6 ms·

"So, like alcohol, another recreational drug that is legal in the US, marijuana is likely best avoided by pregnant women." This is so refreshing to see article

"So, like alcohol, another recreational drug that is legal in the US, marijuana is likely best avoided by pregnant women." This is so refreshing to see articles made with a neutral tone about marijuana and not the usual "IT'S EVIL" talk. It's a recreational drug like any other. You wouldn't drink when pregnant, you shouldn't smoke either. Those fact shouldn't be related at all about whether the substance is legal or not.

Shivetya 11y ago
except you can second hand inhale it, so there is an additional concern. That same concern occurs when you have children around. How much THC is in second hand smoke, let alone carcinogens and pollutants?
- oldmanjay 11y ago
  It's pretty intellectually difficult to extrapolate effects from heavily dosing pregnant mice into effects from microdosing pregnant humans. By which I mean your comment has no logical basis, only an emotional one. I explain this only so you understand the downvotes.
  - drzaiusapelord 11y ago
    Is it? When I was a kid second hand cigarette smoke was considered harmless. It certainly isn't today. We just don't the research because of restrictive laws banning it for the most part and the pro-pot acitvists disingenuous commentary about how "safe" it is. I feel like any politicized recreation substance will go down the path of cigarettes. Fanboys will claim its neutral, if not good for you, and then eventually the science and bias will shake out about its dangers. For example, we do know there's an increase for mental illness an decrease in IQ in kids who habitually smoke pot: https://today.duke.edu/2012/08/potiq https://today.duke.edu/2012/08/potiq Among a long-range study cohort of more than 1,000 New Zealanders, individuals who started using cannabis in adolescence and used it for years afterward showed an average decline in IQ of 8 points when their age 13 and age 38 IQ tests were compared. Quitting pot did not appear to reverse the loss either, said lead researcher Madeline Meier, a post-doctoral researcher at Duke University. The results appear online Aug. 27 in PNAS. The key variable in this is the age of onset for marijuana use and the brain's development, Meier said. Study subjects who didn't take up pot until they were adults with fully-formed brains did not show similar mental declines. --- So yes, pot can be harmless for a 21 year old, but not for a 15 year old. I'm all for legal pot, but only at age 21 or higher. I don't think the especially libertine attitudes we're seeing via web culture are helping. Its not harmless for certain age groups. We don't know enough about the brain and pot to make these types of assessments. Erring on the side of caution is the only rational path here and that includes making sure pregnant women aren't exposed to pot smoke.
- Raphmedia 11y ago
  Where I am from, people will not smoke tobacco when there are pregnant women or children in the room. Surely people won't be smoking marijuana either in those situation.
- semi-extrinsic 11y ago
  I haven't seen data for THC, but for regular smoking: after smoking inside restaurants and bars was banned in Norway, the frequency of waitresses giving birth prematurely or giving birth to babies weighing less than 1500g was significantly reduced [1]. [1] http://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/67237/1/730406490.pdf http://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/67237/1/730406490.pdf
jobu 11y ago
Agreed. My first thought when I saw the article was: "Yay, scientists are finally able to do some legitimate research on marijuana"
DanBC 11y ago
Why shouldn't women have some alcohol when pregnant? Where's the evidence that small amounts of alcohol are harmful? The total ban on alcohol during pregnancy is based on the precautionary principle - we know alcohol is harmful, but we don't know what a safe limit is, so we set a limit of zero. This causes guilt and stress in mothers, and that is probably more harmful than letting pregnant women have a small glass of wine every so often.
- freehunter 11y ago
  > Where's the evidence that small amounts of alcohol are harmful? >we know alcohol is harmful, but we don't know what a safe limit is, so we set a limit of zero. Literally that right there. It's not like we can test on humans to find what the safe amount is, that's highly unethical, highly illegal, and will never be done. The safe amount is zero, or as close to zero as you can get. It shouldn't cause any guilt or stress on the mother: it's not impossible or even difficult to completely abstain from alcohol for nine months unless you're an alcoholic, and if you're an alcoholic, you're not going to have "a small glass of wine every so often". There's actually negative societal pressure for pregnant women drinking. What would cause more stress and guilt? Not drinking while pregnant, or drinking some amount and then wondering if your child will be born with some birth defect because of it? Or wondering if your child's birth defect was caused by your drinking? The safe bet is just to not drink, to not smoke, to not abuse drugs. I honestly never thought I would be seeing a discussion about how it's not fair to ask pregnant women to abstain from alcohol.
  - DanBC 11y ago
    > What would cause more stress and guilt? Not drinking while pregnant, or drinking some amount and then wondering if your child will be born with some birth defect because of it? Or wondering if your child's birth defect was caused by your drinking? The safe bet is just to not drink, to not smoke, to not abuse drugs. Just for clarity: I mean a small glass per week. I said "a small glass every so often". There's zero chance of a birth defect from one small glass of wine a week. But women doing that will, as you say, face fierce societal condemnation whenever they drink. > I honestly never thought I would be seeing a discussion about how it's not fair to ask pregnant women to abstain from alcohol. It's not about whether it's fair or not. It's about whether the risks from small amounts of alcohol are greater than the risks of stress and anxiety women experience when guilt-tripped by other people. Society has some really unpleasant judgemental attitudes about pregnant women. They're already under a load of self-imposed pressure. They don't need it from other people.

