4 ms·

What is amazing is the fact people don't realize is that what VW did indirectly caused disability and even death, but hey if it does not affect me I'll just buy

What is amazing is the fact people don't realize is that what VW did indirectly caused disability and even death, but hey if it does not affect me I'll just buy a VW anyway. I'm really sick of these TBTF corporations doing whatever they want. They do something illegal that causes a lot of harm and if they are caught they just cruise the waters of ignorance to safety and then rinse and repeat. We are just sheep...

ekr 11y ago
Every single car driver out there causes immense harm to the society, it's not only the car manufacturers at fault. If you can imagine a city where people ride bikes instead of cars, with no noise, pollution ,traffic jams, accidents and so on. You'll quickly realise that all car drivers are murderers. A quick reminder of Tetraethyllead should make you realise how many things most people are missing.
- dreaminvm 11y ago
  Can you expand on why a city where people rode bikes would be rid of traffic jams and accidents? My guess is traffic will be just as bad in downtown areas with frequent lights and pedestrian crossings. While bikes would certainly result in less fatal accidents, I think the frequency of accidents would be higher since bikes can ride so close to each other and pedestrians.
  - admax88q 11y ago
    You can fit a lot more bikes into a smaller space. Next time you're in a traffic jam, look at all the cars around you, likely most of them have only one person in it. Now try to visualize how much space each of those people would take up on a bike instead of a car. All of a sudden you're surrounded by empty space. Sure its possible to have traffic jams with bikes, but that threshold is so much higher.
- dang 11y ago
  > all car drivers are murderers Please don't post over-the-top flamebait to HN.
bung 11y ago
"...what VW did indirectly caused disability and even death..." could ya expand on that or link? news to me
- Mikeb85 11y ago
  By polluting... The various emissions from a diesel engine (the gases other than CO2) are all toxic, and cumulatively affect the health of those who breathe those emissions (ie. people in cities).
  - InclinedPlane 11y ago
    More directly, VW's excess polluting caused people to die. How many is hard to say for sure but almost certainly more than any of the recent safety related automotive engineering design screwups lately such as Toyota's "unintended acceleration" problem and GM's bad switches.
- gregwtmtno 11y ago
  Here's one link, but all you need to do is search google for "NO2 life expectancy". http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/isee/p-3-30-13/ http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/isee/p-3-30-13/
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
skimpycompiler 11y ago
> What is amazing is the fact people don't realize is that * insert any global industry * caused disability and even death, but hey if it does not affect me I'll just buy * the product * anyway. This is true for almost anything. Food industry is a huge greenhouse gases producer which indirectly causes pollution and some deaths. Meat, which might be considered a luxury, is the top ingridient in many dishes, environmental impact is higher for producing meat that that of driving cars (globally). Just heating causes pollution and death. Our reliance on fossil fuels will in 100 years cause a lot of indirect deaths. People aren't sheep. They just don't care.
- msandford 11y ago
  > environmental impact is higher for producing meat that that of driving cars (globally) That's a pretty tall claim. Have you got a citation? I'd also argue that there are ways to grow meat much more environmentally friendly and not all that more expensive than traditional feed lots. > People aren't sheep. They just don't care. Sheep care, at least for their babies and each other. You're a fool if you believe this. Sheep don't plan their environment in any kind of meaningful way, they just wander around eating. If you cut the field in half and move the sheep from side to side and actually manage their grazing you can get more production per acre than if you just leave the sheep to themselves. Without the farmer intervening and selling sheep off, they'd quickly outgrow the feeding capacity of their naive grazing strategy, continue having babies, and start causing deaths from malnutrition. Please learn about natural systems a little bit before spouting things that sound insightful but which are actually devoid of any reality.
  - skimpycompiler 11y ago
    > That's a pretty tall claim. Have you got a citation? I'd also argue that there are ways to grow meat much more environmentally friendly and not all that more expensive than traditional feed lots. FAO of the United Nations - report 2006 http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM There are newer reports but I just want to point out how long the information is out. This is the direct citation: > The livestock sector is a major player, responsible for 18 percent of greenhouse gas emissions measured in CO2 equivalent. This is higher share than transport. What's also a little bit comforting is that the impact is reducing (production is getting more and more efficient). Although as Chinese became rich and started eating meat insanely fast doubling the consumption of the USA, same might happen to peoples of India and Africa. Increase of demand might neutralize the efficiency increase. > You're a fool if you believe this. ... Well, this is not really sheep I had in mind. I was thinking more of the free roaming - no owner - kind of animals. > Please learn about natural systems a little bit before spouting things that sound insightful but which are actually devoid of any reality. I completely do not get how my half-assed comment about sheep escalated to your comments about my education (or lack of).
post_break 11y ago
Blue bell knowingly sold tainted ice cream that killed people. People went absolutely nuts when it came back to grocery stores. I ruled them out for life. The general public just doesn't seem to care about anything unless it directly appeals to them. Not in my back yard syndrome on a global scale.
- HeyLaughingBoy 11y ago
  I never heard of that, but it reminds me that when I moved to Minnesota in the late 90's the phrase "salmonella vanilla" was associated with Schwann's Ice Cream. Try finding anyone these days who even thinks of that. I see Schwann's making home delivery of their frozen grocery products all over the place (mmm, cheesy tater tots!). They seem to be even more popular now. People have short memories for this stuff.

