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And yet, similar policies have given us "export-grade" encryption and funded projects like the clipper chip. There's no way a single country can block secure,

by giaour 11y ago

And yet, similar policies have given us "export-grade" encryption and funded projects like the clipper chip. There's no way a single country can block secure, end-to-end encryption forever, but they can sure make things hard for a while.

sarciszewski 11y ago
> but they can sure make things hard for a while Only for their own citizens and trade partners that cooperate with their unrealistic demands.
- TeMPOraL 11y ago
  Which unfortunately probably means almost everyone. Companies will cooperate, because it's unprofitable for them not to. The GenPop will cooperate because they don't understand any of it anyway.
bmelton 11y ago
They don't have to block every user using unlawful encryption -- they just have to have a law that lets the penalty be enough that a few high profile convictions will deter enough law-abiding people that it isn't worth the risk. At that point, they can simply listen to all traffic and, if there are packets that aren't listenable due to encryption, assume ill intent, then be free to react appropriately. Assuming high enough signal ratios in detecting encryption, it might actually prove that encoded messages, or steganography proves to be more effective at preventing state-level eavesdropping... they won't prevent a determined state from getting your secret content, but it could be enough that, if the messages looked unencrypted, they would be passed over for the more obviously encrypted messages -- hiding in plain sight, as it were. Note, this is not an endorsement of any privacy invasions whatsoever, but musings on what a post-4th-amendment-obliteration world might look like for the privacy-minded.
- rikkus 11y ago
  Coming soon: 'Strong' encryption is illegal in the UK without a licence. Banks and other institutions will pay for licences for their websites and their behind-the-scenes comms but also be required to use backdoored crypto where the govt and police and govt agencies hold keys. An inter-country agreement makes us interoperable. All comms are monitored for anything looking encrypted but not decryptable by the state using their keys. It will be an easy sell because those who want full personal privacy will be seen as suspect. It will also make money from licensing.
- giaour 11y ago
  Steganography has frequently been a target of similar fear mongering, so they might apply similar scrutiny to all photos in this nightmare scenario and assume ill intent for all photos with a large number of layers.

by giaour 11y ago

sarciszewski 11y ago

> but they can sure make things hard for a while Only for their own citizens and trade partners that cooperate with their unrealistic demands.

TeMPOraL 11y ago
Which unfortunately probably means almost everyone. Companies will cooperate, because it's unprofitable for them not to. The GenPop will cooperate because they don't understand any of it anyway.

bmelton 11y ago

They don't have to block every user using unlawful encryption -- they just have to have a law that lets the penalty be enough that a few high profile convictions will deter enough law-abiding people that it isn't worth the risk. At that point, they can simply listen to all traffic and, if there are packets that aren't listenable due to encryption, assume ill intent, then be free to react appropriately. Assuming high enough signal ratios in detecting encryption, it might actually prove that encoded messages, or steganography proves to be more effective at preventing state-level eavesdropping... they won't prevent a determined state from getting your secret content, but it could be enough that, if the messages looked unencrypted, they would be passed over for the more obviously encrypted messages -- hiding in plain sight, as it were. Note, this is not an endorsement of any privacy invasions whatsoever, but musings on what a post-4th-amendment-obliteration world might look like for the privacy-minded.

rikkus 11y ago
Coming soon: 'Strong' encryption is illegal in the UK without a licence. Banks and other institutions will pay for licences for their websites and their behind-the-scenes comms but also be required to use backdoored crypto where the govt and police and govt agencies hold keys. An inter-country agreement makes us interoperable. All comms are monitored for anything looking encrypted but not decryptable by the state using their keys. It will be an easy sell because those who want full personal privacy will be seen as suspect. It will also make money from licensing.
giaour 11y ago
Steganography has frequently been a target of similar fear mongering, so they might apply similar scrutiny to all photos in this nightmare scenario and assume ill intent for all photos with a large number of layers.