4 ms·

He's 'the only bag boy at Publix with an MBA'

24 points by edw519 17y ago

edw519 17y ago
This reminds me of a thread here on hn about 6 months ago where the woman refused to take a job because it paid less than her unemployment. Same story. Opposite responses. Respect to this guy. Shame on her. Here's that thread: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=741663 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=741663
- crux_ 17y ago
  > Shame on her. Why? Seems rational to me.
  - noodle 17y ago
    why? their benefits will run out (or the money will) and they'll be out of a job despite having had an offer made to them. or maybe they'll find a better paying job. point being, its a risk. they can't know for certain if they'll find a job or not in time. it was a risky decision, not a rational one.
    - crux_ 17y ago
      First: Acting in your own fiscal self-interest shouldn't be considered rational? By making this choice, the woman has both more income and more free time to continue a job search. Second: Using a system for its intended purpose (income while you remain unemployed) is gaming said system? How? Edit: this was a reply to what you had before ("i don't know that playing/gaming the system and breaking the rules should be considered rational."), not the current rewrite. Edit to (snarkily, I admit) reply to your current comment: So you're arguing that taking a risk is somehow automatically irrational ... on a forum laregly focused on startups? ;)
      - noodle 17y ago
        you make the assumption that this is acting in your own fiscal self-interest, and i think that isn't necessarily the case. sure, she could make a little more money now, for another few months, and maybe find another job (or not). or she could have a job that will pay her a little less money for the long term. bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, and such. unemployment isn't forever. it runs out, and sometimes it dies when it loses all its money. my father was on unemployment for one month before his state ran out of money. its intended purpose is to help you find a job. you've found a job but you decline it not because it isn't a good job, not because it can't support your lifestyle, but specifically because the government pays you better to not have a job. sounds like gaming to me. do you consider mothers on welfare who have more children specifically to get more income to also not be gaming the system because the system is set up to help mothers with children? no, taking a risk is not automatically irrational. for someone with a good plan and the means, its fine. if you have $1000 to spend, you can gamble with it and be fine. if you have no money and take out a loan to gamble with, you're taking a big risk and might get some broken kneecaps. if you're in the right position, a startup is a great idea. not everyone is in the right position.
        kiba 17y ago
        The intentions of a government program is no excuse for unintended consequences, especially when it involves tax dollars. That tax dollars was taken either at the threat of gunpoint, jail-time, or confiscation of property. It is a far more serious matters than a private program of an ineffective nature, in which resources are donated or gained through voluntary measures. It is not just about individuals who game the system, but the whole enterprise of the system that enables these people that should be questioned.
        crux_ 17y ago
        First: The purpose of unemployment insurance is to provide some income while you remain unemployed. That's why it's called "unemployment insurance" and not "get a job, any job, insurance." Second: It's a form of insurance. When you have a job, you (via your employer) pay into an unemployment insurance pool; when unemployed, you draw from it. It's not government money, it's your money, via a government program. This is why you get higher UI benefits if you had a higher salary. It's why when you're self employed and don't pay into the system, you get nothing if your business folds. Etc. Third: it sounds like you're the sort who has an issue with any government assistance period. That's fine, but it doesn't give you the right to expect others to martyr themselves in the name of your ideals. Fourth: the oft-repeated mythical welfare queen imagery leaves a very bad impression of you. Make your argument; don't bring up side issues, particularly "dog whistle" ones.
- kiba 17y ago
  Schemes like unemployment insurances backfire by reducing the total productivity of human beings since people will not make much of an effort if the job being offered on the market is lower than unemployment benefit.
- omouse 17y ago
  She was working for how many years? How much money did she put into EI (Employment Insurance)? You've forgotten how much it hurts to fall! Unbelievable. I bet you also think that EI cuts into your paycheck. That would be irrational.
maximilian 17y ago
When we moved to San Diego, my girlfriend couldn't find a job and ended up working at a coffee shop and school for minimum wage. Luckily California requires that all jobs pay minimum wage, even if you make tips. With tips she ends up with maybe $15/hr, which is livable for us. Working at a grocery store would drive me nuts. I worked at one in the summer in high school and I dreaded every single second. My singular purpose that underlies everything I do, is to not have to work a job like at a grocery store.
dschobel 17y ago
Why wouldn't publix leap at the opportunity and at least make him manager of the store. I can't imagine they get many MBAs at that level. Why not actually put his skills to good use?
- andrewljohnson 17y ago
  You're assuming he has a lot of skills. I have a business degree myself, and it wasn't very hard to get, and it doesn't guarantee I'm good at any one useful thing. He may have gotten laid off from his six-figure job because of the economy, but if he's capable, he should be able to move down the chain, but stay a little above bag-boy at Publix. Why can't he get a lower-paying office job? What's this guy's real story? Maybe it has more to do with unwillingness to relocate and the state of the micro-economy he lives in.
  - electromagnetic 17y ago
    I know in the UK there was a big problem with degree programs. The UK government has 'encouraged' so many students to go to universities to get degrees that it has destroyed many industries. I worked on several jobs with a plumber who earned 6-figures and the guy hadn't touched a used toilet in years, why? Because the shortage of trades is so prevalent that he could opt not to unclog toilets and sinks because he had enough work fitting boilers and maintaining heating and gas systems that the usual "bread and butter" of a plumbers job didn't even touch the side plate of his finances. What happens to the university grads? Well my local supermarket had a nice selection of degree qualified workers. The guy who worked the Deli counter had a degree in forensics, one of the stock boys I knew personally and he had a degree in economics. I don't know the situation in the US, but job selection for degree students in the UK can be seriously hyper-competitive in many areas. If you lose your job, for whatever reason, there can be literally no other job on the market because there's already a dozen workers with lower pay expectations. This, sadly, leaves jobs in the trades wide open and the governments have to bring in immigrants, often training them up in the process to do the job. The government, at least in the UK, needs to organize its departments. Education isn't serving the industries, which increases immigration and increases unemployment of those born with citizenship.
andrewljohnson 17y ago
I think it's admirable that he took a job at Publix to support his family, but he really shouldn't put that on his resume if he wants a high-paying job again. Also, this guy is a smart MBA? Why doesn't he figure out a way to make some money? Any capable MBA with roots in a community should be able to start a small business, particularly if his wife is making sure the family doesn't starve.
- awa 17y ago
  They mention in the article that they had to move since his wife got a new job. So, they may not have the roots in the community. Also the local economy seems much worse than rest of the country (with unemployment being higher) and raising money in the condition is probably hard Also, starting your own thing require a lot of skills/resources which few are capable of, with a straight out of college job and lots of years in the industry starting a business might seem more difficult than just hunting for a new job while working on a low paying one. And nobody said he was a smart MBA, he could be just a average guy (hard working one though) with an MBA
  - andrewljohnson 17y ago
    I feel bad for kicking the guy while he's down, but it strikes me as so odd that this is his only option, and I wonder what's going on.
- trevelyan 17y ago
  How many MBAs do you know who run their own business? Honest question.
prakash 17y ago
Every recession has stories like these: Here's one from 2001 - http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/13/magazine/commute-to-nowhere.html?pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/13/magazine/commute-to-nowher...
jeromec 17y ago
I have a lot of respect for this guy. The thing that disturbed me most from the article was this: People walking to their cars and getting in their cars and sitting in their cars while he's still loading the bags from the cart. No "thank you." No nothing. Just a trunk thump and shift to reverse. I could never be so cold and snobby. Geez, we're all human no matter what our station in life. What if the person pulled out and got immediately broadsided by a speeding car and this guy had to perform CPR on them?

