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Two opportunities to plug PSYCHO-PASS in one day? We're on a roll, HN! But seriously, if Google co-opted people's smart phone data to do covert psychological e

by mfoy_ 11y ago

Two opportunities to plug PSYCHO-PASS in one day? We're on a roll, HN! But seriously, if Google co-opted people's smart phone data to do covert psychological evaluations on a constant basis we'd literally be one step removed from the dystopic future PSYCHO-PASS depicted. Albeit a big step (sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects before they have a chance to hurt themselves or others).

Lawtonfogle 11y ago
>Albeit a big step (sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects before they have a chance to hurt themselves or others). Look at the story behind the police officer who was committed for trying to expose police quotas. Is that not the same as an armed team coming to commit you... just for an even less justifiable reason?
- pc2g4d 11y ago
  Do you have a link for this?
stuxnet79 11y ago
Except we have a choice to not fall into the Google trap and altogether avoid using any Google products. Also my hue isn't cloudy at all ;) > sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects Even if we did reach a point where we could be able to identify at-risk subjects with high accuracy this would be very difficult to bring about, just because of the implications.
- mfoy_ 11y ago
  Right, hence the big step is for a government agency to receive a mandate to implement such a system. The even bigger step is probably to openly make enforcement decisions based on that info. I think there is a huge gap between "your psychological data indicates you may be at increased risk of committing a violent crime" and actually taking people off the streets based on that indicator. But then again, with what we've learned since Snowden, this doesn't actually seem that impossible...
  - mcguire 11y ago
    Note further that "you may have a mental illness" -> "you may be at increased risk of committing..." is as sketchy as "you are a minority" -> "you may be at increased risk of committing...".
    - mfoy_ 11y ago
      Right. Hence the need for a dash of dystopia to make the plot work.
      - oldmanjay 11y ago
        Perhaps I misunderstood you, but I feel like you're implying that racial profiling isn't an active thing.
        mfoy_ 11y ago
        Honestly, from the point of view of a minority this is already a dystopia.
DanBC 11y ago
> sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects before they have a chance to hurt themselves or others Aout half the people shot and killed in the US have mental health problems. The relatives recognise the person is going through a MH crisis, possibly suicidal. They call the police. Piss-poor US police then kill that person because they don't have the skills or training to deal with that person. (Note the lack of killing by police in the rest of the western world)
- mfoy_ 11y ago
  Of course there's a lot of potential for tremendous good to come out of this. Right from the article: "Insel: One of the great challenges in this field is how to help people who do not want help." If Google can somehow predict and prevent a mental health issue from getting to the point you describe, that would be wonderful. But we can't ignore the huge privacy issue to deal with there. If Google was surreptitiously capturing reliable psychological assessments of people on a large scale, especially post-Snowden, I'm sure anyone could imagine more than a couple potential issues.
  - DanBC 11y ago
    I feel like yelling "Google already has this data!" People have been saying for years that it's probably a bad idea to let Google slurp as much data as they do and keep it as long as they do. We passed the point of no return about 7 years ago. Everything is now online; online functionality is baked into the OS; everything calls back to the mothership.
yarou 11y ago
You're forgetting two really important conditions: completely closed borders and hyper oats. I doubt such a system would work in practice, because the vast majority of people are likely asymptomatic like Tsunemori and Makishima.
suneilp 11y ago
It's not as if Google or anyone else needs to go find the person and forcibly detain them. Google can steer people towards more ads or inject websites for treatment into the search result pages. Also, the hue detection was triggering on people who clearly had temporary issues and could have been helped instead of subjugated. Some of them were far more interesting and "healthier" than the sheep, like Kogami. It's more of a problem if someone doesn't get angry about something like Kogami has.
- yarou 11y ago
  The dystopian society had an incentive to have a placated and numb society, in a Brave New World sense. I would argue that Makishima is the true hero in the story, because he is "awake" while others are asleep.

by mfoy_ 11y ago

Lawtonfogle 11y ago

>Albeit a big step (sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects before they have a chance to hurt themselves or others). Look at the story behind the police officer who was committed for trying to expose police quotas. Is that not the same as an armed team coming to commit you... just for an even less justifiable reason?

pc2g4d 11y ago
Do you have a link for this?

stuxnet79 11y ago

Except we have a choice to not fall into the Google trap and altogether avoid using any Google products. Also my hue isn't cloudy at all ;) > sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects Even if we did reach a point where we could be able to identify at-risk subjects with high accuracy this would be very difficult to bring about, just because of the implications.

mfoy_ 11y ago
Right, hence the big step is for a government agency to receive a mandate to implement such a system. The even bigger step is probably to openly make enforcement decisions based on that info. I think there is a huge gap between "your psychological data indicates you may be at increased risk of committing a violent crime" and actually taking people off the streets based on that indicator. But then again, with what we've learned since Snowden, this doesn't actually seem that impossible...
- mcguire 11y ago
  Note further that "you may have a mental illness" -> "you may be at increased risk of committing..." is as sketchy as "you are a minority" -> "you may be at increased risk of committing...".
  - mfoy_ 11y ago
    Right. Hence the need for a dash of dystopia to make the plot work.
    - oldmanjay 11y ago
      Perhaps I misunderstood you, but I feel like you're implying that racial profiling isn't an active thing.
      - mfoy_ 11y ago
        Honestly, from the point of view of a minority this is already a dystopia.

DanBC 11y ago

> sending out armed teams to apprehend at-risk subjects before they have a chance to hurt themselves or others Aout half the people shot and killed in the US have mental health problems. The relatives recognise the person is going through a MH crisis, possibly suicidal. They call the police. Piss-poor US police then kill that person because they don't have the skills or training to deal with that person. (Note the lack of killing by police in the rest of the western world)

mfoy_ 11y ago
Of course there's a lot of potential for tremendous good to come out of this. Right from the article: "Insel: One of the great challenges in this field is how to help people who do not want help." If Google can somehow predict and prevent a mental health issue from getting to the point you describe, that would be wonderful. But we can't ignore the huge privacy issue to deal with there. If Google was surreptitiously capturing reliable psychological assessments of people on a large scale, especially post-Snowden, I'm sure anyone could imagine more than a couple potential issues.
- DanBC 11y ago
  I feel like yelling "Google already has this data!" People have been saying for years that it's probably a bad idea to let Google slurp as much data as they do and keep it as long as they do. We passed the point of no return about 7 years ago. Everything is now online; online functionality is baked into the OS; everything calls back to the mothership.

yarou 11y ago

You're forgetting two really important conditions: completely closed borders and hyper oats. I doubt such a system would work in practice, because the vast majority of people are likely asymptomatic like Tsunemori and Makishima.

suneilp 11y ago

It's not as if Google or anyone else needs to go find the person and forcibly detain them. Google can steer people towards more ads or inject websites for treatment into the search result pages. Also, the hue detection was triggering on people who clearly had temporary issues and could have been helped instead of subjugated. Some of them were far more interesting and "healthier" than the sheep, like Kogami. It's more of a problem if someone doesn't get angry about something like Kogami has.

yarou 11y ago
The dystopian society had an incentive to have a placated and numb society, in a Brave New World sense. I would argue that Makishima is the true hero in the story, because he is "awake" while others are asleep.