4 ms·

As soon as I saw this comment, my first thought was "Holy crap. That sounds like Russia."

krasin 11y ago
It's indeed very similar to the description of the contemporary rural Russia (excluding the suburbs of Moscow, and few other large cities). There's one important difference: there's no free public health care in the US. Not that it's great in Russia, but the US has none. :(
- sologoub 11y ago
  That's not entirely true. Hospitals here are not allowed to turn away those in need, even if they have no insurance. The stays usually turn into uncollectible debts for the hospitals. With obamacare (Affordable Healthcare Act), the free options have been expanded quite a bit. In CA, the medi-cal is basically universally available to low income ($16,105 or under for 1 person, $21k or under for 2 person housefolds). For Russia, if really depends how lucky you get with the doctors or how much you can pay. For much of the system there, people would be better off if it didn't exist. Speaking from personal experience.
  - finance-geek 11y ago
    "The stays usually turn into uncollectible debts for the hospitals." --> "The stays turn into bankruptcy for the patients" Incidentally the leading cause of personal bankruptcy in the US is unpayable hospital bills. For those outside the US, here is how it works: a simple visit to the doctor for antibiotics (the ER, since that becomes your only option) turns into a $1200 bill.
    - sologoub 11y ago
      People in that situation rarely have assets that can be seized, so a bankruptcy is meaningless. You also missed that Obamacare really does take care of a large chunk of the problem, as flawed as it is. The paid options with large assistance (Silver plans) are also fairly affordable. I'm not familiar with non-CA options, but can't imagine them to be that much different from CA ones.
      - unprepare 11y ago
        >People in that situation rarely have assets that can be seized, so a bankruptcy is meaningless. Until they want to purchase a home, purchase a car, pass a credit check to get a job, get a credit card, get a loan, start a business, or get a cell phone. remember that a bankruptcy stays on your credit report for 7 years. I would say having a job and a home are far from 'meaningless'
    - ajuc 11y ago
      > a simple visit to the doctor for antibiotics (the ER, since that becomes your only option) turns into a $1200 bill. WOW. It's like $10-$20 in private clinic here. Or free if you want to wait for a few hours.
      - galfarragem 11y ago
        Living in East Europe and work in IT to an abroad company (aka getting a super inflationed sallary) is the sweet spot of sustainable life quality - nowadays is probably the best you can find in the world. Be thankful. What for do I want to receive 100K in the Bay area and pay an huge amount of money to get a decent house, health care, safety and schooling for my kids?
  - vacri 11y ago
    "free public health" also means preventative healthcare, not just ER visits.
  - dragonwriter 11y ago
    Emergency rooms must stabilize patients regardless of ability to pay; outside of that, outside of ERs doing stabilization, hospitals are not obligated to serve without reference to ability to pay. And the ACA Medicaid expansion is something States can opt out of (for to a Supreme Court ruling) and several states have.
  - unprepare 11y ago
    >Hospitals here are not allowed to turn away those in need, even if they have no insurance. What about the mentally ill unable to afford any mental health treatment or prescription coverage? What about the terminally ill who will be turned away unless they wait until they are in critical or unstable condition (costing the hospital vastly more in treatment costs and endangering lives)? Also, please speak to the statistics that show health care as the leading cause of bankruptcies in the US. If free care is so available, is it pure ignorance that is causing 3 of every 5 bankruptcies in the US?
- briandear 11y ago
  Medicaid provides care for the poor. Thus the myth 'there is no free public healthcare' is false. Although technically, no care is free-- someone pays.
crdoconnor 11y ago
It isn't a coincidence. Post-1991 Russia and the US have shared some economic advisors (e.g. Larry Summers).

It's indeed very similar to the description of the contemporary rural Russia (excluding the suburbs of Moscow, and few other large cities). There's one important difference: there's no free public health care in the US. Not that it's great in Russia, but the US has none. :(

sologoub 11y ago
That's not entirely true. Hospitals here are not allowed to turn away those in need, even if they have no insurance. The stays usually turn into uncollectible debts for the hospitals. With obamacare (Affordable Healthcare Act), the free options have been expanded quite a bit. In CA, the medi-cal is basically universally available to low income ($16,105 or under for 1 person, $21k or under for 2 person housefolds). For Russia, if really depends how lucky you get with the doctors or how much you can pay. For much of the system there, people would be better off if it didn't exist. Speaking from personal experience.
- finance-geek 11y ago
  "The stays usually turn into uncollectible debts for the hospitals." --> "The stays turn into bankruptcy for the patients" Incidentally the leading cause of personal bankruptcy in the US is unpayable hospital bills. For those outside the US, here is how it works: a simple visit to the doctor for antibiotics (the ER, since that becomes your only option) turns into a $1200 bill.
  - sologoub 11y ago
    People in that situation rarely have assets that can be seized, so a bankruptcy is meaningless. You also missed that Obamacare really does take care of a large chunk of the problem, as flawed as it is. The paid options with large assistance (Silver plans) are also fairly affordable. I'm not familiar with non-CA options, but can't imagine them to be that much different from CA ones.
    - unprepare 11y ago
      >People in that situation rarely have assets that can be seized, so a bankruptcy is meaningless. Until they want to purchase a home, purchase a car, pass a credit check to get a job, get a credit card, get a loan, start a business, or get a cell phone. remember that a bankruptcy stays on your credit report for 7 years. I would say having a job and a home are far from 'meaningless'
  - ajuc 11y ago
    > a simple visit to the doctor for antibiotics (the ER, since that becomes your only option) turns into a $1200 bill. WOW. It's like $10-$20 in private clinic here. Or free if you want to wait for a few hours.
    - galfarragem 11y ago
      Living in East Europe and work in IT to an abroad company (aka getting a super inflationed sallary) is the sweet spot of sustainable life quality - nowadays is probably the best you can find in the world. Be thankful. What for do I want to receive 100K in the Bay area and pay an huge amount of money to get a decent house, health care, safety and schooling for my kids?
- vacri 11y ago
  "free public health" also means preventative healthcare, not just ER visits.
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  Emergency rooms must stabilize patients regardless of ability to pay; outside of that, outside of ERs doing stabilization, hospitals are not obligated to serve without reference to ability to pay. And the ACA Medicaid expansion is something States can opt out of (for to a Supreme Court ruling) and several states have.
- unprepare 11y ago
  >Hospitals here are not allowed to turn away those in need, even if they have no insurance. What about the mentally ill unable to afford any mental health treatment or prescription coverage? What about the terminally ill who will be turned away unless they wait until they are in critical or unstable condition (costing the hospital vastly more in treatment costs and endangering lives)? Also, please speak to the statistics that show health care as the leading cause of bankruptcies in the US. If free care is so available, is it pure ignorance that is causing 3 of every 5 bankruptcies in the US?
briandear 11y ago
Medicaid provides care for the poor. Thus the myth 'there is no free public healthcare' is false. Although technically, no care is free-- someone pays.

crdoconnor 11y ago

It isn't a coincidence. Post-1991 Russia and the US have shared some economic advisors (e.g. Larry Summers).