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To the best of my knowledge, healthy food is in fact more expensive. This is not only the conventional wisdom, here[0] is a meta-analysis of studies from 29 co

To the best of my knowledge, healthy food is in fact more expensive. This is not only the conventional wisdom, here[0] is a meta-analysis of studies from 29 countries which supports the hypothesis. For many people, eating healthy is just out of reach. You may have been a college student on a tight budget, but presumably a) you were only feeding yourself, b) you had ready access to healthy options, which many people in poorer parts of the US in particular do not, thus increasing the price dramatically when you factor in travel, and c) while you may have had limited funds, I'd wager they were largely discretionary, i.e. you also had a meal plan, or some other form of financial support so that if you exceeded your means you would not go hungry. Most college students are fairly well insulated from immediate financial ruin, via parental support and government aid. When you are living paycheck to paycheck, and not making much at that, the difference of a few dollars can be huge. [0] http://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/3/12/e004277.full?sid=820d6e1a-280e-47a6-b8c5-498bfa4657e3 http://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/3/12/e004277.full?sid=820d6e1...

CuriouslyC 11y ago
Beans are about a dollar a pound, cabbage is about 50 cents a pound, frozen spinach is around 1.40 per pound, eggs get as low as a dollar a dozen, chicken breasts are frequently around 2 dollars a pound. The argument that healthy food is not affordable is garbage. Poor people just tend to make very poor food choices, much as they make poor choices in other areas of their lives that tend to perpetuate their poverty. This isn't hating on the poor (I come from a poor family, I was homeless as a teenager), rather simple recognition of a vicious cycle. What is needed is more education and compassionate outreach.
- selimthegrim 11y ago
  Yes, and how many of those people do you think have access to food at such rates save for Walmart? Ever been to an urban bodega or corner store? Do you think they're not marking food up above those rates?
  - CuriouslyC 11y ago
    I agree that "food deserts" in low income urban areas are a real problem, and it isn't really feasible to lug more than ~4 bags of groceries on a city bus (which really limits how you shop). If anything, this demonstrates a burning social need: affordable delivery of healthy food to low income families in impoverished urban areas. Logistically I don't even think it would be that hard, since you would only need to provide healthy, cheap staples. One person with a cargo van could make a huge difference!
- ptaipale 11y ago
  Fully agree. Where I live (Finland, a very expensive country) cabbage is typically 30-50 cents per kilogram (including 14 % VAT), less than half what you list. Almost everything is more expensive here, but cabbage is one of the things that is not. And it is a healthy foodstuff, like the others you list. If cabbage is more expensive in America, it's because people don't want to eat healthy food. It's not cool. But still, it is so cheap that eating too much meat and flour instead is really a choice. Perhaps people are not informed enough to make a rational choice, but nevertheless it is a choice, not something forced on them.
  - dpark 11y ago
    The price of cabbage really doesn't matter. Cabbage is healthy, but you really cannot eat enough cabbage to live on. You'd have to eat almost 17 pounds of cabbage to meet the caloric needs of a 2000 calorie diet. A pound of cabbage in a day would probably be on the upper limit of what I could stomach, even after cooking it down. (Plus it stops being cheap anyway when you look at the price per calorie.) "Eating healthy" does not mean "eating insufficient calories". You have to actually get enough calories to live. Once you start adding other healthy foods that get the calorie count to the right level, the cost starts to go up. There have been a number of studies that show it's cheaper to eat unhealthy food. You can eat healthy pretty cheaply, but you can eat unhealthy even cheaper. This is doubly true if you factor in cooking time as having some cost
