5 ms·

The article doesn't mention gluten which you'd normally find in beer, and which itself might affect your health.

by miseg 11y ago

gambiting 11y ago
Is there any proof that it does affect your health in any way? I thought the consensus was that in people who do not suffer from Colic disease, there is absolutely no impact of gluten on anything, none whatsoever. Am I wrong?
- Symbiote 11y ago
  There are plenty of articles from respectable sources saying there's no reason to limit gluten in the diet, and doing so can cause problems if it means other nutrients are omitted (e.g. vitamins, by switching from whole wheat to white rice). Example: http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/going-gluten-free-just-because-heres-what-you-need-to-know-201302205916 http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/going-gluten-free-just-be...
- acheron 11y ago
  "celiac" or "coeliac". "colic" is something else. :) Anyway, yes, that's what I've read as well.
- uptownJimmy 11y ago
  Anybody with any of the IBS diseases (colitis, Crohn's, etc.) is advised to be consider some moderation in their wheat consumption, I think. Having said that, it is regrettable that so many Americans have decided to "cure" a host of physical and pshychological maladies with the "gluten-free" diet. Every moment you spend chasing a figment is a moment you don't spend fixing a real problem.
  - rjsw 11y ago
    In your expert opinion, what is the real problem ? The symptoms of gluten intolerance are not serious enough for a doctor to be interested, it is also easy enough to try changing your diet for a week or two in order to see if it makes a difference.
    - kaitai 11y ago
      And if you get a doctor who listens, they... tell you to do an elimination diet for a month, keep a food journal, and reintroduce foods slowly while taking notes on what happens! A good doc would tell you to consider testing your way through FODMAPS since there have been a bunch of recent publications about them in major medical journals. As the GP poster points out, though, many people might take the idea of an elimination diet and figure they can eat all the gluten-free toaster waffles they want, which would continue to cause all the same problems if FODMAPS rather than gluten were the problem. Most starch-filled gluten free replacement foods are not good for your health anyway.
- coldpie 11y ago
  Your understanding is correct. Gluten-free diets for those who don't suffer from celiac are just another fad diet like atkins or paleo. I'm eager for it to fade away, although I admit I'll miss laughing at the "gluten free" label on my 10 lb bags of pure sugar.
  - pivo 11y ago
    Atkins may have been a fad but at least for me it actually worked (I lost 18 kg/40 lbs). Gluten-free seems to be totally without merit for those without gluten sensitivity.
    - coldpie 11y ago
      I do honestly have kind of a hard time making fun of fad diets. I don't want to discourage people who are concerned about their health and are trying to improve it. Gluten-free in particular is difficult because for most Americans, decreasing your carb intake is a really good way to improve your health, and going gluten-free means you'll skip that morning bagel. But at the same time it's frustrating because it's the wrong target, which means they skip out on good foods due to a misguided, but still helpful, goal. On the other hand, paleo is an actively harmful diet[1], so I want to encourage a scientific approach to nutrition. But I don't want to discourage people who are more interested in fads than science from being concerned about health, either. Argh. The marketing is endlessly hilarious, though. My cat's food has a gluten-free label, no joke. [1] http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2013/09/10/3842158.htm http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2013/09/10/3842158.ht...
      - drpgq 11y ago
        "My cat's food has a gluten-free label, no joke." Pet homeopathy also makes me laugh.
- amalcon 11y ago
  There is also an actual gluten allergy that a few people have (much more rare than Celiac), which would be a good reason to avoid gluten. Of course, like Celiac, it's the kind of thing where the symptoms are really obvious and you know if you have it (e.g. anaphylaxis last time you had a piece of bread).
- kaitai 11y ago
