7 ms·

EU tax probe will not affect Apple's operation in Cork – Tim Cook

34 points by mywacaday 11y ago

rashthedude 11y ago
Announce my friends...Announce.
- dvh 11y ago
  1000 is a nonce
- tychuz 11y ago
  He was writing in irish.
  - bbrazil 11y ago
    As an Irishman, both announces and announce sound fine to me.
    - irish_lad 11y ago
      As a fellow Irishman, he's referring to the misspelling at the top of this submission :)
      - dang 11y ago
        The submitted title was "Apple Annonce 1000 New Irish Jobs", but it shouldn't have been editorialized in the first place, so we've changed it to the article title.
- kmfrk 11y ago
  Damn programmers.
- scoot 11y ago
  "Apple Announces" (as in the original arrtical title) is correct since Apple, the company, is a singular entity (and would still be even if it was called "Apples"). "John announces", "the boys announce". "Annonce", as in the current submission title, is doubly incorrect.
  - robin_reala 11y ago
    Depends on British English or American English. British English generally considers companies to be collections of people e.g. ‘Apple announce that’ in the same manner as a sports team e.g. ‘Arsenal are winning’.
    - scoot 11y ago
      You're right - it seems there is a little more leeway here. "Annonce" (the typo) was what the parent comment correctly pulled up, but the original form of the verb should have been maintained in any case.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
yitchelle 11y ago
Interesting pictures of Tim Cook shaking hands in a suite and tie. Is this the start of corporatisation of Apple? BTW, this is great news for Cork.
munchor 11y ago
I think this is a great move to fight the lack of efficacy of the H1B visa program[1]. If Apple can't bring everyone they'd like to America, the only obvious option is to employ more people in Europe. Unfortunately, due to how the H1B lottery, this is what big tech companies have to start doing - expanding their offices in Europe. This way they might even get some of the people they want with the L1 visa. However, it's a shame that the H1B lottery is as it is, because startups have a really hard time hiring people. It would help startups to grow if it were easier to hire people from outside the US. As an European programmer trying to go to the US, I really hope that the US government gets rid of the lottery system. [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100
- chrisseaton 11y ago
  But it doesn't look like they'll be employing any software developers ('manufacturing, customer care, finance and global supply chain management'). I'm not sure many customer care people would normally come over on an H1B anyway.
- irish_lad 11y ago
  I'm not so sure if relating this news to the H1B visa makes sense. From the linked article, I don't think many of these are software dev roles. Additionally I'm not even sure if there is much dev work going on in their Cork plant? Would love to hear from someone in the know :)
  - threeseed 11y ago
    There's definitely some development work done on SAP, ERP and other backend systems. But it isn't your glamorous Apple Car/Apple Watch/R&D development.
- raverbashing 11y ago
  Yeah, it's hard for the serious players to get their needed H1B when "consultancy companies" clogs the system by hiring warm bodies that barely know how to write a Hello World in Java (but hey they can be allocated to "corporate projects")
dataker 11y ago
Funny parallel with this thread from yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100 Despite what the 'Valley evangelists' will say(e.g., Thiel, Andreessen,...), innovation can happen anywhere in the world.
- Kurtz79 11y ago
  ...if there is the main company in the Valley backing it up, in this case. (I sort of agree with you, BTW, but I don't think this is the best example).
- mhd 11y ago
  Erm, it's been a while since I worked there, but Apple's Cork facilities isn't where innovation is happening. Assembly, distribution and customer support. It's the equivalent of an Amazon warehouse in that regard...
lps41 11y ago
Doesn't Apple maintain their incorporation in Ireland so that they don't have to pay taxes? I remember a year or two back that Ireland began questioning Apple's tax status. I wonder if Apple agreed to hire workers in Ireland in exchange for keeping their tax status in Ireland.
- godzillabrennus 11y ago
  My understanding is that the foreign entity that acts as the haven has to be a legitimate business entity. This hiring binge aligns well with keeping that facade up.
  - raverbashing 11y ago
    Talk about a facade that hires 1000 people, it's almost like they're not even trying to pretend anymore
    - arbitrage 11y ago
      They've never tried to pretend, nor had to, because it's perfectly legal and an accepted financial standard of practice.
  - sjwright 11y ago
    Obviously Apple picked Ireland for tax reasons, but 5,000 employees is a remarkably thick facade. Compare that to 16,000 people in Cupertino — I'm pretty sure that makes Ireland Apple's largest pool of office employees outside of their HQ.
    - natrius 11y ago
      Apple's Austin campus will employ about 7000 people. http://www.techtimes.com/articles/82805/20150909/apples-austin-campus-for-7-000-employees-nears-completion.htm http://www.techtimes.com/articles/82805/20150909/apples-aust...
      - 11y ago
andyjohnson0 11y ago
Hollyhill is where Apple runs its dubious EU tax arrangements - which the European Commission says amount to illegal tax avoidance [1][2]. [1] http://uk.businessinsider.com/apple-defends-irish-tax-arrangement-2014-9?r=US&IR=T http://uk.businessinsider.com/apple-defends-irish-tax-arrang... [2] http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/29/ireland-defends-tax-dealings-with-apple http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/29/ireland-defends...
- yrro 11y ago
  > illegal tax avoidance Otherwise known as tax evasion?
  - davidandgoliath 11y ago
    No, tax avoidance. Tax evasion is illegal, this on the other hand, isn’t.
    - triplesec 11y ago
      to be fair, you can't really say that something that has been called 'illegal tax avoidance' is not illegal, unless you are bringing a counter argument. The evidence is in the very same word.
donohoe 11y ago
Energy. Does any know more about Apples investment in energy as mentioned in this?
rdlecler1 11y ago
Wanted: financial engineers to help with tax dodging...
drcross 11y ago
No amount of money is going to make me relocate to Cork from Dublin, I think a lot are going to be in the same boat.
wiredfool 11y ago
If only they would allocate a few of those jobs to an Apple store in Dublin.
- arboroia 11y ago
  Having no Apple store in the republic has always been a bit of a pain! I've had to travel to Belfast to get some things sorted at the store there.
Overtonwindow 11y ago
Since 1980? That seems suspect considering incorporation in 77' and public in 80'. I am surprised they would have a corporate presence in Ireland so soon.

