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Three years later, this is still an amazing story. It has less to do with wine than with the ease with which certain types of people can be separated from their

Three years later, this is still an amazing story. It has less to do with wine than with the ease with which certain types of people can be separated from their money. For the exceptionally curious, the message board thread referenced in the article is still up: http://www.wineberserkers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=61172 http://www.wineberserkers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6117...

mikekchar 11y ago
Wine is an area ripe for fraud. I seem to have inherited a fairly good palette from my mother. I'm probably a super taster for some things (which is often annoying as some smells are enough to strike me down when most other people can't even detect them). Although I'm not super serious about it, I enjoy wine and have been part of some wine appreciation societies. There are a lot of people who are really passionate and knowledgeable about wine. They are true experts in the area, but it is striking how often it becomes apparent that they have a really serious physical handicap -- they can't taste the wine. I'd like to invoke Dunning Kruger here, because these experts are usually completely unaware that they can not taste the wine. However, it is much more complicated than that. As an example, imagine that you went to an art gallery. A crowd of people are gathered around one picture. One person, obviously very knowledgeable about art and art history is waxing poetic about the use of colour, the balance of round shapes with square shapes and the almost beastial quality of the theme. You look at the picture and instantly recognize it as "Dogs Playing Poker". Of the 20-30 people looking at the picture, you realize that you are the only one who can actually see the dogs and notice that they are playing poker. Everybody else is entranced with vague, undefined shapes and mysterious gradients of colour. You say, "It's 'Dogs Playing Poker'" and the esteemed expert beams in your direction saying, "You are absolutely right! Do you see the green here, it's almost like the felt on a gambling table. These shapes here seem to be alive with animal ferocity. I like your description of playing poker, as it fits well with the whimsical nature of the composition." The others in the group nod approvingly. Someone who has a really good palette and who has trained it well can easily tell who can taste the wine and who can't -- just in the same way that most people can tell who is visually impaired and who isn't. And because the ability to taste the wine to that level is really, really rare, the experts who have a disability are often completely unaware of it -- they are miles better than your average person who has not studied the subject every minute of their adult life. So the wool is already over their eyes, so to speak. The thing I'm incredulous about is the lack of due diligence from the auction houses. Someone claims to be selling hundreds of thousands of dollars of incredibly rare wine dating from WWII and before. When someone asks where a wine was originally bought, the seller says he will have to look it up. There is no provenance at all!!! "Oh I just happened to have this bottle of 1923 Bordeaux in my basement". Pull the other one... So from that perspective, it truly is amazing how gullible people are.
- mc32 11y ago
  On the other hand people have curious tastes. I enjoy some "stinky" cheeses but I do not enjoy "stinky" tofu. In a way, this illustrates that what is palatable and refined is very whimsical. In the middle ages, for example, sweet wines were drunk on special occasions. Today, not many people would think too highly of sweet wines. So tastes change. The point is there is no good and better wine, just wines you like more and ones you like less, but for no discernible reason, other than present "tastes."
  - VeejayRampay 11y ago
    Not many people would think too highly of sweet wines? I might have a biased perspective because of my being French, but sweet wines (in all its varieties) are rather sought after here. Wines like Montbazillac, Loupiac, Pineau des Charentes, Sauternes, the wide gamut of wines from Alsace and Jura are all respected and recognized as "the good stuff".
jbigelow76 11y ago
CNBC also did an episode of "American Greed" on Rudy Kurniawan. It was pretty interesting as far as that show goes. http://www.cnbcprime.com/american-greed/video/american-greed-who-is-ruby-kurniawan/ http://www.cnbcprime.com/american-greed/video/american-greed...

mikekchar 11y ago

Wine is an area ripe for fraud. I seem to have inherited a fairly good palette from my mother. I'm probably a super taster for some things (which is often annoying as some smells are enough to strike me down when most other people can't even detect them). Although I'm not super serious about it, I enjoy wine and have been part of some wine appreciation societies. There are a lot of people who are really passionate and knowledgeable about wine. They are true experts in the area, but it is striking how often it becomes apparent that they have a really serious physical handicap -- they can't taste the wine. I'd like to invoke Dunning Kruger here, because these experts are usually completely unaware that they can not taste the wine. However, it is much more complicated than that. As an example, imagine that you went to an art gallery. A crowd of people are gathered around one picture. One person, obviously very knowledgeable about art and art history is waxing poetic about the use of colour, the balance of round shapes with square shapes and the almost beastial quality of the theme. You look at the picture and instantly recognize it as "Dogs Playing Poker". Of the 20-30 people looking at the picture, you realize that you are the only one who can actually see the dogs and notice that they are playing poker. Everybody else is entranced with vague, undefined shapes and mysterious gradients of colour. You say, "It's 'Dogs Playing Poker'" and the esteemed expert beams in your direction saying, "You are absolutely right! Do you see the green here, it's almost like the felt on a gambling table. These shapes here seem to be alive with animal ferocity. I like your description of playing poker, as it fits well with the whimsical nature of the composition." The others in the group nod approvingly. Someone who has a really good palette and who has trained it well can easily tell who can taste the wine and who can't -- just in the same way that most people can tell who is visually impaired and who isn't. And because the ability to taste the wine to that level is really, really rare, the experts who have a disability are often completely unaware of it -- they are miles better than your average person who has not studied the subject every minute of their adult life. So the wool is already over their eyes, so to speak. The thing I'm incredulous about is the lack of due diligence from the auction houses. Someone claims to be selling hundreds of thousands of dollars of incredibly rare wine dating from WWII and before. When someone asks where a wine was originally bought, the seller says he will have to look it up. There is no provenance at all!!! "Oh I just happened to have this bottle of 1923 Bordeaux in my basement". Pull the other one... So from that perspective, it truly is amazing how gullible people are.

mc32 11y ago
On the other hand people have curious tastes. I enjoy some "stinky" cheeses but I do not enjoy "stinky" tofu. In a way, this illustrates that what is palatable and refined is very whimsical. In the middle ages, for example, sweet wines were drunk on special occasions. Today, not many people would think too highly of sweet wines. So tastes change. The point is there is no good and better wine, just wines you like more and ones you like less, but for no discernible reason, other than present "tastes."
- VeejayRampay 11y ago
  Not many people would think too highly of sweet wines? I might have a biased perspective because of my being French, but sweet wines (in all its varieties) are rather sought after here. Wines like Montbazillac, Loupiac, Pineau des Charentes, Sauternes, the wide gamut of wines from Alsace and Jura are all respected and recognized as "the good stuff".

jbigelow76 11y ago

CNBC also did an episode of "American Greed" on Rudy Kurniawan. It was pretty interesting as far as that show goes. http://www.cnbcprime.com/american-greed/video/american-greed-who-is-ruby-kurniawan/ http://www.cnbcprime.com/american-greed/video/american-greed...