5 ms·
This seems like a very muddled claim to me. I won't refute that there's some kernel of truth in there somewhere, but using anecdotal evidence to loosely tie one
by Towle_ 17y ago
This seems like a very muddled claim to me. I won't refute that there's some kernel of truth in there somewhere, but using anecdotal evidence to loosely tie one's own theory together rarely ends well, especially when one's claim would be beneficial to oneself if true.
A perhaps more plausible and/or stronger explanation for programmers' disproportional display of music talent as a group:
To gain the experience necessary to label oneself a programmer, one has likely a >lot< of time on a computer. Whether that computer exists at home or at a school/university, we can already likely assume (especially for the population of "professional" programmers, due to the lesser availability of this necessary resource in past decades and the length of time necessary to become a "professional") that the group we're talking about trends toward the higher income side of the population. That alone would make the group as a whole far more likely to have ever picked up a musical instrument in the first place, let alone to have received the countless hours of necessary instruction.
Additionally, I think we can all agree programmers are disproprotionally likely to be homebodies. If one spends a lot of time at home, one has more opportunities for practice.
Lastly, if one has the patience and determination necessary to learn enough programming to label oneself a programmer (especially a "professional"), then one is more likely than the rest of the population to have the same patience and determination necessary to learn another skill which requires countless hours of disciplined study-- like music.
- stcredzero 17y agoIt goes deeper than amount of time spent. There are differences in the MRI scans of people who have spent time doing substantive work in music before the age of 12, and those who started much later. I've also taught music, and let me tell you, the difference is stark! It's much the same as learning a spoken language. There is a big difference between 10,000 hours spent learning spoken languages during the K-12 years, and 10,000 hours in your late 30's! Teaching adults who had no exposure to making music as a kid is like trying to teach someone who can't see color to paint a sunset! There are some adults who can't keep rhythm with any meaningful accuracy, and can't hum a tune back at you. There is some entire facility which is missing. I've had similar experiences teaching programming.
- Towle_ 17y agoA measurable difference in brain scans does not by itself amount to enough evidence to claim that programming and musical ability are intrinsically linked. All I'm saying is two things: a) Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence (note: neither a vague, nice-sounding theory that everyone would like to believe to be true nor anecdotal evidence qualify) and b) I feel an application of Occam's Razor is in order.
- stcredzero 17y agoThere is a very important scene in "Tous les Matins du Monde" where Gerard Depardieu is pretending to play a Viola de Gamba. (Ancestor of the Cello) It's the climactic scene, actually. This scene works very well for most people who have never played an instrument. Gerard Depardieu is considered a good actor by many, and he's doing all sorts of things right as far as that goes. However, people who have played an instrument often cringe when watching that scene, because it's glaringly obvious that Mr. Depardieu is not playing the instrument. He's faking it so badly, it makes many musicians consider the scene hoky and disappointing. (It's still a great movie, though.) What's really interesting, is that musicians who know nothing about playing a Viola de Gamba can still tell. I play wind instruments, and my fingers are doing nothing that resembles what a bowed string player has to do. There is no resemblance at all -- some things are diametrically opposed, and while I do nothing like bowing, I also need to incorporate breathing to play, in a way which is not at all needed for playing a string. Yet I can still tell immediately. This difference is very stark, and you'd probably see much better discrimination in a double-blind test than with 128 bit MP3's versus 320 bits. Note that there is a well known mathematical and physiological basis for the latter.
- christofd 17y agoYeah, I play strings and I hated that scene. You can even deduce from this scene that Depardieu hasn't learned to play any type of instrument, which can be said for a lot of Hollywood actors faking it on camera. Although, there is the rare breed of actor that plays an instrument.
- 17y ago
- KentBeck 17y agoTowle_, Thank you for the followup. I'm not trying to do science here, just understand my own experience. Regarding the correlation between musicians and programmers being the result of socioeconomic status, that doesn't match my experience. I had lots of high school friends from similar backgrounds, and very few of them became musicians. My experience is that the brain "peculiarities" that dispose one for accomplishment in programming are the same structures that dispose one for accomplishment in music. I'd love to see what a scientist would make of this claim.