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That's their choice not mine. As much as I'm able to claim, I'd never advocate such.

by iMark 11y ago

scrollaway 11y ago
And there stems the entire problem with islam from. A lot of people killing "in its name"; more often than not, where that is just abused as an ideology to rally more marginalized people to the cause. We'll never be able to stop those that abuse religions and causes for political gain, but we can starve their number of "soldiers" by not giving impressionable people more reasons to hate a country.
- iMark 11y ago
  I don't believe Islam is fundamentally different than Christianity. Present day interpretations aside, I believe both share a similar DNA. I believe the solution is to look inward (as I've already, "do no harm"), rather than to condemn outwards. And yes, I'm willing to concede the naiveté of my viewpoint.
  - scrollaway 11y ago
    I agree, I hope my comment was not misinterpreted. Most muslims believe in "do no harm", and every single one I've talked to thinks those terrorists are the exact opposite of true muslims. Those attacks done "in the name of islam" create islamophobic reactions from people. Media spreads this islamophobia further, to people who just trust whatever they see on TV. The climate grows to marginalize muslims further. The ones closest to the edge, who were surrounded by violence in the past (war climates) and are now surrounded by hatred from the country they live in, end up knowing only violence and seeking to be understood by their own violence. The cycle of terrorism. We enable it. What can you do once you understand it? Tell other people? You'll be silenced. You'd get shit on on facebook. Attacked on twitter. Downvoted on reddit. HN is still a sane place but what % of the population does that really represent? Can it even make a change? And it's not like you wouldn't ever get downvoted here. There's a lot of people who believe in the direct "more immigrants = more terrorists" idiocy. Today is such a fucking depressing day. Having to worry about my sister, my brother, my guild mates and on top of that seeing the attackers get exactly what they want: more fear. More knee-jerk reactions. Let it fucking end...
    - jacquesm 11y ago
      > HN is still a sane place but what % of the population does that really represent? I think that the level of HN is rare online but offline things are much better (at least, in my experience). > And it's not like you wouldn't ever get downvoted here. There's a lot of people who believe in the direct "more immigrants = more terrorists" idiocy. So talk to them and stand your ground. Sure there will always be jerks but don't let that stop you from trying and who cares about the occasional downvote. > Let it fucking end... Yes, please. But I fear that won't happen in my lifetime, maybe in yours depending on your age. This took decades to fuck up it will take decades to restore and a completely different approach.
      - TeMPOraL 11y ago
        > I think that the level of HN is rare online but offline things are much better (at least, in my experience). Maybe you choose your surroundings better, but one of the reasons I like hanging out here is because I can experience some semblance of sanity that, from my point of view, GenPop is lacking. I know few people who try to understand what's going on, but rest just repeat whatever they read on the news. > Yes, please. But I fear that won't happen in my lifetime, maybe in yours depending on your age. This took decades to fuck up it will take decades to restore and a completely different approach. Yes, please. But let it please not end in the collapse of what we've achieved as humanity. That's what I'm afraid the most - that at some point those tensions will explode and bring down civilization with them. The world is a fucked up place, but we're at the point in history in which we must fix it, not reboot it.
    - demallien 11y ago
      I'm not convinced that people linking immigrants and terrorism are particularly worried about the actual immigrants turning out to be terrorists in disguise. It's more a worry that they will just add to the ghettoisation of Islamic communities, which is precisely where this latest crop of French terrorists seem to have sprung from.
      - scrollaway 11y ago
- tormeh 11y ago
  I agree. Süddeutsche Zeitung had a very good article (in German) on how young people who feel like their life is lacking are recruited into literal Islam, whether violent or nonviolent.[0] 0: http://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/salafismus-als-jugendkultur-burka-ist-der-neue-punk-1.2318706 http://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/salafismus-als-jugendkult...

That's their choice not mine. As much as I'm able to claim, I'd never advocate such.

by iMark 11y ago

That's their choice not mine. As much as I'm able to claim, I'd never advocate such.

And there stems the entire problem with islam from. A lot of people killing "in its name"; more often than not, where that is just abused as an ideology to rally more marginalized people to the cause. We'll never be able to stop those that abuse religions and causes for political gain, but we can starve their number of "soldiers" by not giving impressionable people more reasons to hate a country.

iMark 11y ago
I don't believe Islam is fundamentally different than Christianity. Present day interpretations aside, I believe both share a similar DNA. I believe the solution is to look inward (as I've already, "do no harm"), rather than to condemn outwards. And yes, I'm willing to concede the naiveté of my viewpoint.
- scrollaway 11y ago
  I agree, I hope my comment was not misinterpreted. Most muslims believe in "do no harm", and every single one I've talked to thinks those terrorists are the exact opposite of true muslims. Those attacks done "in the name of islam" create islamophobic reactions from people. Media spreads this islamophobia further, to people who just trust whatever they see on TV. The climate grows to marginalize muslims further. The ones closest to the edge, who were surrounded by violence in the past (war climates) and are now surrounded by hatred from the country they live in, end up knowing only violence and seeking to be understood by their own violence. The cycle of terrorism. We enable it. What can you do once you understand it? Tell other people? You'll be silenced. You'd get shit on on facebook. Attacked on twitter. Downvoted on reddit. HN is still a sane place but what % of the population does that really represent? Can it even make a change? And it's not like you wouldn't ever get downvoted here. There's a lot of people who believe in the direct "more immigrants = more terrorists" idiocy. Today is such a fucking depressing day. Having to worry about my sister, my brother, my guild mates and on top of that seeing the attackers get exactly what they want: more fear. More knee-jerk reactions. Let it fucking end...
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    > HN is still a sane place but what % of the population does that really represent? I think that the level of HN is rare online but offline things are much better (at least, in my experience). > And it's not like you wouldn't ever get downvoted here. There's a lot of people who believe in the direct "more immigrants = more terrorists" idiocy. So talk to them and stand your ground. Sure there will always be jerks but don't let that stop you from trying and who cares about the occasional downvote. > Let it fucking end... Yes, please. But I fear that won't happen in my lifetime, maybe in yours depending on your age. This took decades to fuck up it will take decades to restore and a completely different approach.
    - TeMPOraL 11y ago
      > I think that the level of HN is rare online but offline things are much better (at least, in my experience). Maybe you choose your surroundings better, but one of the reasons I like hanging out here is because I can experience some semblance of sanity that, from my point of view, GenPop is lacking. I know few people who try to understand what's going on, but rest just repeat whatever they read on the news. > Yes, please. But I fear that won't happen in my lifetime, maybe in yours depending on your age. This took decades to fuck up it will take decades to restore and a completely different approach. Yes, please. But let it please not end in the collapse of what we've achieved as humanity. That's what I'm afraid the most - that at some point those tensions will explode and bring down civilization with them. The world is a fucked up place, but we're at the point in history in which we must fix it, not reboot it.
  - demallien 11y ago
    I'm not convinced that people linking immigrants and terrorism are particularly worried about the actual immigrants turning out to be terrorists in disguise. It's more a worry that they will just add to the ghettoisation of Islamic communities, which is precisely where this latest crop of French terrorists seem to have sprung from.
    - scrollaway 11y ago
tormeh 11y ago
I agree. Süddeutsche Zeitung had a very good article (in German) on how young people who feel like their life is lacking are recruited into literal Islam, whether violent or nonviolent.[0] 0: http://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/salafismus-als-jugendkultur-burka-ist-der-neue-punk-1.2318706 http://www.sueddeutsche.de/politik/salafismus-als-jugendkult...