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This is exactly the tactic those bullies use on their victims. "But it's okay because we're on the right side" is exactly the reasoning they use, as well.

by Zikes 11y ago

13thLetter 11y ago
That's not a globally applicable principle. Kidnapping a person and locking them in a cell is wrong when a private citizen does it, but it's right when the state does it (after properly handled arrest and a fair trial and so forth, of course.) Honestly, I used to agree with you on this, but I'm starting to think that this craziness isn't going to end until the "activists" start getting a taste of their own medicine. And it's not like they won't claim they're being persecuted anyway...
- Zikes 11y ago
  The state takes actions under reasoned and measured approaches (barring obvious bad actors), whereas the private citizen/vigilante approach historically does not practice reason or restraint in their application of justice. It's far too easy for activists and anti-activists alike to get caught up in the crusade, and it's not hard to imagine that someone names an "activist in need of a taste of their own medicine" that gets piled on before anyone realizes a mistake was made and an innocent was punished, perhaps even irreparably.
  - 13thLetter 11y ago
    Well, you're definitely right about that. But it's worth keeping in mind that vigilantism is much more likely when the state (or equivalent organization, such as the university in question) declines to enforce order.
protonfish 11y ago
But right or wrong is what is of actual importance. Your attitude of relativism is at the heart of anti-intellectualism: the belief that there is no difference between right and wrong, it's all just opinion. I do believe in right and wrong, and I believe you should fight for what is right using the best techniques you can. Saying that effective tactics should not be used because bad people also use them only disempowers those under attack.
- Zikes 11y ago
  I do believe in right and wrong, but I do not believe that there are no bad tactics, only bad targets. Internet vigilantism isn't going to work out for anybody, it'll only perpetuate the cycle without resolving the core issues.
- s73v3r 11y ago
  But who's the judge of right and wrong? And is it right to do wrong to those who are doing wrong?
chris_wot 11y ago
That's not the tactic at all. The Professor was open about who they were. The bullies were bullies not because they named the professor but because they demanded she be sacked. The professor was brave enough to put her name to her opinion. I think those opposing her should also be as brave and let their names be known and let everyone see their responses. If that is negative because of the way they expressed them, then they might see that their behaviour is not terribly acceptable.

This is exactly the tactic those bullies use on their victims. "But it's okay because we're on the right side" is exactly the reasoning they use, as well.

by Zikes 11y ago

This is exactly the tactic those bullies use on their victims. "But it's okay because we're on the right side" is exactly the reasoning they use, as well.

13thLetter 11y ago

That's not a globally applicable principle. Kidnapping a person and locking them in a cell is wrong when a private citizen does it, but it's right when the state does it (after properly handled arrest and a fair trial and so forth, of course.) Honestly, I used to agree with you on this, but I'm starting to think that this craziness isn't going to end until the "activists" start getting a taste of their own medicine. And it's not like they won't claim they're being persecuted anyway...

Zikes 11y ago
The state takes actions under reasoned and measured approaches (barring obvious bad actors), whereas the private citizen/vigilante approach historically does not practice reason or restraint in their application of justice. It's far too easy for activists and anti-activists alike to get caught up in the crusade, and it's not hard to imagine that someone names an "activist in need of a taste of their own medicine" that gets piled on before anyone realizes a mistake was made and an innocent was punished, perhaps even irreparably.
- 13thLetter 11y ago
  Well, you're definitely right about that. But it's worth keeping in mind that vigilantism is much more likely when the state (or equivalent organization, such as the university in question) declines to enforce order.

protonfish 11y ago

But right or wrong is what is of actual importance. Your attitude of relativism is at the heart of anti-intellectualism: the belief that there is no difference between right and wrong, it's all just opinion. I do believe in right and wrong, and I believe you should fight for what is right using the best techniques you can. Saying that effective tactics should not be used because bad people also use them only disempowers those under attack.

Zikes 11y ago
I do believe in right and wrong, but I do not believe that there are no bad tactics, only bad targets. Internet vigilantism isn't going to work out for anybody, it'll only perpetuate the cycle without resolving the core issues.
s73v3r 11y ago
But who's the judge of right and wrong? And is it right to do wrong to those who are doing wrong?

chris_wot 11y ago

That's not the tactic at all. The Professor was open about who they were. The bullies were bullies not because they named the professor but because they demanded she be sacked. The professor was brave enough to put her name to her opinion. I think those opposing her should also be as brave and let their names be known and let everyone see their responses. If that is negative because of the way they expressed them, then they might see that their behaviour is not terribly acceptable.