    - ptaipale 11y ago
      I don't follow this logic in discourse. First there is the problem that cheap food has lots of calories but no essential nutrients and it's all the fault of those evil companies. And when you point out food that is cheap and has lots of nutrients, people come saying there are not enough calories. Hey, if you eat some of those cheap calories, but not too much. And then eat some of that cabbage and beans and whatever that has nutrients but not too much calories. I would call it "balanced diet". It's not rocket science, though it does take some brain function. Cabbage of course isn't the only healthy and cheap vegetable or other foodstuff there is.
- earlz 11y ago
  > chicken breasts are frequently around 2 dollars a pound. Minor nit pick with this.. idk about where you live, but here the only "chicken" that gets down to that price is what's called "pumped".. ie, you buy the chicken, but it's 30% chicken broth "for enhanced flavor" and so when you cook it, it ends up tasting absolutely terrible.. not to mention reducing the weight of the cooked product considerably. If you've ever tried to pan sear some chicken or something and you end up with a cup of water in your pan, this is your problem. This shit should be illegal to be sold it's so deceptive. You can tell if you have pumped chicken by looking for the "enhanced with up to 30% water/broth/liquid".. I won't buy any chicken that's "enhanced"(or with "retained water") by more than 5%. Typically that ends up selling here in Cleveland Ohio for around $5/pound or more at a run of the mill grocery store.
- dpark 11y ago
  I think some of your prices are quite low, but for comparison's sake, I'll just assume they are correct. I pulled calorie counts from the USDA and from calorieking.com 1 pound dried pinto beans - 636 Calories, $1.00 1 pound raw cabbage - 120 Calories, $0.50 1 pound frozen spinach - 108 Calories, $1.40 1 dozen large eggs - 840 Calories, $1.00 1 pound chicken breast (with skin) - 780 Calories, $2.00 Total: 2484 Calories, $5.90 or 421 Calories per dollar I went to Wal-Mart.com to find some junk food and grabbed a couple of the first items I saw that kept me to about $6 and had online availability (so I could get accurate pricing). I pulled calorie counts from the Kellog website and walmart.com since I had exact branded items. 1 dozen limited edition frosted pumpkin pie pop tarts - 2400 Calories, $3.50 13oz chips ahoy chocolate chip cookies - 1760 Calories, $2.50 Total: 4160 Calories, $6.00 or 693 Calories per dollar So assuming your prices are correct, you get 65% more food per dollar if buying name-brand junk food without even trying. You could push these prices even lower if you buy generic. You can also sub in a number of different "junk food" options and get similar results (e.g. chips look similar to the cookies, soda should work out in the same ballpark as well). [1] http://www.walmart.com/ip/Kellogg-s-Pop-Tarts-Frosted-Pumpkin-Pie-Toaster-Pastries-16ct/19890848 http://www.walmart.com/ip/Kellogg-s-Pop-Tarts-Frosted-Pumpki... [2] http://www.walmart.com/ip/Nabisco-Chips-Ahoy-Original-Chocolate-Chip-Cookies-13-oz/22880503 http://www.walmart.com/ip/Nabisco-Chips-Ahoy-Original-Chocol...
  - CuriouslyC 11y ago
    The prices I quoted were actual prices I pay for food at Kroger (not even the cheapest supermarket) in North Carolina. The food you proposed as an alternative would result in pretty bad malnutrition, so it isn't really an alternative. You might as well just compare a gallon jug of generic vegetable oil, the results in terms of health will be almost identical: 1 gallon vegetable oil, ~$5, containing ~30,000 calories, comes out to 6,000 calories per dollar. Finally, note I didn't say healthy food was cheaper than unhealthy food, only that healthy food is completely affordable. Obesity is extremely common among poor people (_far_ more so, in fact, than among the affluent), they clearly can afford a slight increase in marginal cost per calorie.
    - dpark 11y ago

