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When talking about the dropout rate, I imagine a lot of detractors don't think about people like me. I often register for tons of MOOCs just so I can have an ar

When talking about the dropout rate, I imagine a lot of detractors don't think about people like me. I often register for tons of MOOCs just so I can have an archive of the material and assignments for later. I often don't have time to do things on top of my graduate studies, but I'd still like to take that course on data structures, that interesting series on complex analysis, and the course on functional programming in Scala. I hardly ever do things "on time" with MOOCs, but the amount of things I've learned from them is amazing.

sanderjd 11y ago
Yeah, while there may be a real issue with effectiveness of online courses, the entire concept of "dropping out" is anachronistic. I always feel slightly bad to know that I'm part of "the drop-out problem", but I feel like learning a-la carte and at one's own pace is exactly in line with the unique advantages of online courses. I think the truth that people are getting at when they discuss this is that the sort of self-education that you and I like using these courses for is not at all a replacement for traditional education. I think this "problem" will vanish once it is widely recognized that these are more useful to augment ongoing self-education. It is easier than ever to be a lifelong learner, and that is a great thing and plenty of justification for the existence of these courses.
- jacalata 11y ago
  The concept of dropping out will remain an issue until they stop talking about how many students are enrolled.
  - VLM 11y ago
    The entire metric system is broken top to bottom. Wobbleblob wrote about the joy of learning, I feel the same, although I get my fix listening to audiobook lectures for the last quarter century or so. A lot of people like wobbleblob and I write about the joy of consuming quality educational resources. Nobody writes about the joy of assignments and exams. If you think its unusually rare that I'm listening to a university lecture series about Russian Literature on my commutes right now, imagine how even rarer it is to find someone who enjoys writing exams about Russian Literature. You might get a hundred thousand people like me to sign up for the good parts, the lectures. Good luck getting a thousand of us who are really bored to jump thru the hoops. That's the fundamental problem with the MOOC market now, the metrics for success are things the consumers don't care about. I enjoyed the Scala class videos from a couple years ago, learned a little too. Unfortunately the metrics for success on the corporate side are meaningless such as how many signed up, how many jumped thru all the hoops in the limited amount of time, and the ratio of the above. Until the consumer goals and the corporate metric goals align, if ever, there will be endless hand wringing articles about how awful the metric results are and why won't the consumers cooperate? There is an even worse problem in that a good class sabotages its own metrics. If my lecture series is any good at all, if its motivational, inspirational, exciting, when I'm done listening I'm going to read some Dostoevsky, not fill out some boring quiz or write an exam essay so someone can get a good metric result and I can get ... nothing?
  - sanderjd 11y ago
    Totally agree. Both "enrollment" and "drop-out" are anachronistic when discussing online education.
- bphogan 11y ago
  As a teacher, nothing makes me sadder than to see people not complete. It feels like I failed to keep them engaged. I taught a free software development course online for three summers in a row. Completion was awful. To be blunt, I won't waste my time preparing videos, material, assessments, etc anymore because it feels like nobody cares.
  - aidenn0 11y ago
    How were the raw numbers (versus percentages). On the absurd side, if 99.9% of a class of a million drop out, you're still reaching more people than a lecture hall of 100 where only a few drop out.
  - sanderjd 11y ago
    Don't be dejected! If your materials are good, people will continue learning from them, regardless of whether or not they finished the course. One of the major advantages of digital courseware is that you can take it on your own time at your own pace. Doing so is not an indication of not caring.

sanderjd 11y ago

Yeah, while there may be a real issue with effectiveness of online courses, the entire concept of "dropping out" is anachronistic. I always feel slightly bad to know that I'm part of "the drop-out problem", but I feel like learning a-la carte and at one's own pace is exactly in line with the unique advantages of online courses. I think the truth that people are getting at when they discuss this is that the sort of self-education that you and I like using these courses for is not at all a replacement for traditional education. I think this "problem" will vanish once it is widely recognized that these are more useful to augment ongoing self-education. It is easier than ever to be a lifelong learner, and that is a great thing and plenty of justification for the existence of these courses.

jacalata 11y ago
The concept of dropping out will remain an issue until they stop talking about how many students are enrolled.
- VLM 11y ago
  The entire metric system is broken top to bottom. Wobbleblob wrote about the joy of learning, I feel the same, although I get my fix listening to audiobook lectures for the last quarter century or so. A lot of people like wobbleblob and I write about the joy of consuming quality educational resources. Nobody writes about the joy of assignments and exams. If you think its unusually rare that I'm listening to a university lecture series about Russian Literature on my commutes right now, imagine how even rarer it is to find someone who enjoys writing exams about Russian Literature. You might get a hundred thousand people like me to sign up for the good parts, the lectures. Good luck getting a thousand of us who are really bored to jump thru the hoops. That's the fundamental problem with the MOOC market now, the metrics for success are things the consumers don't care about. I enjoyed the Scala class videos from a couple years ago, learned a little too. Unfortunately the metrics for success on the corporate side are meaningless such as how many signed up, how many jumped thru all the hoops in the limited amount of time, and the ratio of the above. Until the consumer goals and the corporate metric goals align, if ever, there will be endless hand wringing articles about how awful the metric results are and why won't the consumers cooperate? There is an even worse problem in that a good class sabotages its own metrics. If my lecture series is any good at all, if its motivational, inspirational, exciting, when I'm done listening I'm going to read some Dostoevsky, not fill out some boring quiz or write an exam essay so someone can get a good metric result and I can get ... nothing?
- sanderjd 11y ago
  Totally agree. Both "enrollment" and "drop-out" are anachronistic when discussing online education.
bphogan 11y ago
As a teacher, nothing makes me sadder than to see people not complete. It feels like I failed to keep them engaged. I taught a free software development course online for three summers in a row. Completion was awful. To be blunt, I won't waste my time preparing videos, material, assessments, etc anymore because it feels like nobody cares.
- aidenn0 11y ago
  How were the raw numbers (versus percentages). On the absurd side, if 99.9% of a class of a million drop out, you're still reaching more people than a lecture hall of 100 where only a few drop out.
- sanderjd 11y ago
  Don't be dejected! If your materials are good, people will continue learning from them, regardless of whether or not they finished the course. One of the major advantages of digital courseware is that you can take it on your own time at your own pace. Doing so is not an indication of not caring.