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> the only way we get decent jobs and favorable social and family conditions is by letting people fulfill their own dreams through hard work and less government

by creshal 11y ago

> the only way we get decent jobs and favorable social and family conditions is by letting people fulfill their own dreams through hard work and less government intervention We tried that during the industrial revolution. Didn't quite work out that way…

TeMPOraL 11y ago
Indeed. It's ironic how the new generation forgets that their grandparents and their grandparents' grandparents fought and bled so that we may enjoy somewhat stable and abuse-free employment today. Entrepreneurs will always complain about government intervention and will always spin dreams of better future "if only we could get that pesky government out of the way", but the truth is this future will be delivered only to few, and the rest will pay in blood and tears. We've been there. Be careful what you wish for - you may actually get it.
curiousgeorgio 11y ago
There's a role for government to play in ensuring public safety and transparency, in addition to providing national defense and perhaps a few fundamental infrastructure services. To function effectively in those areas, we don't need them trying to manage the finances of everyone, nor picking and choosing who should or shouldn't be deserving of tax breaks, subsidies, or any of the other countless benefit programs. When people are out of work or large classes of people are struggling to get by, it's because we haven't provided a suitable environment in which people can thrive (and yes, most people can and will thrive through their own action in a healthy environment), not because the government has somehow failed to give people enough prosperity. If it were a traditional business (without the ability to print money or use military force), the U.S. government would frankly be one of the most disastrous companies ever imagined - not just bankrupt (many times over), but mismanaged, fraudulent, and corrupt. A huge portion of our paychecks go to support this company today. And we want more of it?
- creshal 11y ago
  Are you listening, or are you posting copypasta?
  - curiousgeorgio 11y ago
    A constructive argument might be more appropriate than simply trying to deliver an insult in your comment.
    - creshal 11y ago
      I'm just confused, because you didn't address anything in my comment, you're just spewing right-wing propaganda. We tried "small government", it failed horribly and lead to widespread misery and avoidable deaths. How do you plan to make a "small government" without repeating past mistakes?
      - curiousgeorgio 11y ago
        I did address your reference to the industrial revolution indirectly, but perhaps I didn't make myself clear. The industrial revolution had numerous positive outcomes including more jobs, increased productivity, and a strong economy. Yes, it also uncovered some serious problems, many of which were addressed by the government (e.g., child labor laws, better working conditions, etc). In my opinion, those are valid areas of government involvement (hence my point about government ensuring public safety), but that's a far cry from the kind of government intervention we're seeing today. If we failed anything with small government as you say, those things were growing pains that we would have experienced with a government of any scale. I guess what I'm saying is that it's unfair to blame "small government" for the problems exposed during the industrial revolution.

by creshal 11y ago

TeMPOraL 11y ago

Indeed. It's ironic how the new generation forgets that their grandparents and their grandparents' grandparents fought and bled so that we may enjoy somewhat stable and abuse-free employment today. Entrepreneurs will always complain about government intervention and will always spin dreams of better future "if only we could get that pesky government out of the way", but the truth is this future will be delivered only to few, and the rest will pay in blood and tears. We've been there. Be careful what you wish for - you may actually get it.

curiousgeorgio 11y ago

There's a role for government to play in ensuring public safety and transparency, in addition to providing national defense and perhaps a few fundamental infrastructure services. To function effectively in those areas, we don't need them trying to manage the finances of everyone, nor picking and choosing who should or shouldn't be deserving of tax breaks, subsidies, or any of the other countless benefit programs. When people are out of work or large classes of people are struggling to get by, it's because we haven't provided a suitable environment in which people can thrive (and yes, most people can and will thrive through their own action in a healthy environment), not because the government has somehow failed to give people enough prosperity. If it were a traditional business (without the ability to print money or use military force), the U.S. government would frankly be one of the most disastrous companies ever imagined - not just bankrupt (many times over), but mismanaged, fraudulent, and corrupt. A huge portion of our paychecks go to support this company today. And we want more of it?

creshal 11y ago
Are you listening, or are you posting copypasta?
- curiousgeorgio 11y ago
  A constructive argument might be more appropriate than simply trying to deliver an insult in your comment.
  - creshal 11y ago
    I'm just confused, because you didn't address anything in my comment, you're just spewing right-wing propaganda. We tried "small government", it failed horribly and lead to widespread misery and avoidable deaths. How do you plan to make a "small government" without repeating past mistakes?
    - curiousgeorgio 11y ago
      I did address your reference to the industrial revolution indirectly, but perhaps I didn't make myself clear. The industrial revolution had numerous positive outcomes including more jobs, increased productivity, and a strong economy. Yes, it also uncovered some serious problems, many of which were addressed by the government (e.g., child labor laws, better working conditions, etc). In my opinion, those are valid areas of government involvement (hence my point about government ensuring public safety), but that's a far cry from the kind of government intervention we're seeing today. If we failed anything with small government as you say, those things were growing pains that we would have experienced with a government of any scale. I guess what I'm saying is that it's unfair to blame "small government" for the problems exposed during the industrial revolution.