24 points by edw519 17y ago

This reminds me of a thread here on hn about 6 months ago where the woman refused to take a job because it paid less than her unemployment. Same story. Opposite responses. Respect to this guy. Shame on her. Here's that thread: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=741663 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=741663

crux_ 17y ago
> Shame on her. Why? Seems rational to me.
- noodle 17y ago
  why? their benefits will run out (or the money will) and they'll be out of a job despite having had an offer made to them. or maybe they'll find a better paying job. point being, its a risk. they can't know for certain if they'll find a job or not in time. it was a risky decision, not a rational one.
  - crux_ 17y ago
    First: Acting in your own fiscal self-interest shouldn't be considered rational? By making this choice, the woman has both more income and more free time to continue a job search. Second: Using a system for its intended purpose (income while you remain unemployed) is gaming said system? How? Edit: this was a reply to what you had before ("i don't know that playing/gaming the system and breaking the rules should be considered rational."), not the current rewrite. Edit to (snarkily, I admit) reply to your current comment: So you're arguing that taking a risk is somehow automatically irrational ... on a forum laregly focused on startups? ;)
    - noodle 17y ago
      you make the assumption that this is acting in your own fiscal self-interest, and i think that isn't necessarily the case. sure, she could make a little more money now, for another few months, and maybe find another job (or not). or she could have a job that will pay her a little less money for the long term. bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, and such. unemployment isn't forever. it runs out, and sometimes it dies when it loses all its money. my father was on unemployment for one month before his state ran out of money. its intended purpose is to help you find a job. you've found a job but you decline it not because it isn't a good job, not because it can't support your lifestyle, but specifically because the government pays you better to not have a job. sounds like gaming to me. do you consider mothers on welfare who have more children specifically to get more income to also not be gaming the system because the system is set up to help mothers with children? no, taking a risk is not automatically irrational. for someone with a good plan and the means, its fine. if you have $1000 to spend, you can gamble with it and be fine. if you have no money and take out a loan to gamble with, you're taking a big risk and might get some broken kneecaps. if you're in the right position, a startup is a great idea. not everyone is in the right position.
      - kiba 17y ago
        The intentions of a government program is no excuse for unintended consequences, especially when it involves tax dollars. That tax dollars was taken either at the threat of gunpoint, jail-time, or confiscation of property. It is a far more serious matters than a private program of an ineffective nature, in which resources are donated or gained through voluntary measures. It is not just about individuals who game the system, but the whole enterprise of the system that enables these people that should be questioned.
      - crux_ 17y ago
        First: The purpose of unemployment insurance is to provide some income while you remain unemployed. That's why it's called "unemployment insurance" and not "get a job, any job, insurance." Second: It's a form of insurance. When you have a job, you (via your employer) pay into an unemployment insurance pool; when unemployed, you draw from it. It's not government money, it's your money, via a government program. This is why you get higher UI benefits if you had a higher salary. It's why when you're self employed and don't pay into the system, you get nothing if your business folds. Etc. Third: it sounds like you're the sort who has an issue with any government assistance period. That's fine, but it doesn't give you the right to expect others to martyr themselves in the name of your ideals. Fourth: the oft-repeated mythical welfare queen imagery leaves a very bad impression of you. Make your argument; don't bring up side issues, particularly "dog whistle" ones.
kiba 17y ago
Schemes like unemployment insurances backfire by reducing the total productivity of human beings since people will not make much of an effort if the job being offered on the market is lower than unemployment benefit.
omouse 17y ago
She was working for how many years? How much money did she put into EI (Employment Insurance)? You've forgotten how much it hurts to fall! Unbelievable. I bet you also think that EI cuts into your paycheck. That would be irrational.

