seems to involve screen-based learning tools, and I am sure that little ones don’t need more screen time. This thing seems pretty cool. On the whole, we probably need to have more of an awareness of how important tactile and spatial factors are in child development. But the top selling point, according to this reviewer, is that it protects your child from the "screen time" bogeyman? Spare me.
- hightechlowlife 11y ago
  Scientific research quite strongly links excessive screen time to psychological problems in children. You can be spared from science, if you'd like, but it does no good to ignore real problems just because you want to stick your head in the sand. Edit: And for the bogeyman's sake, if you'd like the "proof", that's what Google is for. This isn't some fringe view. It's about the same as asking me for proof that smoking is damaging.
  - ashark 11y ago
    Unfortunately, screen time for young kids is more addictive for parents than cigarettes have ever been to anyone, and look how hard it was (is) to get people to cut that out.
  - avalaunch 11y ago
    The problem is that virtually all of the screen time studies don't apply to tablet usage as they were studying the effects of passive screen time such as watching tv. People have a tendency to group the two together as "screen time" but actively playing educational apps on a tablet is very different than passively watching tv. In time we should have a better idea what the effects are but right now tablets are still too new for any comprehensive studies to have been completed.
  - joepvd 11y ago
    Correlation != causation. Is screen time per se that would create some issues with kids, or is it the lack of real communication between parent and kid? I love to sit down and actively watch (i.e. point, name, discuss) a show with my 3 y/o son. When not excessive, I feel this is good for both of us.
DLarsen 11y ago
So it's Robot Turtles IRL? My kids dig Robot Turtles and would have fun with this.
- cableshaft 11y ago
  For those who don't know, Robot Turtles is a board game that teaches programming concepts aimed at young children that you can pick up at Target or Amazon for like $25, for those of you who are balking at the high price of these robots.
rfonseca 11y ago
Kinderlab Robotics' Kibo Robot (http://kinderlabrobotics.com/kibo/ http://kinderlabrobotics.com/kibo/) also features a tangible, screen-free programming language where the instructions are wooden blocks that kids put together in a sequence. They are a funded startup shipping mostly to schools and museums, and the whole thing is backed up by a long line of research first at the MIT Media Lab, and now at Tufts. Previously, the founders created ScratchJr. Worth checking out.
kozukumi 11y ago
Love the idea but way too expensive. Why? I would get this for £30 maybe £40.
swiley 11y ago
To everyone complaining about the price: It's pretty difficult to build a robot that does much of anything for under ~$40. And this isn't just a robot, it has All these pieces that communicate with each other.
benkuykendall 11y ago
This write-up doesn't explain how to program the device, but this page does http://docs.primotoys.com/docs/cubetto-manual.html#introduction http://docs.primotoys.com/docs/cubetto-manual.html#introduct... Basically, you program a sequence of commands FORWARD, LEFT, RIGHT. There is also a special command FUNCTION that executes a user-specified sequence of up to four commands. Does it allow the FUNCTION command within the definition of the function? If it does, there's a lot of non-trivial stuff with recursion to do For instance, a stack overflow commands = [FUNCTION] function = [FUNCTION, FUNCTION]
- salgernon 11y ago
  So, basically a Big Trak, which had the same features. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Trak https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Trak Big Trak also could fire it's "laser" programmatically. My kids love it today - age 3 and 7. (Ok, I bought it used, since my parents had long ago donated mine to goodwill. Still, 35 year old toy works great.)
simplexion 11y ago
This is hilarious! Are they actually targetting 3 year olds? This device would be destroyed in moments of my 3 year old getting hold of it.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
acrive 11y ago
Not only. In Italy there is a toy that explain the BCD (Binary coded decimal) with colored tiny balls. http://www.quercettistore.com/prodotti/rami http://www.quercettistore.com/prodotti/rami About 30 years ago.. Sorry but this not happen only in Silicon Valley.
- mathgeek 11y ago
  I don't think this is coming out of Silicon Valley: play@primotoys.com +44 (0) 740 0549 759 Unit T, Reliance Wharf London N1 5ET
jschulenklopper 11y ago
Not sure if it's suitable for children 3 year old (mine are older already), but CS Unplugged, http://csunplugged.org/ http://csunplugged.org/, is an inspiring collection of free (!) learning activities teaching Computer Science topics through games and puzzles using cards, strings and pencils and some paper. CS concepts like binary number representation, different types of algorithms, data compression and error detection are taught without programming code or the use of a computer. There's a nice write up on this in an article in the Communications of the ACM: http://cacm.acm.org/magazines/2015/3/183598-reaching-a-broader-population-of-students-through-unplugged-activities/abstract http://cacm.acm.org/magazines/2015/3/183598-reaching-a-broad....