34 points by mywacaday 11y ago

rashthedude 11y ago

Announce my friends...Announce.

dvh 11y ago
1000 is a nonce
tychuz 11y ago
He was writing in irish.
- bbrazil 11y ago
  As an Irishman, both announces and announce sound fine to me.
  - irish_lad 11y ago
    As a fellow Irishman, he's referring to the misspelling at the top of this submission :)
    - dang 11y ago
      The submitted title was "Apple Annonce 1000 New Irish Jobs", but it shouldn't have been editorialized in the first place, so we've changed it to the article title.
kmfrk 11y ago
Damn programmers.
scoot 11y ago
"Apple Announces" (as in the original arrtical title) is correct since Apple, the company, is a singular entity (and would still be even if it was called "Apples"). "John announces", "the boys announce". "Annonce", as in the current submission title, is doubly incorrect.
- robin_reala 11y ago
  Depends on British English or American English. British English generally considers companies to be collections of people e.g. ‘Apple announce that’ in the same manner as a sports team e.g. ‘Arsenal are winning’.
  - scoot 11y ago
    You're right - it seems there is a little more leeway here. "Annonce" (the typo) was what the parent comment correctly pulled up, but the original form of the verb should have been maintained in any case.
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

yitchelle 11y ago

Interesting pictures of Tim Cook shaking hands in a suite and tie. Is this the start of corporatisation of Apple? BTW, this is great news for Cork.