  Sensitivity to gluten-containing foods has been documented in lots of people without celiac. However... * People with IBS may find their symptoms improved by going on a low-FODMAP diet. That does take out bread, but it also might involve taking out onions because of their sugar content. Doesn't have anything to do with gluten per se. * People with digestive problems may find that alcohol is an irritant. But then tequila should also be dropped or moderated; doesn't have to do with gluten. * People who do an elimination diet and find that standard American bread upsets their stomach may also find that more fermented items, in moderation, aren't a problem. American bread will cause me embarrassing borborygmus and other digestive problems, but moderate consumption of beer or northern european sourdough rye is not bad. Someone once told me this was a difference in reaction to the glutenin vs gliadin proteins that make up gluten, but who knows. No one knows the science yet, but bread sure does give me non-celiac trouble! For beer and wine, it's really useful and interesting to consider the effects of the processing and fermentation. Malted barley is used in most beers: you sprout and then roast the barley, releasing and cooking all kinds of sugars that you would not find in beef-barley soup. Barley has hordein instead of gliadin (rye has secalin, oats have avenin). Then the yeast crunches through those sugars to create alcohol and carbon dioxide and who knows what else. Fermentation often does have an effect on these proteins and can in fact have an effect on the amino acids that people with celiac are sensitive to, but we don't really know what's going on entirely. There are some Italians who can make gluten-free sourdough wheat bread in a lab just through getting the right yeasts going. Beer, wine, pickles, yogurts, sausages, fermented shark... With all we are finding out about microbiomes inside our guts, there is going to be an explosion of commercialization of these traditional fermented foods. Start your own now so that you don't have to be reliant on corporate mega-strains in the future! Microbiome independence now! :)
  - logfromblammo 11y ago
    We don't need to bring hakarl into this. Or into anything else, really. And this is from someone who has enjoyed homemade kefir (until killing the culture). Starting your own fermentation culture is dead simple. The problem is that your local strains of dust-borne microbes are not likely to be very tasty, or as useful as a more domesticated culture. So just like there are companies who make money on open-source software, there will be companies that make money on particular freely-available fermentation cultures. There already are such companies.[0] There are also informal networks of people who trade cultures through the mail. That's how I got my kefir culture. [0] http://www.sourdo.com/our-sourdough-cultures-2/ http://www.sourdo.com/our-sourdough-cultures-2/
- brianmcc 11y ago
  I have some sympathy with the disdain shown towards bandwagon-jumpers. However gluten has turned out to be a real problem in my own family. There seems to be a range of problems that gluten sensitivity can be linked with, even while traditional coeliac tests return negative. Our own research suggests this can sometimes mean "not yet bad enough to show positive" and that things need to get really bad for that to finally register. There seems to be a term NCGS emerging - Non Coeliac Gluten Sensitivity. It's somewhat at the not-yet-proven-to-exist stage. For us though, we're in no doubt: given a regular gluten-containing morsel, my wife's face next day will show swelling and she'll be fatigued for days, plus be hit by abdominal cramps and various other things. Since she cut out gluten this has only ever happened "blind" btw, i.e. waking up with symptoms then figuring "ah that piece of XYZ must have had gluten" after the fact. She never eats gluten intentionally. It's been interesting - she was all set to go onto thyroid medication for life, and had really quite severe symptoms, sometimes requiring hospitalisation. Cutting out gluten fixed them all within weeks. We've seen it suggested that gluten proteins resemble thyroid molecules, hence the immune system's attack on gluten leading to those symptoms indicating thyroid dysfunction. It makes you wonder: how many people with low level health complaints could do better by just trying a gluten free diet for a couple of weeks.
  - pavel_lishin 11y ago
    > Since she cut out gluten this has only ever happened "blind" btw, i.e. waking up with symptoms then figuring "ah that piece of XYZ must have had gluten" after the fact. Or she's allergic to something else.
    - brianmcc 11y ago
      We've not cut anything else: dairy, nuts, alcohol, eggs, carbs, fats, proteins, sugar. Not sure what else it could be. For example, turns out malted vinegar causes a reaction, the sole "trigger" ingredient in it is barley. 6 months of no-symptoms-barring-accidental-gluten is proving somewhat compelling, after 5 years of mounting health issues. This is an article we came across that was quite a eureka moment, my wife was a classic Hashimoto's case hence our initial route with endochrinology specialists: http://chriskresser.com/the-gluten-thyroid-connection/ http://chriskresser.com/the-gluten-thyroid-connection/
protomyth 11y ago
There are gluten free beers. I worked at a company that had something to do with one and they gave us some free samples. It was not my favorite.

