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>Has there ever been an example of a succesful tax-less capitalist economy? I think the GP means income tax since the conversation is about being a slave === b

>Has there ever been an example of a succesful tax-less capitalist economy? I think the GP means income tax since the conversation is about being a slave === being 100% income taxed. And yes, there had been an example of a successful income tax-less capitalist economy. The United States of America for most of the time pre 1913.

tajen 11y ago
One could wonder whether USA1913 was stable in the long term. It probably operated on unlimited resources for some part (land, at least). It's the limited resources which require us nowadays to care for unemployed people, because we've built the system without including their food/shelter. For example Australia is, to this day, the new America (23% taxes at $80k), but it's also only 20M people and exploiting still-abundant mines.
brightball 11y ago
Maybe in terms of the income tax that we know today, but if you did any importing or exporting you paid a heck of a lot of taxes via tariffs. If you ever get a chance to read up on the pre-Civil War period you'll find that the south was responsible for about 87% of total Federal revenue and almost entirely due to tariffs. It's an interesting subject.
- csense 11y ago
  Why don't we go back to that system?
  - duncan_bayne 11y ago
    That's an excellent question ... my experience over several years helping campaign for a party that wanted to eliminate progressive taxation was that: * people are terrified of fundamental changes to systems that provide their 'benefits', even if the existing system involves literal slavery * people get really, really angry when you mention the 'slavery' thing; they don't seem to like really thinking about how the sausage is made, so to speak * slavery is easy when quality of life is so good; it's easy to get bent out of shape when 40% of your income is being taken when your income is diddley-squat; when you're living like a 1700s king already, meh * socialists have entirely and completely conflated the concept of a just society with compulsory taxation and state welfarism that it is almost impossible to get people to even acknowledge that the two can be considered separately * self-described capitalists are often only capitalists when it suits them, otherwise they are often happy to suckle from the State tit to a far more egregious extent than any 'welfare queen' ever did I don't do politics any more.

tajen 11y ago

One could wonder whether USA1913 was stable in the long term. It probably operated on unlimited resources for some part (land, at least). It's the limited resources which require us nowadays to care for unemployed people, because we've built the system without including their food/shelter. For example Australia is, to this day, the new America (23% taxes at $80k), but it's also only 20M people and exploiting still-abundant mines.

brightball 11y ago

Maybe in terms of the income tax that we know today, but if you did any importing or exporting you paid a heck of a lot of taxes via tariffs. If you ever get a chance to read up on the pre-Civil War period you'll find that the south was responsible for about 87% of total Federal revenue and almost entirely due to tariffs. It's an interesting subject.

csense 11y ago
Why don't we go back to that system?
- duncan_bayne 11y ago
  That's an excellent question ... my experience over several years helping campaign for a party that wanted to eliminate progressive taxation was that: * people are terrified of fundamental changes to systems that provide their 'benefits', even if the existing system involves literal slavery * people get really, really angry when you mention the 'slavery' thing; they don't seem to like really thinking about how the sausage is made, so to speak * slavery is easy when quality of life is so good; it's easy to get bent out of shape when 40% of your income is being taken when your income is diddley-squat; when you're living like a 1700s king already, meh * socialists have entirely and completely conflated the concept of a just society with compulsory taxation and state welfarism that it is almost impossible to get people to even acknowledge that the two can be considered separately * self-described capitalists are often only capitalists when it suits them, otherwise they are often happy to suckle from the State tit to a far more egregious extent than any 'welfare queen' ever did I don't do politics any more.