7 ms·

Is Wall Street Beneath Business Students' Standards?

25 points by lujim 11y ago

TheSpiceIsLife 11y ago
Business school deans say some students who consider themselves "highly ethical" are avoiding careers in finance because they consider the field beneath their standards. Hasn't this always been the case? You go in to it for the money, for the thrill, because that's what you're in to. Or you go in to it for any number of reasons. Maybe you consider yourself highly ethical and go in to finance because you think you can make a difference. Christine Lagarde ... said ... one of her sons had told her he might not talk to her if she were to work for a large investment bank. Right. And one of her daughters told her she wouldn't speak to her if she bought that dress. So what?
- AC__ 11y ago
  Christine Lagarde gives me the creeps. Back when MH17 was still fresh I was trying to discern for myself what transpired, anyway didn't find out much just ended up reading some pretty out there shit. Here's a note I made on it at the time "So, I was reading a bit about the MH17 incident and stumbled upon this http://www.dailymail.co.uk/…/From-CIA-assassination-cock-ne… http://www.dailymail.co.uk/…/From-CIA-assassination-cock-ne… Basically an article outlining some of the wild theories being circulated on the internet in regard to the incident...but then I got to the part about Christine Lagarde Managing Director, IMF and I figured I might as well check out this speech and see what exactly these "cryptic uses of the number 7" were that these people seemed to believe were present in her speech. So that brought me to this video, an unedited, unabridged, video of her speech, given on January 15, 2014(this date becomes important): https://youtu.be/LJ3oZN_dzZI https://youtu.be/LJ3oZN_dzZI -just so there is no question as to when this speech was delivered here is a link to the IMF site with a transcript of the speech "As prepared for delivery": http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2014/011514.htm http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2014/011514.htm WTF is she saying? All the conspiracy theory stuff aside, there are several references to the G7 in this video. The G7 was officially still the G8 at the time of this speech. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G8- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G8- "(Russia)-was excluded from the forum by the other members on March 24, 2014" and the Crimea incident didn't begin until February 23, 2014 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Crimea_crisis#Timeline" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Crimea_crisis#Timeline"
  - AC__ 11y ago
    That was an impossibly fast downvote lol
    - peter_l_downs 11y ago
      Probably another conspiracy!
      - AC__ 11y ago
        My comment made no claim of conspiracy, the original dailymail article did. I simply stated the G7 was still the G8 and if anybody else were to give that speech with 7 this and 7 that, 7-7-7, they'd be in a padded room haha.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- AC__ 11y ago
  I'm reminded of a post I recently saw on HN, "Techniques for dilution, misdirection and control of a internet forum" - http://pastebin.com/irj4Fyd5 http://pastebin.com/irj4Fyd5 coincidentally HN has its share of these disinformationalist.
p4wnc6 11y ago
What kind of job can you get that actually is ethical? I don't know of any. To me, it seems like you just have to pick which vertical scam you want to give your labor to, and choosing between them based on which affords you a better/more comfortable life isn't unreasonable. If there actually was a credible alternative, that would be one thing. But what is it? Start-ups? Yeah right. Non-profits. Please. Government? Medicine? Law? Commerce? Entertainment? Education? Research? Who considers any of these ethical? Some fields may have generally nicer people within them, but the people on top (executives, university or hospital administrators, corporate attorneys, investors, whatever) are generally paid way beyond the value they add through capital or labor, and implement many policies or pursue regulatory capture or whatever else to ensure this type of arrangement persists to their benefit. The only thing that makes sense to me is that it's a problem of mate selection. If by agreeing to work in a certain field you are tainted with a social stigma that prevents you from attracting the type of mate you want, that might motivate you to use some kind of ethics argument as a rationalization for the true behind-the-scenes status argument. But I have a hard time believing this matters to finance. Money still tends to be a huge factor in mate selection, ethics be damned. Maybe it matters if you're very low-level in a huge bureaucratic bank, so you get all of the social stigma downside but not a lot of the financial upside. But apart from that... I don't see it. No other choice available to you is significantly "more ethical" than just personally being honest and working in a financial corporation whose higher-level scamminess you can't influence or control. I mean, it's certainly depressing that it's like this... but this is just how it is.
- Nicholas_C 11y ago
  >What kind of job can you get that actually is ethical? I don't know of any. To me, it seems like you just have to pick which vertical scam you want to give your labor to, and choosing between them based on which affords you a better/more comfortable life isn't unreasonable. >If there actually was a credible alternative, that would be one thing. But what is it? Start-ups? Yeah right. Non-profits. Please. Government? Medicine? Law? Commerce? Entertainment? Education? Research? Who considers any of these ethical? Maybe they are not ethical, but what, exactly, is unethical about them? Unless you work for a company that exists to game the system and/or exploit people/resources you are adding value to the world and making it a more efficient and better place for other humans.
marssaxman 11y ago
I'm surprised they're surprised. What a strange bubble they must live in.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
peterjancelis 11y ago
As a former business student, I don't remember us having standards.
Animats 11y ago
If the better business students think finance is unethical, that indicates good judgment.
falsestprophet 11y ago
How does one distinguish between being ethical and highly ethical?

