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> ..when the UK leaves... Really? You feel that strongly that the people of the UK will vote to leave? Whilst there is vocal support for leaving, there are als

> ..when the UK leaves... Really? You feel that strongly that the people of the UK will vote to leave? Whilst there is vocal support for leaving, there are also a lot of level headed people who understand the benefits of being part of the EU.

dijit 11y ago
I'm British, and while most people who are clued up on what the EU does for Britain do not want to leave; other people do not have the time in their life to make an informed opinion and must rely on what friends/family say. Because the media is manipulated completely, this causes a few people to just 'take' the information from the media and think it's close to real, and those people spread the same message forward, making it more respectable to believe in until you fill up minds of 90% of the people. so, 90% of people believe the EU community is 'the big bad' who 'steals all the money' and imposes stuff on us. and there's no way to change that really.
- mollmerx 11y ago
  I have a hunch that this may play out in a similar way the Scottish Independence Referendum did last year. It is in the interest of business and the elite to stay in, while there is significant popular opinion and some small businesses that want out. If in the run up to the actual vote things are looking close, as they did in Scotland, the side campaigning to stay in will wheel out the big shots (former PMs, captains of industry etc.) and throw money at the problem - resulting, I suspect, in a narrow win to stay in. Right now we don't even have a date for the referendum, so it's too early to be expending resources like that.
mschuster91 11y ago
> Really? You feel that strongly that the people of the UK will vote to leave? Whilst there is vocal support for leaving, there are also a lot of level headed people who understand the benefits of being part of the EU. Or the EU might just kick out Britain for good. British "special rules" are holding the EU back everywhere - the EU doesn't have a Foreign Minister just because of British proudness, and don't get me started on how Britain evades any responsibility for the refugees. Either Britain becomes a FULL member of the EU with ALL responsibilities and rights or GET THE FUCK OUT. Rest of EU has had enough of them.
- dang 11y ago
  > Either Britain becomes a FULL member of the EU with ALL responsibilities and rights or GET THE FUCK OUT. Rest of EU has had enough of them. This breaks the HN guidelines and so have some of your other recent posts. We ban accounts that do this repeatedly. Please re-read the guidelines and follow them. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html
madaxe_again 11y ago
And those level headed folks who are prepared to think and reach a conclusion based on empirical facts are a distinct minority - as a sibling post relates, most will follow the perceived direction of the herd - and the broad perception in the UK is that the EU is an evil monster who took our jobs and gave prisoners luxury sports cars and the immigration and the gets breathless. I struggle to see how a referendum won't end up with an out vote. The "out" campaign is oriented around emotion. The "in" campaign is oriented around rationale and logic. People act based on emotion.
- shannmcnicholl 11y ago
  To believe that one side is pure, misguided, emotion while the other is, in your eyes, perfectly positioned in logic highlights that you have taken your own bias to be fact at the expense of a balanced argument. It seems that a deeper dive into the pro's of the out campaign would, at the very least, help you to understand their reasoning beyond simply emotion.
  - madaxe_again 11y ago
    I've dived deeply, and I have yet to see a single cogent argument in favour of leaving - they have all fallen under the category of "parade of horribles". The motivation to leave comes from whitehall and can be summed up as "power and money" , and is perfectly rational for those proponents of a departure - but in order to garner broader support they must have "reasons" which appear reasonable, but toy with basic emotions. Do you have a sane, rational argument in favour of leaving?

dijit 11y ago

I'm British, and while most people who are clued up on what the EU does for Britain do not want to leave; other people do not have the time in their life to make an informed opinion and must rely on what friends/family say. Because the media is manipulated completely, this causes a few people to just 'take' the information from the media and think it's close to real, and those people spread the same message forward, making it more respectable to believe in until you fill up minds of 90% of the people. so, 90% of people believe the EU community is 'the big bad' who 'steals all the money' and imposes stuff on us. and there's no way to change that really.

mollmerx 11y ago
I have a hunch that this may play out in a similar way the Scottish Independence Referendum did last year. It is in the interest of business and the elite to stay in, while there is significant popular opinion and some small businesses that want out. If in the run up to the actual vote things are looking close, as they did in Scotland, the side campaigning to stay in will wheel out the big shots (former PMs, captains of industry etc.) and throw money at the problem - resulting, I suspect, in a narrow win to stay in. Right now we don't even have a date for the referendum, so it's too early to be expending resources like that.

mschuster91 11y ago

> Really? You feel that strongly that the people of the UK will vote to leave? Whilst there is vocal support for leaving, there are also a lot of level headed people who understand the benefits of being part of the EU. Or the EU might just kick out Britain for good. British "special rules" are holding the EU back everywhere - the EU doesn't have a Foreign Minister just because of British proudness, and don't get me started on how Britain evades any responsibility for the refugees. Either Britain becomes a FULL member of the EU with ALL responsibilities and rights or GET THE FUCK OUT. Rest of EU has had enough of them.

dang 11y ago
> Either Britain becomes a FULL member of the EU with ALL responsibilities and rights or GET THE FUCK OUT. Rest of EU has had enough of them. This breaks the HN guidelines and so have some of your other recent posts. We ban accounts that do this repeatedly. Please re-read the guidelines and follow them. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

madaxe_again 11y ago

And those level headed folks who are prepared to think and reach a conclusion based on empirical facts are a distinct minority - as a sibling post relates, most will follow the perceived direction of the herd - and the broad perception in the UK is that the EU is an evil monster who took our jobs and gave prisoners luxury sports cars and the immigration and the gets breathless. I struggle to see how a referendum won't end up with an out vote. The "out" campaign is oriented around emotion. The "in" campaign is oriented around rationale and logic. People act based on emotion.

shannmcnicholl 11y ago
To believe that one side is pure, misguided, emotion while the other is, in your eyes, perfectly positioned in logic highlights that you have taken your own bias to be fact at the expense of a balanced argument. It seems that a deeper dive into the pro's of the out campaign would, at the very least, help you to understand their reasoning beyond simply emotion.
- madaxe_again 11y ago
  I've dived deeply, and I have yet to see a single cogent argument in favour of leaving - they have all fallen under the category of "parade of horribles". The motivation to leave comes from whitehall and can be summed up as "power and money" , and is perfectly rational for those proponents of a departure - but in order to garner broader support they must have "reasons" which appear reasonable, but toy with basic emotions. Do you have a sane, rational argument in favour of leaving?