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Except the positions for making a decent living are already taken. And please don't blame only third world citizens - most of the time they're just grunts, the

Except the positions for making a decent living are already taken. And please don't blame only third world citizens - most of the time they're just grunts, the masterminds are usually in the countries where cards are actually stolen from (i.e. first world, rich, etc.)

studentrob 11y ago
It's hard to get a job, therefore I steal? Sorry, I don't buy it. We don't know exactly the details of how these scams are happening or who is conscious of what they're doing. However, whoever does control the details of setting up on AWS can certainly make a living wage elsewhere. Stealing is not acceptable within any society. We are all human beings, we share this earth, let's share not steal.
- Kalium 11y ago
  Imagine that you're smart, young, and faced with an awkward choice. You can live your life in an impoverished place, ekeing out a living producing mud in Elbonia. Or you can steal money from people who, from your perspective, have TONS. People who aren't even near you anyway, and who according to local thought are evil and oppressing you. Plus, that's a lot of money to you. Now couple it with the gang aspect.
  - studentrob 11y ago
    I don't have to eke out a living making mud. I know how to work with AWS. I can find a job working for a web development shop and teach myself new skills along the way. I don't know what you mean by gang aspect. Yes organized crime exists and forces people to participate. Are you saying there's a high likelihood that the people who set up these scams are being forced to do it by a gang? I don't know anything about the likelihood of that. As far as I know, all participants in tech criminal rings are willing. If people are being forced to join against their will, someone should shed light on that.
- throwaway2048 11y ago
  Crime is unquestionably coorlated with poverty, you can't just dismiss that with banal moralizations of how BAD these people are and how they ought live properly. If you want to solve most crime issues in a real way, stop it from being the only choice many people have to "get ahead" or even survive.
  - studentrob 11y ago
    I agree with you wholeheartedly. > If you want to solve most crime issues in a real way, stop it from being the only choice many people have to "get ahead" or even survive Globalization provides more international tech jobs daily. Governments and businesses are opening schools across the world to teach towards these jobs and try to keep pace with the growing population. Internet access for self-training is accessible in many third world countries. This infrastructure doesn't build itself. Most people will contribute towards making it better. > Crime is unquestionably coorlated with poverty, you can't just dismiss that with banal moralizations of how BAD these people are I'm not. We don't know the details here but we can make an educated guess. We know that someone in this operation knows how to work with AWS. We also know that there are tech jobs in every country. We don't know exactly what the job opportunities are like in the area of the actual thief who knows what he's doing, but we can imagine there is a tech job they could land. Let us not call theft acceptable when there is evidence that the thief seems to have the skill to get a decent job.
- prodmerc 11y ago
  Hey, I agree with that. But the fact is that people steal and will continue stealing. Especially when they can't get a job, which is an extremely bad situation. From the top to the bottom, everybody steals, but only the pawns take the fall when the time comes. Look for the head of a problem (and cut it off), not it's tail...
  - studentrob 11y ago
    With the skill of this scheme it's likely the perpetrator could land a job. Maybe not the best job, but some job. Yes of course people steal, and it is forgivable. Nonetheless, it's not legal anywhere. Most of us do not knowingly make an entire living out of stealing while we could be pursuing legitimate job opportunities elsewhere. Everyone makes their own choices. > From the top to the bottom, everybody steals Everyone does not steal for a living. Most people contribute towards making happier communities. Are people perfect? No. If I see one criminal get away with a crime in my community, does that justify my criminal behavior? Do two wrongs make a right? > only the pawns take the fall when the time comes. Look for the head of a problem (and cut it off), not it's tail... That is case by case and you cannot say it is always the tail. CEOs and presidents alike have been fired, jailed or forced from office.

studentrob 11y ago

It's hard to get a job, therefore I steal? Sorry, I don't buy it. We don't know exactly the details of how these scams are happening or who is conscious of what they're doing. However, whoever does control the details of setting up on AWS can certainly make a living wage elsewhere. Stealing is not acceptable within any society. We are all human beings, we share this earth, let's share not steal.

Kalium 11y ago
Imagine that you're smart, young, and faced with an awkward choice. You can live your life in an impoverished place, ekeing out a living producing mud in Elbonia. Or you can steal money from people who, from your perspective, have TONS. People who aren't even near you anyway, and who according to local thought are evil and oppressing you. Plus, that's a lot of money to you. Now couple it with the gang aspect.
- studentrob 11y ago
  I don't have to eke out a living making mud. I know how to work with AWS. I can find a job working for a web development shop and teach myself new skills along the way. I don't know what you mean by gang aspect. Yes organized crime exists and forces people to participate. Are you saying there's a high likelihood that the people who set up these scams are being forced to do it by a gang? I don't know anything about the likelihood of that. As far as I know, all participants in tech criminal rings are willing. If people are being forced to join against their will, someone should shed light on that.
throwaway2048 11y ago
Crime is unquestionably coorlated with poverty, you can't just dismiss that with banal moralizations of how BAD these people are and how they ought live properly. If you want to solve most crime issues in a real way, stop it from being the only choice many people have to "get ahead" or even survive.
- studentrob 11y ago
  I agree with you wholeheartedly. > If you want to solve most crime issues in a real way, stop it from being the only choice many people have to "get ahead" or even survive Globalization provides more international tech jobs daily. Governments and businesses are opening schools across the world to teach towards these jobs and try to keep pace with the growing population. Internet access for self-training is accessible in many third world countries. This infrastructure doesn't build itself. Most people will contribute towards making it better. > Crime is unquestionably coorlated with poverty, you can't just dismiss that with banal moralizations of how BAD these people are I'm not. We don't know the details here but we can make an educated guess. We know that someone in this operation knows how to work with AWS. We also know that there are tech jobs in every country. We don't know exactly what the job opportunities are like in the area of the actual thief who knows what he's doing, but we can imagine there is a tech job they could land. Let us not call theft acceptable when there is evidence that the thief seems to have the skill to get a decent job.
prodmerc 11y ago
Hey, I agree with that. But the fact is that people steal and will continue stealing. Especially when they can't get a job, which is an extremely bad situation. From the top to the bottom, everybody steals, but only the pawns take the fall when the time comes. Look for the head of a problem (and cut it off), not it's tail...
- studentrob 11y ago
  With the skill of this scheme it's likely the perpetrator could land a job. Maybe not the best job, but some job. Yes of course people steal, and it is forgivable. Nonetheless, it's not legal anywhere. Most of us do not knowingly make an entire living out of stealing while we could be pursuing legitimate job opportunities elsewhere. Everyone makes their own choices. > From the top to the bottom, everybody steals Everyone does not steal for a living. Most people contribute towards making happier communities. Are people perfect? No. If I see one criminal get away with a crime in my community, does that justify my criminal behavior? Do two wrongs make a right? > only the pawns take the fall when the time comes. Look for the head of a problem (and cut it off), not it's tail... That is case by case and you cannot say it is always the tail. CEOs and presidents alike have been fired, jailed or forced from office.