25 points by lujim 11y ago

Business school deans say some students who consider themselves "highly ethical" are avoiding careers in finance because they consider the field beneath their standards. Hasn't this always been the case? You go in to it for the money, for the thrill, because that's what you're in to. Or you go in to it for any number of reasons. Maybe you consider yourself highly ethical and go in to finance because you think you can make a difference. Christine Lagarde ... said ... one of her sons had told her he might not talk to her if she were to work for a large investment bank. Right. And one of her daughters told her she wouldn't speak to her if she bought that dress. So what?

AC__ 11y ago
Christine Lagarde gives me the creeps. Back when MH17 was still fresh I was trying to discern for myself what transpired, anyway didn't find out much just ended up reading some pretty out there shit. Here's a note I made on it at the time "So, I was reading a bit about the MH17 incident and stumbled upon this http://www.dailymail.co.uk/…/From-CIA-assassination-cock-ne… http://www.dailymail.co.uk/…/From-CIA-assassination-cock-ne… Basically an article outlining some of the wild theories being circulated on the internet in regard to the incident...but then I got to the part about Christine Lagarde Managing Director, IMF and I figured I might as well check out this speech and see what exactly these "cryptic uses of the number 7" were that these people seemed to believe were present in her speech. So that brought me to this video, an unedited, unabridged, video of her speech, given on January 15, 2014(this date becomes important): https://youtu.be/LJ3oZN_dzZI https://youtu.be/LJ3oZN_dzZI -just so there is no question as to when this speech was delivered here is a link to the IMF site with a transcript of the speech "As prepared for delivery": http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2014/011514.htm http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2014/011514.htm WTF is she saying? All the conspiracy theory stuff aside, there are several references to the G7 in this video. The G7 was officially still the G8 at the time of this speech. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G8- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G8- "(Russia)-was excluded from the forum by the other members on March 24, 2014" and the Crimea incident didn't begin until February 23, 2014 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Crimea_crisis#Timeline" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Crimea_crisis#Timeline"
- AC__ 11y ago
  That was an impossibly fast downvote lol
  - peter_l_downs 11y ago
    Probably another conspiracy!
    - AC__ 11y ago
      My comment made no claim of conspiracy, the original dailymail article did. I simply stated the G7 was still the G8 and if anybody else were to give that speech with 7 this and 7 that, 7-7-7, they'd be in a padded room haha.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
AC__ 11y ago
I'm reminded of a post I recently saw on HN, "Techniques for dilution, misdirection and control of a internet forum" - http://pastebin.com/irj4Fyd5 http://pastebin.com/irj4Fyd5 coincidentally HN has its share of these disinformationalist.

p4wnc6 11y ago

What kind of job can you get that actually is ethical? I don't know of any. To me, it seems like you just have to pick which vertical scam you want to give your labor to, and choosing between them based on which affords you a better/more comfortable life isn't unreasonable. If there actually was a credible alternative, that would be one thing. But what is it? Start-ups? Yeah right. Non-profits. Please. Government? Medicine? Law? Commerce? Entertainment? Education? Research? Who considers any of these ethical? Some fields may have generally nicer people within them, but the people on top (executives, university or hospital administrators, corporate attorneys, investors, whatever) are generally paid way beyond the value they add through capital or labor, and implement many policies or pursue regulatory capture or whatever else to ensure this type of arrangement persists to their benefit. The only thing that makes sense to me is that it's a problem of mate selection. If by agreeing to work in a certain field you are tainted with a social stigma that prevents you from attracting the type of mate you want, that might motivate you to use some kind of ethics argument as a rationalization for the true behind-the-scenes status argument. But I have a hard time believing this matters to finance. Money still tends to be a huge factor in mate selection, ethics be damned. Maybe it matters if you're very low-level in a huge bureaucratic bank, so you get all of the social stigma downside but not a lot of the financial upside. But apart from that... I don't see it. No other choice available to you is significantly "more ethical" than just personally being honest and working in a financial corporation whose higher-level scamminess you can't influence or control. I mean, it's certainly depressing that it's like this... but this is just how it is.

Nicholas_C 11y ago
>What kind of job can you get that actually is ethical? I don't know of any. To me, it seems like you just have to pick which vertical scam you want to give your labor to, and choosing between them based on which affords you a better/more comfortable life isn't unreasonable. >If there actually was a credible alternative, that would be one thing. But what is it? Start-ups? Yeah right. Non-profits. Please. Government? Medicine? Law? Commerce? Entertainment? Education? Research? Who considers any of these ethical? Maybe they are not ethical, but what, exactly, is unethical about them? Unless you work for a company that exists to game the system and/or exploit people/resources you are adding value to the world and making it a more efficient and better place for other humans.

marssaxman 11y ago

I'm surprised they're surprised. What a strange bubble they must live in.

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

peterjancelis 11y ago

As a former business student, I don't remember us having standards.

Animats 11y ago

If the better business students think finance is unethical, that indicates good judgment.

falsestprophet 11y ago

How does one distinguish between being ethical and highly ethical?