CuriouslyC 11y ago

Beans are about a dollar a pound, cabbage is about 50 cents a pound, frozen spinach is around 1.40 per pound, eggs get as low as a dollar a dozen, chicken breasts are frequently around 2 dollars a pound. The argument that healthy food is not affordable is garbage. Poor people just tend to make very poor food choices, much as they make poor choices in other areas of their lives that tend to perpetuate their poverty. This isn't hating on the poor (I come from a poor family, I was homeless as a teenager), rather simple recognition of a vicious cycle. What is needed is more education and compassionate outreach.

selimthegrim 11y ago
Yes, and how many of those people do you think have access to food at such rates save for Walmart? Ever been to an urban bodega or corner store? Do you think they're not marking food up above those rates?
- CuriouslyC 11y ago
  I agree that "food deserts" in low income urban areas are a real problem, and it isn't really feasible to lug more than ~4 bags of groceries on a city bus (which really limits how you shop). If anything, this demonstrates a burning social need: affordable delivery of healthy food to low income families in impoverished urban areas. Logistically I don't even think it would be that hard, since you would only need to provide healthy, cheap staples. One person with a cargo van could make a huge difference!
ptaipale 11y ago
Fully agree. Where I live (Finland, a very expensive country) cabbage is typically 30-50 cents per kilogram (including 14 % VAT), less than half what you list. Almost everything is more expensive here, but cabbage is one of the things that is not. And it is a healthy foodstuff, like the others you list. If cabbage is more expensive in America, it's because people don't want to eat healthy food. It's not cool. But still, it is so cheap that eating too much meat and flour instead is really a choice. Perhaps people are not informed enough to make a rational choice, but nevertheless it is a choice, not something forced on them.
- dpark 11y ago
  The price of cabbage really doesn't matter. Cabbage is healthy, but you really cannot eat enough cabbage to live on. You'd have to eat almost 17 pounds of cabbage to meet the caloric needs of a 2000 calorie diet. A pound of cabbage in a day would probably be on the upper limit of what I could stomach, even after cooking it down. (Plus it stops being cheap anyway when you look at the price per calorie.) "Eating healthy" does not mean "eating insufficient calories". You have to actually get enough calories to live. Once you start adding other healthy foods that get the calorie count to the right level, the cost starts to go up. There have been a number of studies that show it's cheaper to eat unhealthy food. You can eat healthy pretty cheaply, but you can eat unhealthy even cheaper. This is doubly true if you factor in cooking time as having some cost
  - ptaipale 11y ago
    I don't follow this logic in discourse. First there is the problem that cheap food has lots of calories but no essential nutrients and it's all the fault of those evil companies. And when you point out food that is cheap and has lots of nutrients, people come saying there are not enough calories. Hey, if you eat some of those cheap calories, but not too much. And then eat some of that cabbage and beans and whatever that has nutrients but not too much calories. I would call it "balanced diet". It's not rocket science, though it does take some brain function. Cabbage of course isn't the only healthy and cheap vegetable or other foodstuff there is.
earlz 11y ago
> chicken breasts are frequently around 2 dollars a pound. Minor nit pick with this.. idk about where you live, but here the only "chicken" that gets down to that price is what's called "pumped".. ie, you buy the chicken, but it's 30% chicken broth "for enhanced flavor" and so when you cook it, it ends up tasting absolutely terrible.. not to mention reducing the weight of the cooked product considerably. If you've ever tried to pan sear some chicken or something and you end up with a cup of water in your pan, this is your problem. This shit should be illegal to be sold it's so deceptive. You can tell if you have pumped chicken by looking for the "enhanced with up to 30% water/broth/liquid".. I won't buy any chicken that's "enhanced"(or with "retained water") by more than 5%. Typically that ends up selling here in Cleveland Ohio for around $5/pound or more at a run of the mill grocery store.
dpark 11y ago
I think some of your prices are quite low, but for comparison's sake, I'll just assume they are correct. I pulled calorie counts from the USDA and from calorieking.com 1 pound dried pinto beans - 636 Calories, $1.00 1 pound raw cabbage - 120 Calories, $0.50 1 pound frozen spinach - 108 Calories, $1.40 1 dozen large eggs - 840 Calories, $1.00 1 pound chicken breast (with skin) - 780 Calories, $2.00 Total: 2484 Calories, $5.90 or 421 Calories per dollar I went to Wal-Mart.com to find some junk food and grabbed a couple of the first items I saw that kept me to about $6 and had online availability (so I could get accurate pricing). I pulled calorie counts from the Kellog website and walmart.com since I had exact branded items. 1 dozen limited edition frosted pumpkin pie pop tarts - 2400 Calories, $3.50 13oz chips ahoy chocolate chip cookies - 1760 Calories, $2.50 Total: 4160 Calories, $6.00 or 693 Calories per dollar So assuming your prices are correct, you get 65% more food per dollar if buying name-brand junk food without even trying. You could push these prices even lower if you buy generic. You can also sub in a number of different "junk food" options and get similar results (e.g. chips look similar to the cookies, soda should work out in the same ballpark as well). [1] http://www.walmart.com/ip/Kellogg-s-Pop-Tarts-Frosted-Pumpkin-Pie-Toaster-Pastries-16ct/19890848 http://www.walmart.com/ip/Kellogg-s-Pop-Tarts-Frosted-Pumpki... [2] http://www.walmart.com/ip/Nabisco-Chips-Ahoy-Original-Chocolate-Chip-Cookies-13-oz/22880503 http://www.walmart.com/ip/Nabisco-Chips-Ahoy-Original-Chocol...
- CuriouslyC 11y ago
  The prices I quoted were actual prices I pay for food at Kroger (not even the cheapest supermarket) in North Carolina. The food you proposed as an alternative would result in pretty bad malnutrition, so it isn't really an alternative. You might as well just compare a gallon jug of generic vegetable oil, the results in terms of health will be almost identical: 1 gallon vegetable oil, ~$5, containing ~30,000 calories, comes out to 6,000 calories per dollar. Finally, note I didn't say healthy food was cheaper than unhealthy food, only that healthy food is completely affordable. Obesity is extremely common among poor people (_far_ more so, in fact, than among the affluent), they clearly can afford a slight increase in marginal cost per calorie.
  - dpark 11y ago