3 ms·

Salary in tech should equal output

1 points by kurtinlane 11y ago

marssaxman 11y ago
How do you measure output? It has to be meaningful, it has to be fair, and the measurement process can't cost more than you gain by super-rewarding your best people. Every performance-review process I've ever seen or participated in has failed to accomplish at least one of these, usually two.
nness 11y ago
I feel that the author has missed that a person's contributions to a company varies with time — driven by both personal changes (like parenthood or health) and environmental factors (new technology, changes to market demand, automation etc). A person's worth to the company is also entirely independent to a person's average worth to an industry. I don't think you can fairly judge whether a person's salary is merited without taking into account all the specifics of a person's role, their present life conditions, and how the business is operating. Also, this kind of model is destined to drive salaries down. I know I'd be upset if my salary dropped at the whim of averages. I like that my salary remains constant, even if the business is going through a slump, and I like that I can make the case for an increase if I see it going through growth. It also completely ignores that sometimes people salaries are set to attract new talent. Particularly if that talent is being poached from a competitor. Sure, may not seem fair, but all employment and remuneration is about circumstance anyway.
- kurtinlane 11y ago
  I agree the author has missed some key points and the author's thought process is not fully baked. However he does offer an interesting take on salary. The idealist in me agrees that we should be compensated for the value we offer, it then motivates us to provide more value. But the realist in me says the implementation of this ideal will always be broken and end up screwing the value providers. I am interested in having salary information public. This kind of transparency will force employers to have clear steps on how to get a pay raise, and have valid reasons for why Developer X get paid more than developer Y.
smt88 11y ago
There is a massive body of research spanning the last 100 years that shows that meritocracy is an impossible myth. Humans are too easily swayed by their biases. There's no reasonable way for a human to accurately measure "outout". What does that even mean for a developer? Sometimes I write 10 lines of code a day, and they're unbelievably clever. Sometimes I write 2,000 lines of terrible code. Sometimes the quality of that code matters eventually, and sometimes it doesn't. Even I can't tell, on any given day, what my "output" is. This article is also essentially arguing against equal opportunity laws in the US, which I think is obviously something that we needed and moved us forwarded as a society. Reading this felt like reading the thoughts of a naive 15-year-old who doesn't understand how society works and why we've made the changes we've made.
kurtinlane 11y ago
This would be awesome if output could be measure fairly but the implementation will always suck. There is no clear way to measure output for a developer.

1 points by kurtinlane 11y ago

How do you measure output? It has to be meaningful, it has to be fair, and the measurement process can't cost more than you gain by super-rewarding your best people. Every performance-review process I've ever seen or participated in has failed to accomplish at least one of these, usually two.

nness 11y ago

I feel that the author has missed that a person's contributions to a company varies with time — driven by both personal changes (like parenthood or health) and environmental factors (new technology, changes to market demand, automation etc). A person's worth to the company is also entirely independent to a person's average worth to an industry. I don't think you can fairly judge whether a person's salary is merited without taking into account all the specifics of a person's role, their present life conditions, and how the business is operating. Also, this kind of model is destined to drive salaries down. I know I'd be upset if my salary dropped at the whim of averages. I like that my salary remains constant, even if the business is going through a slump, and I like that I can make the case for an increase if I see it going through growth. It also completely ignores that sometimes people salaries are set to attract new talent. Particularly if that talent is being poached from a competitor. Sure, may not seem fair, but all employment and remuneration is about circumstance anyway.

kurtinlane 11y ago
I agree the author has missed some key points and the author's thought process is not fully baked. However he does offer an interesting take on salary. The idealist in me agrees that we should be compensated for the value we offer, it then motivates us to provide more value. But the realist in me says the implementation of this ideal will always be broken and end up screwing the value providers. I am interested in having salary information public. This kind of transparency will force employers to have clear steps on how to get a pay raise, and have valid reasons for why Developer X get paid more than developer Y.

smt88 11y ago

There is a massive body of research spanning the last 100 years that shows that meritocracy is an impossible myth. Humans are too easily swayed by their biases. There's no reasonable way for a human to accurately measure "outout". What does that even mean for a developer? Sometimes I write 10 lines of code a day, and they're unbelievably clever. Sometimes I write 2,000 lines of terrible code. Sometimes the quality of that code matters eventually, and sometimes it doesn't. Even I can't tell, on any given day, what my "output" is. This article is also essentially arguing against equal opportunity laws in the US, which I think is obviously something that we needed and moved us forwarded as a society. Reading this felt like reading the thoughts of a naive 15-year-old who doesn't understand how society works and why we've made the changes we've made.

kurtinlane 11y ago

This would be awesome if output could be measure fairly but the implementation will always suck. There is no clear way to measure output for a developer.