munchor 11y ago

I think this is a great move to fight the lack of efficacy of the H1B visa program[1]. If Apple can't bring everyone they'd like to America, the only obvious option is to employ more people in Europe. Unfortunately, due to how the H1B lottery, this is what big tech companies have to start doing - expanding their offices in Europe. This way they might even get some of the people they want with the L1 visa. However, it's a shame that the H1B lottery is as it is, because startups have a really hard time hiring people. It would help startups to grow if it were easier to hire people from outside the US. As an European programmer trying to go to the US, I really hope that the US government gets rid of the lottery system. [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100

chrisseaton 11y ago
But it doesn't look like they'll be employing any software developers ('manufacturing, customer care, finance and global supply chain management'). I'm not sure many customer care people would normally come over on an H1B anyway.
irish_lad 11y ago
I'm not so sure if relating this news to the H1B visa makes sense. From the linked article, I don't think many of these are software dev roles. Additionally I'm not even sure if there is much dev work going on in their Cork plant? Would love to hear from someone in the know :)
- threeseed 11y ago
  There's definitely some development work done on SAP, ERP and other backend systems. But it isn't your glamorous Apple Car/Apple Watch/R&D development.
raverbashing 11y ago
Yeah, it's hard for the serious players to get their needed H1B when "consultancy companies" clogs the system by hiring warm bodies that barely know how to write a Hello World in Java (but hey they can be allocated to "corporate projects")

dataker 11y ago

Funny parallel with this thread from yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10539100 Despite what the 'Valley evangelists' will say(e.g., Thiel, Andreessen,...), innovation can happen anywhere in the world.

Kurtz79 11y ago
...if there is the main company in the Valley backing it up, in this case. (I sort of agree with you, BTW, but I don't think this is the best example).
mhd 11y ago
Erm, it's been a while since I worked there, but Apple's Cork facilities isn't where innovation is happening. Assembly, distribution and customer support. It's the equivalent of an Amazon warehouse in that regard...

lps41 11y ago

Doesn't Apple maintain their incorporation in Ireland so that they don't have to pay taxes? I remember a year or two back that Ireland began questioning Apple's tax status. I wonder if Apple agreed to hire workers in Ireland in exchange for keeping their tax status in Ireland.

godzillabrennus 11y ago
My understanding is that the foreign entity that acts as the haven has to be a legitimate business entity. This hiring binge aligns well with keeping that facade up.
- raverbashing 11y ago
  Talk about a facade that hires 1000 people, it's almost like they're not even trying to pretend anymore
  - arbitrage 11y ago
    They've never tried to pretend, nor had to, because it's perfectly legal and an accepted financial standard of practice.
- sjwright 11y ago
  Obviously Apple picked Ireland for tax reasons, but 5,000 employees is a remarkably thick facade. Compare that to 16,000 people in Cupertino — I'm pretty sure that makes Ireland Apple's largest pool of office employees outside of their HQ.
  - natrius 11y ago
    Apple's Austin campus will employ about 7000 people. http://www.techtimes.com/articles/82805/20150909/apples-austin-campus-for-7-000-employees-nears-completion.htm http://www.techtimes.com/articles/82805/20150909/apples-aust...
    - 11y ago

andyjohnson0 11y ago

Hollyhill is where Apple runs its dubious EU tax arrangements - which the European Commission says amount to illegal tax avoidance [1][2]. [1] http://uk.businessinsider.com/apple-defends-irish-tax-arrangement-2014-9?r=US&IR=T http://uk.businessinsider.com/apple-defends-irish-tax-arrang... [2] http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/29/ireland-defends-tax-dealings-with-apple http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/29/ireland-defends...

yrro 11y ago
> illegal tax avoidance Otherwise known as tax evasion?
- davidandgoliath 11y ago
  No, tax avoidance. Tax evasion is illegal, this on the other hand, isn’t.
  - triplesec 11y ago
    to be fair, you can't really say that something that has been called 'illegal tax avoidance' is not illegal, unless you are bringing a counter argument. The evidence is in the very same word.

donohoe 11y ago

Energy. Does any know more about Apples investment in energy as mentioned in this?

rdlecler1 11y ago

Wanted: financial engineers to help with tax dodging...

drcross 11y ago

No amount of money is going to make me relocate to Cork from Dublin, I think a lot are going to be in the same boat.

wiredfool 11y ago

If only they would allocate a few of those jobs to an Apple store in Dublin.

arboroia 11y ago
Having no Apple store in the republic has always been a bit of a pain! I've had to travel to Belfast to get some things sorted at the store there.

Overtonwindow 11y ago

Since 1980? That seems suspect considering incorporation in 77' and public in 80'. I am surprised they would have a corporate presence in Ireland so soon.