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Transatlantic roundtrip airfare for a family of 4 at a time kids will have off from school is around $5500. That's before you start getting places to sleep for

Transatlantic roundtrip airfare for a family of 4 at a time kids will have off from school is around $5500. That's before you start getting places to sleep for any appreciable amount of time, car rentals or train tickets (which are quite expensive), etc. Median income in the US is around $50,000. $7-8k is a family car, most of somebody's student loan balance, the entire electronics budget for ~5 years. You want them to piss it all away on a week or two? Fuck no. International travel is a luxury for the extremely privileged. Hell, I was pretty privileged - my parents made a total of around $110k in a low-cost-of-living city - and $3,500 for New York City was a once-in-a-lifetime treat. Granted, there are ways to do it outside of the family, like study-abroad programs. But then in addition to the cost of the vacation you're paying full tuition to not take real classes and (if you're in a field like CS) delaying graduation by a semester or more because you're not making any progress on your major. Analysts say current airline prices are hilariously, unsustainably low. It's only going to get far, far worse. EDIT: I should say that vacations are important and we do take them. We drive 10-15 hours and stay at AirBnbs in other 3rd-string US cities that, while pleasant, are not high-end tourist destinations. Nashville, Lawrence, Raleigh-Durham, Cape Cod, far-flung D.C. suburbs, etc. With a Prius and more than 2 people, driving far is cheaper than flying pretty much everywhere in the continental US.

Nadya 11y ago
Without even getting into money - try taking 2 or 3 weeks off work and see if you still have your job in most places... taking time off is a rarity in the U.S for anything short of maternity leave. Meanwhile many other countries have mandatory time off. As in "you better take off at least 21 days this year." Seriously, just take a look at this. [0] United States has 0 days off. Over half the list is >15 days. Those people have time off to go on a 2 week vacation. You might note that US workers can "earn" up to 20 days. Taking off those days is usually looked down upon and can hurt chances of promotions. Being fired shortly after returning from an "extended leave" is not unheard of. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_statutory_minimum_employment_leave_by_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_statutory_minimum_empl...
- superuser2 11y ago
  Unfortunately, many people will look at this list and tell you that's why the United States is so much more prosperous. Vacation time and workers rights == laziness in many people's minds.
- greggarious 11y ago
  Maybe Americans could stand to think critically about where they work. I work for a nonprofit here in the states. I make roughly half of what my friends who work for large companies make. On the other hand, I recently spent 2 weeks of vacation in Europe, followed by a professional conference at a large European university. (20 days total). I was not expected to work or check email while on vacation, and my supervisors viewed my job at the conference itself to be to present my research and network with professionals who can assist with our mission, not sit around in a hotel room catching up on email. As a bonus, I know my work helps people instead of lining the pockets of the upper classes. Frankly, it astounds me that so many people fixate so much on salary. (Hourly rate is a better heuristic. Talk informally to your friends about their salary and hours, and do the math yourself.)
lobster_johnson 11y ago
> Transatlantic roundtrip airfare ... is around $5500. That sounds steep to me. On a lark I checked out Norwegian's [1] prices for 2 adults, 2 children roundtrip on dates around winter break: LAX-CPH: $1,550 JFK-OSL: $1,400 Both non-stop. Of course, if you not near one of the larger transportation hubs, there'll be some additional cost. [1] https://www.norwegian.no/us/ https://www.norwegian.no/us/
- superuser2 11y ago
  Those prices sound reasonable... per person. Unfortunately the link is broken for me (403).
  - lobster_johnson 11y ago
    Those prices are the totals, for all 4 people, including taxes and surcharges. As for the link, try this one: https://www.norwegian.no/us https://www.norwegian.no/us. (I just copied it from Google, works if you from there, but not if from anywhere else — weird.)

Nadya 11y ago

Without even getting into money - try taking 2 or 3 weeks off work and see if you still have your job in most places... taking time off is a rarity in the U.S for anything short of maternity leave. Meanwhile many other countries have mandatory time off. As in "you better take off at least 21 days this year." Seriously, just take a look at this. [0] United States has 0 days off. Over half the list is >15 days. Those people have time off to go on a 2 week vacation. You might note that US workers can "earn" up to 20 days. Taking off those days is usually looked down upon and can hurt chances of promotions. Being fired shortly after returning from an "extended leave" is not unheard of. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_statutory_minimum_employment_leave_by_country https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_statutory_minimum_empl...

superuser2 11y ago
Unfortunately, many people will look at this list and tell you that's why the United States is so much more prosperous. Vacation time and workers rights == laziness in many people's minds.
greggarious 11y ago
Maybe Americans could stand to think critically about where they work. I work for a nonprofit here in the states. I make roughly half of what my friends who work for large companies make. On the other hand, I recently spent 2 weeks of vacation in Europe, followed by a professional conference at a large European university. (20 days total). I was not expected to work or check email while on vacation, and my supervisors viewed my job at the conference itself to be to present my research and network with professionals who can assist with our mission, not sit around in a hotel room catching up on email. As a bonus, I know my work helps people instead of lining the pockets of the upper classes. Frankly, it astounds me that so many people fixate so much on salary. (Hourly rate is a better heuristic. Talk informally to your friends about their salary and hours, and do the math yourself.)

lobster_johnson 11y ago

> Transatlantic roundtrip airfare ... is around $5500. That sounds steep to me. On a lark I checked out Norwegian's [1] prices for 2 adults, 2 children roundtrip on dates around winter break: LAX-CPH: $1,550 JFK-OSL: $1,400 Both non-stop. Of course, if you not near one of the larger transportation hubs, there'll be some additional cost. [1] https://www.norwegian.no/us/ https://www.norwegian.no/us/

superuser2 11y ago
Those prices sound reasonable... per person. Unfortunately the link is broken for me (403).
- lobster_johnson 11y ago
  Those prices are the totals, for all 4 people, including taxes and surcharges. As for the link, try this one: https://www.norwegian.no/us https://www.norwegian.no/us. (I just copied it from Google, works if you from there, but not if from anywhere else — weird.)