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You set it up as "punishment prisons" vs. "humane prisons". I don't think anyone says prisons should be inhumane in order to punish criminals. The imprisonment

by geowwy 11y ago

You set it up as "punishment prisons" vs. "humane prisons". I don't think anyone says prisons should be inhumane in order to punish criminals. The imprisonment is the punishment, not the treatment inside the prison.

JoeAltmaier 11y ago
And yet...Texas made their lesser criminals plant potatoes in the hot Texas sun in the middle of nowhere. Recidivism dropped to almost nothing, for those crimes (petty theft etc). Cruel? No, some folks line up to do those jobs. If its ok for Joe Shmoe to get paid minimum wage to do it, then its ok for inmates. Just hot and miserable. Anyway, I'm 'incarcerated' in my cubicle for 8 hours a day. It definitely matters what treatment is inside the prison.
- pstuart 11y ago
  > Anyway, I'm 'incarcerated' in my cubicle for 8 hours a day. Really? You can't go to lunch when you want? Go for a coffee break? Call in sick when you aren't well? Quit that job if you find a better one? Anybody who lines up for the opportunity to plant potatoes in the hot sun is clearly desperate for work. Desperate people will do lots of things that "normal" people would not.
- OneTimePaddy 11y ago
  Thats what all the moral high horse talk boils down to- a revenge fantasy against those percived free Thanks for proving a point i made somewhere up in the thread.
mikestew 11y ago
I don't think anyone says prisons should be inhumane in order to punish criminals. Huh? People say it all of the time, at least in the U. S. Prison rape is just a given with no visible attempts at fixing it, and $DEITY help the prison official or politician proposing putting in TV, or keeping the prison library updated lest they be labelled as "coddling" prisoners. Maybe we just have vastly different points of view, but I find your statement to be outlandish enough that I assume that I've misunderstood what you're saying.
gherkin0 11y ago
> I don't think anyone says prisons should be inhumane in order to punish criminals. The imprisonment is the punishment, not the treatment inside the prison. I think there are many people who say prisons should be inhumane to punish criminals, it's just that they don't understand what they're advocating is inhumane. An example is the meme that prisoners aren't being punished enough in their "country club prisons", and they should be denied all "luxuries" (defined as thing like TV sets, education, and other things to pass the time). The people who subscribe to that are advocating for inhumane punishment (sensory/psychological/social deprivation), but often they're reflective and haven't thought though their own ideas to really understand them.

by geowwy 11y ago

JoeAltmaier 11y ago

And yet...Texas made their lesser criminals plant potatoes in the hot Texas sun in the middle of nowhere. Recidivism dropped to almost nothing, for those crimes (petty theft etc). Cruel? No, some folks line up to do those jobs. If its ok for Joe Shmoe to get paid minimum wage to do it, then its ok for inmates. Just hot and miserable. Anyway, I'm 'incarcerated' in my cubicle for 8 hours a day. It definitely matters what treatment is inside the prison.

pstuart 11y ago
> Anyway, I'm 'incarcerated' in my cubicle for 8 hours a day. Really? You can't go to lunch when you want? Go for a coffee break? Call in sick when you aren't well? Quit that job if you find a better one? Anybody who lines up for the opportunity to plant potatoes in the hot sun is clearly desperate for work. Desperate people will do lots of things that "normal" people would not.
OneTimePaddy 11y ago
Thats what all the moral high horse talk boils down to- a revenge fantasy against those percived free Thanks for proving a point i made somewhere up in the thread.

mikestew 11y ago

I don't think anyone says prisons should be inhumane in order to punish criminals. Huh? People say it all of the time, at least in the U. S. Prison rape is just a given with no visible attempts at fixing it, and $DEITY help the prison official or politician proposing putting in TV, or keeping the prison library updated lest they be labelled as "coddling" prisoners. Maybe we just have vastly different points of view, but I find your statement to be outlandish enough that I assume that I've misunderstood what you're saying.

gherkin0 11y ago

> I don't think anyone says prisons should be inhumane in order to punish criminals. The imprisonment is the punishment, not the treatment inside the prison. I think there are many people who say prisons should be inhumane to punish criminals, it's just that they don't understand what they're advocating is inhumane. An example is the meme that prisoners aren't being punished enough in their "country club prisons", and they should be denied all "luxuries" (defined as thing like TV sets, education, and other things to pass the time). The people who subscribe to that are advocating for inhumane punishment (sensory/psychological/social deprivation), but often they're reflective and haven't thought though their own ideas to really understand them.