The article doesn't mention gluten which you'd normally find in beer, and which itself might affect your health.

by miseg 11y ago

The article doesn't mention gluten which you'd normally find in beer, and which itself might affect your health.

Is there any proof that it does affect your health in any way? I thought the consensus was that in people who do not suffer from Colic disease, there is absolutely no impact of gluten on anything, none whatsoever. Am I wrong?

Symbiote 11y ago
There are plenty of articles from respectable sources saying there's no reason to limit gluten in the diet, and doing so can cause problems if it means other nutrients are omitted (e.g. vitamins, by switching from whole wheat to white rice). Example: http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/going-gluten-free-just-because-heres-what-you-need-to-know-201302205916 http://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/going-gluten-free-just-be...
acheron 11y ago
"celiac" or "coeliac". "colic" is something else. :) Anyway, yes, that's what I've read as well.
uptownJimmy 11y ago
Anybody with any of the IBS diseases (colitis, Crohn's, etc.) is advised to be consider some moderation in their wheat consumption, I think. Having said that, it is regrettable that so many Americans have decided to "cure" a host of physical and pshychological maladies with the "gluten-free" diet. Every moment you spend chasing a figment is a moment you don't spend fixing a real problem.
- rjsw 11y ago
  In your expert opinion, what is the real problem ? The symptoms of gluten intolerance are not serious enough for a doctor to be interested, it is also easy enough to try changing your diet for a week or two in order to see if it makes a difference.
  - kaitai 11y ago
    And if you get a doctor who listens, they... tell you to do an elimination diet for a month, keep a food journal, and reintroduce foods slowly while taking notes on what happens! A good doc would tell you to consider testing your way through FODMAPS since there have been a bunch of recent publications about them in major medical journals. As the GP poster points out, though, many people might take the idea of an elimination diet and figure they can eat all the gluten-free toaster waffles they want, which would continue to cause all the same problems if FODMAPS rather than gluten were the problem. Most starch-filled gluten free replacement foods are not good for your health anyway.
coldpie 11y ago
Your understanding is correct. Gluten-free diets for those who don't suffer from celiac are just another fad diet like atkins or paleo. I'm eager for it to fade away, although I admit I'll miss laughing at the "gluten free" label on my 10 lb bags of pure sugar.
- pivo 11y ago
  Atkins may have been a fad but at least for me it actually worked (I lost 18 kg/40 lbs). Gluten-free seems to be totally without merit for those without gluten sensitivity.
  - coldpie 11y ago
    I do honestly have kind of a hard time making fun of fad diets. I don't want to discourage people who are concerned about their health and are trying to improve it. Gluten-free in particular is difficult because for most Americans, decreasing your carb intake is a really good way to improve your health, and going gluten-free means you'll skip that morning bagel. But at the same time it's frustrating because it's the wrong target, which means they skip out on good foods due to a misguided, but still helpful, goal. On the other hand, paleo is an actively harmful diet[1], so I want to encourage a scientific approach to nutrition. But I don't want to discourage people who are more interested in fads than science from being concerned about health, either. Argh. The marketing is endlessly hilarious, though. My cat's food has a gluten-free label, no joke. [1] http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2013/09/10/3842158.htm http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2013/09/10/3842158.ht...
    - drpgq 11y ago
      "My cat's food has a gluten-free label, no joke." Pet homeopathy also makes me laugh.
amalcon 11y ago
There is also an actual gluten allergy that a few people have (much more rare than Celiac), which would be a good reason to avoid gluten. Of course, like Celiac, it's the kind of thing where the symptoms are really obvious and you know if you have it (e.g. anaphylaxis last time you had a piece of bread).
kaitai 11y ago
