5 ms·

On the other hand, Windows runs on 85 - 90 percent of desktop machines, whereas FreeBSD's market share on the desktop is probably below 1%. (This is not a judge

by krylon 11y ago

On the other hand, Windows runs on 85 - 90 percent of desktop machines, whereas FreeBSD's market share on the desktop is probably below 1%. (This is not a judgement on FreeBSD's quality as a desktop system, I have used it myself for about two years and was very happy with it. But compared to Windows, its market share on the desktop is tiny.) For better or worse, there is a difference between a system used by a tiny minority of people (again: on the desktop) and a system that practically has a monopoly on the (corporate) desktop and that is developed and sold by a company that has a history of anti-competitive behavior. (And to be fair, I get the impression that things have begun to change at Microsoft since Nadella became CEO. But that still does not erase history.)

eropple 11y ago
That other hand and its callbacks to anti-competitive behavior and whispers of monopolies don't have much bearing on anything unless you are prepared to substantiate exactly how this behavior impacts the market share of other competitors. (I wish you luck on that very, very long row to hoe.) Meanwhile, even that "good behaving" Linux distro will happily remove Windows's boot record in favor of GRUB's, rendering the system reliant on a component that breaks if you want to remove Linux (and most people are way more likely to want to remove Linux than to remove Windows!). Hardly neighborly behavior in and of itself. And yet, I'm still not seeing a reason to cast aspersions on GRUB or Linux distros, nor am I seeing those twirly mustachios on their faces. No OS gives much of a damn about anything else running on the computer. Claims to the contrary are literally farcical and the pseudo-damages it could theoretically cause to the easily bruised are silly.
- krylon 11y ago
  > No OS gives much of a damn about anything else running on the computer. Most Linux distros (the ones I have used, at least) will detect an existing Windows installation and put a corresponding entry into GRUB's menu. Linux has been able to access data on Windows partitions for many, many years. I agree that the boot loader issue probably has at most negligible impact on the adoption of Linux (or any other OS for that matter). I am just saying that in light of Microsoft's history one may feel inclined to judge them differently.
- anonbanker 11y ago
  you, sir, are excellent at using propaganda to discount people's claims. when malice is assumed, you discount it with "mustachio twirling" strawmen. Now, instead of talking about the parent's point of direct anticompetitive behavior, we're somehow discussing "whispers of monopolies" that somehow put the burden of proof back on the grandparent, even though anyone older than 24 knows why microsoft is still not to be trusted. I'm bookmarking your profile, so I can study your future comments. you seem to be on the bleeding edge of these advances. thank you for the excellent study tools.
  - eropple 11y ago
    Propaganda? You're confusing a love for the English language and a little command of rhetoric with something vastly different, chief. Hell, I don't even use Windows as a primary platform; I'm typing this from a Mac while I'm (quite literally) waiting to meet a guy to sell my Surface Pro 3 that I never use. I'm just not impressed by rules-for-thee-but-not-for-me silliness and knee-jerk, irrational fear. I don't trust Microsoft any more than I trust any company. But I don't rely on the fears of fifteen years ago to evaluate the current state of the world, either.
    - anonbanker 11y ago
      I think you and I have a vastly different definition of propaganda. I considered your post to be information or ideas methodically spread to promote or injure a cause, movement, nation, etc. In this case, the cause and movement would be "microsoft is still evil, do not forget." do you disagree that your post fits the definition under these constraints?
  - dang 11y ago
    Personal attacks, which this crosses the line into, are not allowed on HN.
    - anonbanker 11y ago
      This might be an Appeal to Dehumanization (I just created a new fallacy), but I consider about 75% of the people on HN to be legitimate people. the remaining reek of sockpuppetry. I felt the grandparent was a sockpuppet, and am treating the account as a dataset for future encounters. I should be more mindful of the fact that there's (potentially) a human being behind the account I'm treating like an astroturfer. I can see why you considered this a personal attack.

by krylon 11y ago

eropple 11y ago

That other hand and its callbacks to anti-competitive behavior and whispers of monopolies don't have much bearing on anything unless you are prepared to substantiate exactly how this behavior impacts the market share of other competitors. (I wish you luck on that very, very long row to hoe.) Meanwhile, even that "good behaving" Linux distro will happily remove Windows's boot record in favor of GRUB's, rendering the system reliant on a component that breaks if you want to remove Linux (and most people are way more likely to want to remove Linux than to remove Windows!). Hardly neighborly behavior in and of itself. And yet, I'm still not seeing a reason to cast aspersions on GRUB or Linux distros, nor am I seeing those twirly mustachios on their faces. No OS gives much of a damn about anything else running on the computer. Claims to the contrary are literally farcical and the pseudo-damages it could theoretically cause to the easily bruised are silly.

krylon 11y ago
> No OS gives much of a damn about anything else running on the computer. Most Linux distros (the ones I have used, at least) will detect an existing Windows installation and put a corresponding entry into GRUB's menu. Linux has been able to access data on Windows partitions for many, many years. I agree that the boot loader issue probably has at most negligible impact on the adoption of Linux (or any other OS for that matter). I am just saying that in light of Microsoft's history one may feel inclined to judge them differently.
anonbanker 11y ago
you, sir, are excellent at using propaganda to discount people's claims. when malice is assumed, you discount it with "mustachio twirling" strawmen. Now, instead of talking about the parent's point of direct anticompetitive behavior, we're somehow discussing "whispers of monopolies" that somehow put the burden of proof back on the grandparent, even though anyone older than 24 knows why microsoft is still not to be trusted. I'm bookmarking your profile, so I can study your future comments. you seem to be on the bleeding edge of these advances. thank you for the excellent study tools.
- eropple 11y ago
  Propaganda? You're confusing a love for the English language and a little command of rhetoric with something vastly different, chief. Hell, I don't even use Windows as a primary platform; I'm typing this from a Mac while I'm (quite literally) waiting to meet a guy to sell my Surface Pro 3 that I never use. I'm just not impressed by rules-for-thee-but-not-for-me silliness and knee-jerk, irrational fear. I don't trust Microsoft any more than I trust any company. But I don't rely on the fears of fifteen years ago to evaluate the current state of the world, either.
  - anonbanker 11y ago
    I think you and I have a vastly different definition of propaganda. I considered your post to be information or ideas methodically spread to promote or injure a cause, movement, nation, etc. In this case, the cause and movement would be "microsoft is still evil, do not forget." do you disagree that your post fits the definition under these constraints?
- dang 11y ago
  Personal attacks, which this crosses the line into, are not allowed on HN.
  - anonbanker 11y ago
    This might be an Appeal to Dehumanization (I just created a new fallacy), but I consider about 75% of the people on HN to be legitimate people. the remaining reek of sockpuppetry. I felt the grandparent was a sockpuppet, and am treating the account as a dataset for future encounters. I should be more mindful of the fact that there's (potentially) a human being behind the account I'm treating like an astroturfer. I can see why you considered this a personal attack.