97 points by HugoDaniel 11y ago

I love the concept of building more hands-on toys to teach STEM concepts without requiring use of a screen, especially when dealing with kids. If nothing else, screens are expensive; blocks of wood, less so. I'd really like to see where this goes, some videos of kids playing with it, some studies done to determine if the kids get out of it what the founder (Filippo Yacob) thinks they will.

cdnsteve 11y ago

Sounds great except the price. $179? Ouch.

scrumper 11y ago

$180 on a toy for a 3 year old? No. We would absolutely play with this at our local library if they had one though. I love the screenless programming idea, embedding those concepts early.

beachstartup 11y ago
it's a robot for urban tech-focused dual-income families with probably 1 young child, their first (which means everything they buy is top of the line). honestly they probably could have priced it at $199 or more. witness: http://www.toysrus.com/products/luxury-strollers.jsp http://www.toysrus.com/products/luxury-strollers.jsp http://www.thebump.com/a/25-hottest-baby-products http://www.thebump.com/a/25-hottest-baby-products do you know how much these kinds of people spend on their babies? it's astronomical.
- maaku 11y ago
  stupid people will be stupid. news at 11.
  - beachstartup 11y ago
    they're not stupid. they just make and spend a lot more money than you.
  - thejosh 11y ago
    yes how dare they spend their money on their first born!
    - maaku 11y ago
      If they want to spend money on their first born, there are far better, more rational ways to do it. $199 in a 529 plan turns into $2k by college time. $199 in used clothes or legos will go a lot further at that age.
      - mcv 11y ago
        I believe programmable lego starts at $300 or more. I also don't think the people who buy this buy it as the only toy for their kid. They probably already have spent plenty on other stuff.
      - beachstartup 11y ago
        at some point you need to come to grips with the fact that some people are just wealthier than you, and don't really care about that $2k in 18 years because they or their parents, or grand-parents, or great great great grand-parents already solved that pesky 'lack of money for the kids' issue. you're projecting your own financial situation onto others in the demographic buying disposable $180 doo-dads for their kids. it's like getting mad at the rain.
  - gohrt 11y ago
    Clannish and wasteful, not stupid.
    - maaku 11y ago
      that meets my definition of stupidity :)
- samstave 11y ago
  as a father of three, I totally agree. Unicorn idea: As soon as you feel you have too much stuff/outgrown it, you give it to my startup that takes your hand-me-UPs! and cleans them and sorts them and then posts them to our tinder-like UI where you can browse based on categories and your "discovery prefs" are your kids age... you then look through a range of various baby hand-me-ups and swipe right to add to cart and have shipped to you. you can return them later and if they are in good enough condition, you get a restock credit (think CrossRoads in SF (your lady friend may know this store).... And yeah - why do you think diapers.com and Jessica Alba are all trying to get into the market...
  - jbarham 11y ago
    They already have this in Australia (minus the app). They're called "toy libraries" and are great.

_chinchillin 11y ago

Are they alternative methods of teaching logic? I myself find code drab and cant stand it

thehoff 11y ago

http://www.primotoys.com/ http://www.primotoys.com/ looks like the direct site. I thought $180 seemed like a lot but it does look like you get a lot of stuff (including a simple robot). A toy lawn mower, a wooden toy train set, a toy truck, and maybe another one or two toys is already pushing $100, most of which end up in a bin to be barely played with after the first day.

thehoff 11y ago
Hrrm, I misread. Looks like the $ doesn't go as far as I thought (for $180 you get the playset, not the world kit). Interesting concept but on second pass this is a little steep.