Sensitivity to gluten-containing foods has been documented in lots of people without celiac. However... * People with IBS may find their symptoms improved by going on a low-FODMAP diet. That does take out bread, but it also might involve taking out onions because of their sugar content. Doesn't have anything to do with gluten per se. * People with digestive problems may find that alcohol is an irritant. But then tequila should also be dropped or moderated; doesn't have to do with gluten. * People who do an elimination diet and find that standard American bread upsets their stomach may also find that more fermented items, in moderation, aren't a problem. American bread will cause me embarrassing borborygmus and other digestive problems, but moderate consumption of beer or northern european sourdough rye is not bad. Someone once told me this was a difference in reaction to the glutenin vs gliadin proteins that make up gluten, but who knows. No one knows the science yet, but bread sure does give me non-celiac trouble! For beer and wine, it's really useful and interesting to consider the effects of the processing and fermentation. Malted barley is used in most beers: you sprout and then roast the barley, releasing and cooking all kinds of sugars that you would not find in beef-barley soup. Barley has hordein instead of gliadin (rye has secalin, oats have avenin). Then the yeast crunches through those sugars to create alcohol and carbon dioxide and who knows what else. Fermentation often does have an effect on these proteins and can in fact have an effect on the amino acids that people with celiac are sensitive to, but we don't really know what's going on entirely. There are some Italians who can make gluten-free sourdough wheat bread in a lab just through getting the right yeasts going. Beer, wine, pickles, yogurts, sausages, fermented shark... With all we are finding out about microbiomes inside our guts, there is going to be an explosion of commercialization of these traditional fermented foods. Start your own now so that you don't have to be reliant on corporate mega-strains in the future! Microbiome independence now! :)
- logfromblammo 11y ago
  We don't need to bring hakarl into this. Or into anything else, really. And this is from someone who has enjoyed homemade kefir (until killing the culture). Starting your own fermentation culture is dead simple. The problem is that your local strains of dust-borne microbes are not likely to be very tasty, or as useful as a more domesticated culture. So just like there are companies who make money on open-source software, there will be companies that make money on particular freely-available fermentation cultures. There already are such companies.[0] There are also informal networks of people who trade cultures through the mail. That's how I got my kefir culture. [0] http://www.sourdo.com/our-sourdough-cultures-2/ http://www.sourdo.com/our-sourdough-cultures-2/
brianmcc 11y ago
I have some sympathy with the disdain shown towards bandwagon-jumpers. However gluten has turned out to be a real problem in my own family. There seems to be a range of problems that gluten sensitivity can be linked with, even while traditional coeliac tests return negative. Our own research suggests this can sometimes mean "not yet bad enough to show positive" and that things need to get really bad for that to finally register. There seems to be a term NCGS emerging - Non Coeliac Gluten Sensitivity. It's somewhat at the not-yet-proven-to-exist stage. For us though, we're in no doubt: given a regular gluten-containing morsel, my wife's face next day will show swelling and she'll be fatigued for days, plus be hit by abdominal cramps and various other things. Since she cut out gluten this has only ever happened "blind" btw, i.e. waking up with symptoms then figuring "ah that piece of XYZ must have had gluten" after the fact. She never eats gluten intentionally. It's been interesting - she was all set to go onto thyroid medication for life, and had really quite severe symptoms, sometimes requiring hospitalisation. Cutting out gluten fixed them all within weeks. We've seen it suggested that gluten proteins resemble thyroid molecules, hence the immune system's attack on gluten leading to those symptoms indicating thyroid dysfunction. It makes you wonder: how many people with low level health complaints could do better by just trying a gluten free diet for a couple of weeks.
- pavel_lishin 11y ago
  > Since she cut out gluten this has only ever happened "blind" btw, i.e. waking up with symptoms then figuring "ah that piece of XYZ must have had gluten" after the fact. Or she's allergic to something else.
  - brianmcc 11y ago
    We've not cut anything else: dairy, nuts, alcohol, eggs, carbs, fats, proteins, sugar. Not sure what else it could be. For example, turns out malted vinegar causes a reaction, the sole "trigger" ingredient in it is barley. 6 months of no-symptoms-barring-accidental-gluten is proving somewhat compelling, after 5 years of mounting health issues. This is an article we came across that was quite a eureka moment, my wife was a classic Hashimoto's case hence our initial route with endochrinology specialists: http://chriskresser.com/the-gluten-thyroid-connection/ http://chriskresser.com/the-gluten-thyroid-connection/

protomyth 11y ago

There are gluten free beers. I worked at a company that had something to do with one and they gave us some free samples. It was not my favorite.