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"[...]one should ask why police officers are such a significant source of danger." The statements are based on data from 2011. 155 people were killed by police

"[...]one should ask why police officers are such a significant source of danger." The statements are based on data from 2011. 155 people were killed by police officers in US, total population was about 311.7 million back then. That's roughly 0,00005% and we don't even know the circumstances in which they got killed. Saying you're 8 times more likely to [insert extremely unlikely event] than [insert exceptionally unlikely event] might be true but it's pure sensationalism.

delinka 11y ago
Indeed it is sensationalism. And it highlights the fact that we're expending far too much effort and money on handwavy "solutions" to handwavy "terrorism."
- _dark_matter_ 11y ago
  They don't see it that way. Obviously our efforts have been so fruitful that terrorism has been wiped out.
  - catshirt 11y ago
    of course. and we can't stop now- it's working! how convenient for them.
  - dragonwriter 11y ago
    > Obviously our efforts have been so fruitful that terrorism has been wiped out. If that's the perception, maybe we need to direct the same effort to the now more serious problem of police shootings of citizens, so those can be wiped out to the same low level as the terrorism threat has been reduced to.
- schnable 11y ago
  or maybe some of the effort we put into fighting terrorism is effective.
  - IkmoIkmo 11y ago
    It's hard to say, generally it doesn't appear to be the case but there's a possibility this information is secret to the public. But take the NSA for example, it has been looked into a lot by government (e.g. congress) itself behind closed doors and it seems to be pretty useless so far. > The Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board (PCLOB) also issued a report in which it stated, “we have not identified a single instance involving a threat to the United States in which [bulk collection under Section 215 of the Patriot Act] made a concrete difference in the outcome of a counterterrorism investigation.” from: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/06/top-5-claims-defenders-nsa-have-stop-making-remain-credible https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/06/top-5-claims-defenders...
    - dllthomas 11y ago
      The NSA is a whole lot more than just the bulk collection program.
eljimmy 11y ago
I feel it is important to point out that police-related deaths are voluntarily reported by each department. The true number of deaths is very likely much higher.
rgbrenner 11y ago
155? This article has another problem then. Although the FBI tracks police shootings, reporting is voluntary.. so they're grossly underreported. The washingtonpost did an analysis earlier this year attempting to get a more complete number... we're on track to surpass 1000 police shootings this year. https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/fatal-police-shootings-in-2015-approaching-400-nationwide/2015/05/30/d322256a-058e-11e5-a428-c984eb077d4e_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/fatal-police-shootin...
- briandear 11y ago
  How many of those victims were people with prior violent felony convictions? How many of those shootings were in self defense? We can parse data all day long but people don't normally just get randomly shot by a cop. Chris Rock has a good bit on this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2plo4FOgIU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2plo4FOgIU
dragonwriter 11y ago
> Saying you're 8 times more likely to [insert extremely unlikely event] than [insert exceptionally unlikely event] might be true but it's pure sensationalism. Both counterterrorism and dealing with public agency violations of rights (including fatal ones by police) are within the scope of concerns addressed by the Federal government generally (and the FBI specifically). Understanding the relative danger of those threats is a reasonable part of evaluating the proper allocation of resources, and evaluating actual and proposed government policy. They are not unrelated rare threats for which the relative risk is immaterial and pure sensationalism to report or discuss.

delinka 11y ago

Indeed it is sensationalism. And it highlights the fact that we're expending far too much effort and money on handwavy "solutions" to handwavy "terrorism."

_dark_matter_ 11y ago
They don't see it that way. Obviously our efforts have been so fruitful that terrorism has been wiped out.
- catshirt 11y ago
  of course. and we can't stop now- it's working! how convenient for them.
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > Obviously our efforts have been so fruitful that terrorism has been wiped out. If that's the perception, maybe we need to direct the same effort to the now more serious problem of police shootings of citizens, so those can be wiped out to the same low level as the terrorism threat has been reduced to.
schnable 11y ago
or maybe some of the effort we put into fighting terrorism is effective.
- IkmoIkmo 11y ago
  It's hard to say, generally it doesn't appear to be the case but there's a possibility this information is secret to the public. But take the NSA for example, it has been looked into a lot by government (e.g. congress) itself behind closed doors and it seems to be pretty useless so far. > The Privacy and Civil Liberties Oversight Board (PCLOB) also issued a report in which it stated, “we have not identified a single instance involving a threat to the United States in which [bulk collection under Section 215 of the Patriot Act] made a concrete difference in the outcome of a counterterrorism investigation.” from: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/06/top-5-claims-defenders-nsa-have-stop-making-remain-credible https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2014/06/top-5-claims-defenders...
  - dllthomas 11y ago
    The NSA is a whole lot more than just the bulk collection program.

eljimmy 11y ago

I feel it is important to point out that police-related deaths are voluntarily reported by each department. The true number of deaths is very likely much higher.

rgbrenner 11y ago

155? This article has another problem then. Although the FBI tracks police shootings, reporting is voluntary.. so they're grossly underreported. The washingtonpost did an analysis earlier this year attempting to get a more complete number... we're on track to surpass 1000 police shootings this year. https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/fatal-police-shootings-in-2015-approaching-400-nationwide/2015/05/30/d322256a-058e-11e5-a428-c984eb077d4e_story.html https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/fatal-police-shootin...

briandear 11y ago
How many of those victims were people with prior violent felony convictions? How many of those shootings were in self defense? We can parse data all day long but people don't normally just get randomly shot by a cop. Chris Rock has a good bit on this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2plo4FOgIU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2plo4FOgIU

dragonwriter 11y ago

> Saying you're 8 times more likely to [insert extremely unlikely event] than [insert exceptionally unlikely event] might be true but it's pure sensationalism. Both counterterrorism and dealing with public agency violations of rights (including fatal ones by police) are within the scope of concerns addressed by the Federal government generally (and the FBI specifically). Understanding the relative danger of those threats is a reasonable part of evaluating the proper allocation of resources, and evaluating actual and proposed government policy. They are not unrelated rare threats for which the relative risk is immaterial and pure sensationalism to report or discuss.