4 ms·

> " that's why virtually no jobs actually pay the minimum wage." This may be true in some parts of the world but here in the UK the minimum wage has become a s

by dazc 11y ago

> " that's why virtually no jobs actually pay the minimum wage." This may be true in some parts of the world but here in the UK the minimum wage has become a standard wage for all kinds of jobs. This is because we have a tax credit system designed to make up the difference. What's happened over time is employers are gaming the system by offering jobs on minimum wage and the minimum number of hours required for the tax credits to kick in. Often the hours offered result in someone working part time but on hours, such as 10 - 3, that make it impossible to get another part time job. Employers that used to pay overtime now employ extra workers instead. So we have a country where unemployment is relatively low but where a lot of people don't have any disposable income. Efforts by the current Government to address this problem are , predictably, meeting a lot of resistance.

yummyfajitas 11y ago
This seems like an excellent system - you are getting productive output from more people than we do. This sort of contradicts the impression I have of the UK, namely council flats full of people who haven't worked in years. (Admittedly, I lived in the UK less than a year and don't know the stats.) In the US most of our poor folks don't work - do you have stats showing differently in the UK? I'm very curious now.
- saiya-jin 11y ago
  I find it very difficult to describe that as an "excellent" system... A GOOD system is the one which helps hard workers to lift themselves from being poor in any meaningful way (less bureaucracy, more help with kids, less taxes, more subsidies etc.) rather than one that prevents an easy improvement. What OP described ain't that good, unless your primary goal is to have nice low stats for unemployment.
  - dazc 11y ago
    This is true. Someone in a low paid job used to be able to work overtime (often at a premium) or get a second job. The current system disincentives old fashioned hard work as any extra money earned equates to a drop in benefits received.
- dazc 11y ago
  According to the ONS (May 2015) the 'employment rate' was 73.5% However, the 'unemployment rate' was 5.5% http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lms/labour-market-statistics/may-2015/statistical-bulletin.html http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lms/labour-market-statistics/m... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10604117 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10604117 * A person is classed as unemployed if not only out of work, but also actively looking for work and available to start work within a fortnight. * The unemployment figure is higher than the claimant count as many job seekers do not or cannot claim JSA (Job Seekers Allowance)
  - s73v3r 11y ago
    Keep in mind that the other ~27% of people who are not "employed" also includes retired persons, students, stay at home parents, disabled people who are not able to work, in addition to people who have just given up on job seeking.

by dazc 11y ago

yummyfajitas 11y ago

This seems like an excellent system - you are getting productive output from more people than we do. This sort of contradicts the impression I have of the UK, namely council flats full of people who haven't worked in years. (Admittedly, I lived in the UK less than a year and don't know the stats.) In the US most of our poor folks don't work - do you have stats showing differently in the UK? I'm very curious now.

saiya-jin 11y ago
I find it very difficult to describe that as an "excellent" system... A GOOD system is the one which helps hard workers to lift themselves from being poor in any meaningful way (less bureaucracy, more help with kids, less taxes, more subsidies etc.) rather than one that prevents an easy improvement. What OP described ain't that good, unless your primary goal is to have nice low stats for unemployment.
- dazc 11y ago
  This is true. Someone in a low paid job used to be able to work overtime (often at a premium) or get a second job. The current system disincentives old fashioned hard work as any extra money earned equates to a drop in benefits received.
dazc 11y ago
According to the ONS (May 2015) the 'employment rate' was 73.5% However, the 'unemployment rate' was 5.5% http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lms/labour-market-statistics/may-2015/statistical-bulletin.html http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lms/labour-market-statistics/m... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10604117 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10604117 * A person is classed as unemployed if not only out of work, but also actively looking for work and available to start work within a fortnight. * The unemployment figure is higher than the claimant count as many job seekers do not or cannot claim JSA (Job Seekers Allowance)
- s73v3r 11y ago
  Keep in mind that the other ~27% of people who are not "employed" also includes retired persons, students, stay at home parents, disabled people who are not able to work, in addition to people who have just given up on job seeking.