maximilian 17y ago

When we moved to San Diego, my girlfriend couldn't find a job and ended up working at a coffee shop and school for minimum wage. Luckily California requires that all jobs pay minimum wage, even if you make tips. With tips she ends up with maybe $15/hr, which is livable for us. Working at a grocery store would drive me nuts. I worked at one in the summer in high school and I dreaded every single second. My singular purpose that underlies everything I do, is to not have to work a job like at a grocery store.

dschobel 17y ago

Why wouldn't publix leap at the opportunity and at least make him manager of the store. I can't imagine they get many MBAs at that level. Why not actually put his skills to good use?

andrewljohnson 17y ago
You're assuming he has a lot of skills. I have a business degree myself, and it wasn't very hard to get, and it doesn't guarantee I'm good at any one useful thing. He may have gotten laid off from his six-figure job because of the economy, but if he's capable, he should be able to move down the chain, but stay a little above bag-boy at Publix. Why can't he get a lower-paying office job? What's this guy's real story? Maybe it has more to do with unwillingness to relocate and the state of the micro-economy he lives in.
- electromagnetic 17y ago
  I know in the UK there was a big problem with degree programs. The UK government has 'encouraged' so many students to go to universities to get degrees that it has destroyed many industries. I worked on several jobs with a plumber who earned 6-figures and the guy hadn't touched a used toilet in years, why? Because the shortage of trades is so prevalent that he could opt not to unclog toilets and sinks because he had enough work fitting boilers and maintaining heating and gas systems that the usual "bread and butter" of a plumbers job didn't even touch the side plate of his finances. What happens to the university grads? Well my local supermarket had a nice selection of degree qualified workers. The guy who worked the Deli counter had a degree in forensics, one of the stock boys I knew personally and he had a degree in economics. I don't know the situation in the US, but job selection for degree students in the UK can be seriously hyper-competitive in many areas. If you lose your job, for whatever reason, there can be literally no other job on the market because there's already a dozen workers with lower pay expectations. This, sadly, leaves jobs in the trades wide open and the governments have to bring in immigrants, often training them up in the process to do the job. The government, at least in the UK, needs to organize its departments. Education isn't serving the industries, which increases immigration and increases unemployment of those born with citizenship.

andrewljohnson 17y ago

I think it's admirable that he took a job at Publix to support his family, but he really shouldn't put that on his resume if he wants a high-paying job again. Also, this guy is a smart MBA? Why doesn't he figure out a way to make some money? Any capable MBA with roots in a community should be able to start a small business, particularly if his wife is making sure the family doesn't starve.

awa 17y ago
They mention in the article that they had to move since his wife got a new job. So, they may not have the roots in the community. Also the local economy seems much worse than rest of the country (with unemployment being higher) and raising money in the condition is probably hard Also, starting your own thing require a lot of skills/resources which few are capable of, with a straight out of college job and lots of years in the industry starting a business might seem more difficult than just hunting for a new job while working on a low paying one. And nobody said he was a smart MBA, he could be just a average guy (hard working one though) with an MBA
- andrewljohnson 17y ago
  I feel bad for kicking the guy while he's down, but it strikes me as so odd that this is his only option, and I wonder what's going on.
trevelyan 17y ago
How many MBAs do you know who run their own business? Honest question.

prakash 17y ago

Every recession has stories like these: Here's one from 2001 - http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/13/magazine/commute-to-nowhere.html?pagewanted=all http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/13/magazine/commute-to-nowher...

jeromec 17y ago

I have a lot of respect for this guy. The thing that disturbed me most from the article was this: People walking to their cars and getting in their cars and sitting in their cars while he's still loading the bags from the cart. No "thank you." No nothing. Just a trunk thump and shift to reverse. I could never be so cold and snobby. Geez, we're all human no matter what our station in life. What if the person pulled out and got immediately broadsided by a speeding car and this guy had to perform CPR on them?