0xcde4c3db 11y ago

> My main objection to pushing STEM down to the diaper set is that it all seems to involve screen-based learning tools, and I am sure that little ones don’t need more screen time. This thing seems pretty cool. On the whole, we probably need to have more of an awareness of how important tactile and spatial factors are in child development. But the top selling point, according to this reviewer, is that it protects your child from the "screen time" bogeyman? Spare me.

hightechlowlife 11y ago
Scientific research quite strongly links excessive screen time to psychological problems in children. You can be spared from science, if you'd like, but it does no good to ignore real problems just because you want to stick your head in the sand. Edit: And for the bogeyman's sake, if you'd like the "proof", that's what Google is for. This isn't some fringe view. It's about the same as asking me for proof that smoking is damaging.
- ashark 11y ago
  Unfortunately, screen time for young kids is more addictive for parents than cigarettes have ever been to anyone, and look how hard it was (is) to get people to cut that out.
- avalaunch 11y ago
  The problem is that virtually all of the screen time studies don't apply to tablet usage as they were studying the effects of passive screen time such as watching tv. People have a tendency to group the two together as "screen time" but actively playing educational apps on a tablet is very different than passively watching tv. In time we should have a better idea what the effects are but right now tablets are still too new for any comprehensive studies to have been completed.
- joepvd 11y ago
  Correlation != causation. Is screen time per se that would create some issues with kids, or is it the lack of real communication between parent and kid? I love to sit down and actively watch (i.e. point, name, discuss) a show with my 3 y/o son. When not excessive, I feel this is good for both of us.

DLarsen 11y ago

So it's Robot Turtles IRL? My kids dig Robot Turtles and would have fun with this.

cableshaft 11y ago
For those who don't know, Robot Turtles is a board game that teaches programming concepts aimed at young children that you can pick up at Target or Amazon for like $25, for those of you who are balking at the high price of these robots.

rfonseca 11y ago

Kinderlab Robotics' Kibo Robot (http://kinderlabrobotics.com/kibo/ http://kinderlabrobotics.com/kibo/) also features a tangible, screen-free programming language where the instructions are wooden blocks that kids put together in a sequence. They are a funded startup shipping mostly to schools and museums, and the whole thing is backed up by a long line of research first at the MIT Media Lab, and now at Tufts. Previously, the founders created ScratchJr. Worth checking out.

kozukumi 11y ago

Love the idea but way too expensive. Why? I would get this for £30 maybe £40.

swiley 11y ago

To everyone complaining about the price: It's pretty difficult to build a robot that does much of anything for under ~$40. And this isn't just a robot, it has All these pieces that communicate with each other.

benkuykendall 11y ago

This write-up doesn't explain how to program the device, but this page does http://docs.primotoys.com/docs/cubetto-manual.html#introduction http://docs.primotoys.com/docs/cubetto-manual.html#introduct... Basically, you program a sequence of commands FORWARD, LEFT, RIGHT. There is also a special command FUNCTION that executes a user-specified sequence of up to four commands. Does it allow the FUNCTION command within the definition of the function? If it does, there's a lot of non-trivial stuff with recursion to do For instance, a stack overflow commands = [FUNCTION] function = [FUNCTION, FUNCTION]

salgernon 11y ago
So, basically a Big Trak, which had the same features. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Trak https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Trak Big Trak also could fire it's "laser" programmatically. My kids love it today - age 3 and 7. (Ok, I bought it used, since my parents had long ago donated mine to goodwill. Still, 35 year old toy works great.)

simplexion 11y ago

This is hilarious! Are they actually targetting 3 year olds? This device would be destroyed in moments of my 3 year old getting hold of it.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

acrive 11y ago

Not only. In Italy there is a toy that explain the BCD (Binary coded decimal) with colored tiny balls. http://www.quercettistore.com/prodotti/rami http://www.quercettistore.com/prodotti/rami About 30 years ago.. Sorry but this not happen only in Silicon Valley.

mathgeek 11y ago
I don't think this is coming out of Silicon Valley: play@primotoys.com +44 (0) 740 0549 759 Unit T, Reliance Wharf London N1 5ET

jschulenklopper 11y ago

Not sure if it's suitable for children 3 year old (mine are older already), but CS Unplugged, http://csunplugged.org/ http://csunplugged.org/, is an inspiring collection of free (!) learning activities teaching Computer Science topics through games and puzzles using cards, strings and pencils and some paper. CS concepts like binary number representation, different types of algorithms, data compression and error detection are taught without programming code or the use of a computer. There's a nice write up on this in an article in the Communications of the ACM: http://cacm.acm.org/magazines/2015/3/183598-reaching-a-broader-population-of-students-through-unplugged-activities/abstract http://cacm.acm.org/magazines/2015/3/183598-reaching-a-broad....