Shivetya 11y ago

except you can second hand inhale it, so there is an additional concern. That same concern occurs when you have children around. How much THC is in second hand smoke, let alone carcinogens and pollutants?

oldmanjay 11y ago
It's pretty intellectually difficult to extrapolate effects from heavily dosing pregnant mice into effects from microdosing pregnant humans. By which I mean your comment has no logical basis, only an emotional one. I explain this only so you understand the downvotes.
- drzaiusapelord 11y ago
  Is it? When I was a kid second hand cigarette smoke was considered harmless. It certainly isn't today. We just don't the research because of restrictive laws banning it for the most part and the pro-pot acitvists disingenuous commentary about how "safe" it is. I feel like any politicized recreation substance will go down the path of cigarettes. Fanboys will claim its neutral, if not good for you, and then eventually the science and bias will shake out about its dangers. For example, we do know there's an increase for mental illness an decrease in IQ in kids who habitually smoke pot: https://today.duke.edu/2012/08/potiq https://today.duke.edu/2012/08/potiq Among a long-range study cohort of more than 1,000 New Zealanders, individuals who started using cannabis in adolescence and used it for years afterward showed an average decline in IQ of 8 points when their age 13 and age 38 IQ tests were compared. Quitting pot did not appear to reverse the loss either, said lead researcher Madeline Meier, a post-doctoral researcher at Duke University. The results appear online Aug. 27 in PNAS. The key variable in this is the age of onset for marijuana use and the brain's development, Meier said. Study subjects who didn't take up pot until they were adults with fully-formed brains did not show similar mental declines. --- So yes, pot can be harmless for a 21 year old, but not for a 15 year old. I'm all for legal pot, but only at age 21 or higher. I don't think the especially libertine attitudes we're seeing via web culture are helping. Its not harmless for certain age groups. We don't know enough about the brain and pot to make these types of assessments. Erring on the side of caution is the only rational path here and that includes making sure pregnant women aren't exposed to pot smoke.
Raphmedia 11y ago
Where I am from, people will not smoke tobacco when there are pregnant women or children in the room. Surely people won't be smoking marijuana either in those situation.
semi-extrinsic 11y ago
I haven't seen data for THC, but for regular smoking: after smoking inside restaurants and bars was banned in Norway, the frequency of waitresses giving birth prematurely or giving birth to babies weighing less than 1500g was significantly reduced [1]. [1] http://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/67237/1/730406490.pdf http://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/10419/67237/1/730406490.pdf

jobu 11y ago

Agreed. My first thought when I saw the article was: "Yay, scientists are finally able to do some legitimate research on marijuana"

DanBC 11y ago

Why shouldn't women have some alcohol when pregnant? Where's the evidence that small amounts of alcohol are harmful? The total ban on alcohol during pregnancy is based on the precautionary principle - we know alcohol is harmful, but we don't know what a safe limit is, so we set a limit of zero. This causes guilt and stress in mothers, and that is probably more harmful than letting pregnant women have a small glass of wine every so often.

freehunter 11y ago
> Where's the evidence that small amounts of alcohol are harmful? >we know alcohol is harmful, but we don't know what a safe limit is, so we set a limit of zero. Literally that right there. It's not like we can test on humans to find what the safe amount is, that's highly unethical, highly illegal, and will never be done. The safe amount is zero, or as close to zero as you can get. It shouldn't cause any guilt or stress on the mother: it's not impossible or even difficult to completely abstain from alcohol for nine months unless you're an alcoholic, and if you're an alcoholic, you're not going to have "a small glass of wine every so often". There's actually negative societal pressure for pregnant women drinking. What would cause more stress and guilt? Not drinking while pregnant, or drinking some amount and then wondering if your child will be born with some birth defect because of it? Or wondering if your child's birth defect was caused by your drinking? The safe bet is just to not drink, to not smoke, to not abuse drugs. I honestly never thought I would be seeing a discussion about how it's not fair to ask pregnant women to abstain from alcohol.
- DanBC 11y ago
  > What would cause more stress and guilt? Not drinking while pregnant, or drinking some amount and then wondering if your child will be born with some birth defect because of it? Or wondering if your child's birth defect was caused by your drinking? The safe bet is just to not drink, to not smoke, to not abuse drugs. Just for clarity: I mean a small glass per week. I said "a small glass every so often". There's zero chance of a birth defect from one small glass of wine a week. But women doing that will, as you say, face fierce societal condemnation whenever they drink. > I honestly never thought I would be seeing a discussion about how it's not fair to ask pregnant women to abstain from alcohol. It's not about whether it's fair or not. It's about whether the risks from small amounts of alcohol are greater than the risks of stress and anxiety women experience when guilt-tripped by other people. Society has some really unpleasant judgemental attitudes about pregnant women. They're already under a load of self-imposed pressure. They don't need it from other people.