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I'm objecting to the implication that we should be thankful that the people of Papua New Guinea have been "converted" to a different system of beliefs. The "co

I'm objecting to the implication that we should be thankful that the people of Papua New Guinea have been "converted" to a different system of beliefs. The "conversion" of various indigenous peoples to essentially a western system of beliefs is what I find disagreeable. Proselytization events such as these have resulted in a significant loss to the preservation of various cultures (and languages) around the world and I feel have contributed to a loss of identity especially among indigenous or aboriginal communities. Forgive me if I seem overly sensitive to this, but some of my ancestors got to experience this "wondrous conversion" firsthand and it leaves me with a bitter taste in my mouth.

placeybordeaux 11y ago
Oh I interperted the use of "thankful" here as in relation to the cause, not in relation to being thankful.
- sbierwagen 11y ago
  Your previous reading was correct.
sbierwagen 11y ago
"Thanks" is not being used to imply thankfulness in that sentence. Synonyms here would be "because of" or "due to".
mc32 11y ago
A bit of a nitpick, but Christianity and Judaism Islam are middle eastern belief systems. They also heavily disrupted western thought for nearly two millennia. But they are not endemic of the west, but an imposition, albeit, now voluntary, but with also a terrible and violent history against the native western traditions.
- binarycrusader 11y ago
  I'm well aware that some might consider them "middle-eastern", which is why I said "essentially" a western system of beliefs given that the representation of them today is more reflective of current "western" culture than how they originated.
wanderingstan 11y ago
The "thanks" threw me for a second too, but like placeybordeaux, I believe it's being used in a merely causal sense. E.g. "Thanks to all the rain we’ve been having this summer the grass and dirt outside are often muddy."
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
ScottBurson 11y ago
It's not clear to me what the writer was thinking. It might be just a causal attribution as others here are suggesting, or it might have a connotation of approval. Anyway, I think you're making an important point that shouldn't be lost. There is a great arrogance in thinking we know how other people should live.
aaron695 11y ago
Although the word also threw me when I read the article I thought it was possibly a negative thanks. I think you are reading to much into it. > The "conversion" of various indigenous peoples to essentially a western system of beliefs is what I find disagreeable. Keeping people in a zoo is more disagreeable to me. This liberal idea of keeping tribal cultural of any kind around is incredibly disturbing. We should not be using the communities poorest children for instance as repositories of language. As a rich, educated person I would never want my child to learn a dead language. Even Latin with it's ivory status. Their future will be hard enough.
- binarycrusader 11y ago
  Keeping people in a zoo is more disagreeable to me. This liberal idea of keeping tribal cultural of any kind around is incredibly disturbing. What does conversion of people to a western system of beliefs have to do with keeping people in a zoo? No one said anything about keeping people there; what I take issue with is the coerced or forced conversion of people. We should not be using the communities poorest children for instance as repositories of language. I don't think anyone implied that, I have no idea how you've extrapolated that idea from the statements made. As a rich, educated person I would never want my child to learn a dead language. Even Latin with it's ivory status. Their future will be hard enough. I fail to see what your socioeconomic status has to do with this conversation. Regardless, "dead" languages are not at issue here. Even if they were, understanding languages that are no longer in common use is important in understanding the past of humanity. I only object to the active discouragement of learning. Learning for the sake of gaining knowledge itself seems like a reasonably admirable trait.

placeybordeaux 11y ago

Oh I interperted the use of "thankful" here as in relation to the cause, not in relation to being thankful.

sbierwagen 11y ago
Your previous reading was correct.

sbierwagen 11y ago

"Thanks" is not being used to imply thankfulness in that sentence. Synonyms here would be "because of" or "due to".

mc32 11y ago

A bit of a nitpick, but Christianity and Judaism Islam are middle eastern belief systems. They also heavily disrupted western thought for nearly two millennia. But they are not endemic of the west, but an imposition, albeit, now voluntary, but with also a terrible and violent history against the native western traditions.

binarycrusader 11y ago
I'm well aware that some might consider them "middle-eastern", which is why I said "essentially" a western system of beliefs given that the representation of them today is more reflective of current "western" culture than how they originated.

wanderingstan 11y ago

The "thanks" threw me for a second too, but like placeybordeaux, I believe it's being used in a merely causal sense. E.g. "Thanks to all the rain we’ve been having this summer the grass and dirt outside are often muddy."

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

ScottBurson 11y ago

It's not clear to me what the writer was thinking. It might be just a causal attribution as others here are suggesting, or it might have a connotation of approval. Anyway, I think you're making an important point that shouldn't be lost. There is a great arrogance in thinking we know how other people should live.

aaron695 11y ago

Although the word also threw me when I read the article I thought it was possibly a negative thanks. I think you are reading to much into it. > The "conversion" of various indigenous peoples to essentially a western system of beliefs is what I find disagreeable. Keeping people in a zoo is more disagreeable to me. This liberal idea of keeping tribal cultural of any kind around is incredibly disturbing. We should not be using the communities poorest children for instance as repositories of language. As a rich, educated person I would never want my child to learn a dead language. Even Latin with it's ivory status. Their future will be hard enough.

binarycrusader 11y ago
Keeping people in a zoo is more disagreeable to me. This liberal idea of keeping tribal cultural of any kind around is incredibly disturbing. What does conversion of people to a western system of beliefs have to do with keeping people in a zoo? No one said anything about keeping people there; what I take issue with is the coerced or forced conversion of people. We should not be using the communities poorest children for instance as repositories of language. I don't think anyone implied that, I have no idea how you've extrapolated that idea from the statements made. As a rich, educated person I would never want my child to learn a dead language. Even Latin with it's ivory status. Their future will be hard enough. I fail to see what your socioeconomic status has to do with this conversation. Regardless, "dead" languages are not at issue here. Even if they were, understanding languages that are no longer in common use is important in understanding the past of humanity. I only object to the active discouragement of learning. Learning for the sake of gaining knowledge itself seems like a reasonably admirable trait.