ekr 11y ago

Every single car driver out there causes immense harm to the society, it's not only the car manufacturers at fault. If you can imagine a city where people ride bikes instead of cars, with no noise, pollution ,traffic jams, accidents and so on. You'll quickly realise that all car drivers are murderers. A quick reminder of Tetraethyllead should make you realise how many things most people are missing.

dreaminvm 11y ago
Can you expand on why a city where people rode bikes would be rid of traffic jams and accidents? My guess is traffic will be just as bad in downtown areas with frequent lights and pedestrian crossings. While bikes would certainly result in less fatal accidents, I think the frequency of accidents would be higher since bikes can ride so close to each other and pedestrians.
- admax88q 11y ago
  You can fit a lot more bikes into a smaller space. Next time you're in a traffic jam, look at all the cars around you, likely most of them have only one person in it. Now try to visualize how much space each of those people would take up on a bike instead of a car. All of a sudden you're surrounded by empty space. Sure its possible to have traffic jams with bikes, but that threshold is so much higher.
dang 11y ago
> all car drivers are murderers Please don't post over-the-top flamebait to HN.

bung 11y ago

"...what VW did indirectly caused disability and even death..." could ya expand on that or link? news to me

Mikeb85 11y ago
By polluting... The various emissions from a diesel engine (the gases other than CO2) are all toxic, and cumulatively affect the health of those who breathe those emissions (ie. people in cities).
- InclinedPlane 11y ago
  More directly, VW's excess polluting caused people to die. How many is hard to say for sure but almost certainly more than any of the recent safety related automotive engineering design screwups lately such as Toyota's "unintended acceleration" problem and GM's bad switches.
gregwtmtno 11y ago
Here's one link, but all you need to do is search google for "NO2 life expectancy". http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/isee/p-3-30-13/ http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/isee/p-3-30-13/

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

skimpycompiler 11y ago

> What is amazing is the fact people don't realize is that * insert any global industry * caused disability and even death, but hey if it does not affect me I'll just buy * the product * anyway. This is true for almost anything. Food industry is a huge greenhouse gases producer which indirectly causes pollution and some deaths. Meat, which might be considered a luxury, is the top ingridient in many dishes, environmental impact is higher for producing meat that that of driving cars (globally). Just heating causes pollution and death. Our reliance on fossil fuels will in 100 years cause a lot of indirect deaths. People aren't sheep. They just don't care.

msandford 11y ago
> environmental impact is higher for producing meat that that of driving cars (globally) That's a pretty tall claim. Have you got a citation? I'd also argue that there are ways to grow meat much more environmentally friendly and not all that more expensive than traditional feed lots. > People aren't sheep. They just don't care. Sheep care, at least for their babies and each other. You're a fool if you believe this. Sheep don't plan their environment in any kind of meaningful way, they just wander around eating. If you cut the field in half and move the sheep from side to side and actually manage their grazing you can get more production per acre than if you just leave the sheep to themselves. Without the farmer intervening and selling sheep off, they'd quickly outgrow the feeding capacity of their naive grazing strategy, continue having babies, and start causing deaths from malnutrition. Please learn about natural systems a little bit before spouting things that sound insightful but which are actually devoid of any reality.
- skimpycompiler 11y ago
  > That's a pretty tall claim. Have you got a citation? I'd also argue that there are ways to grow meat much more environmentally friendly and not all that more expensive than traditional feed lots. FAO of the United Nations - report 2006 http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM There are newer reports but I just want to point out how long the information is out. This is the direct citation: > The livestock sector is a major player, responsible for 18 percent of greenhouse gas emissions measured in CO2 equivalent. This is higher share than transport. What's also a little bit comforting is that the impact is reducing (production is getting more and more efficient). Although as Chinese became rich and started eating meat insanely fast doubling the consumption of the USA, same might happen to peoples of India and Africa. Increase of demand might neutralize the efficiency increase. > You're a fool if you believe this. ... Well, this is not really sheep I had in mind. I was thinking more of the free roaming - no owner - kind of animals. > Please learn about natural systems a little bit before spouting things that sound insightful but which are actually devoid of any reality. I completely do not get how my half-assed comment about sheep escalated to your comments about my education (or lack of).

post_break 11y ago

Blue bell knowingly sold tainted ice cream that killed people. People went absolutely nuts when it came back to grocery stores. I ruled them out for life. The general public just doesn't seem to care about anything unless it directly appeals to them. Not in my back yard syndrome on a global scale.

HeyLaughingBoy 11y ago
I never heard of that, but it reminds me that when I moved to Minnesota in the late 90's the phrase "salmonella vanilla" was associated with Schwann's Ice Cream. Try finding anyone these days who even thinks of that. I see Schwann's making home delivery of their frozen grocery products all over the place (mmm, cheesy tater tots!). They seem to be even more popular now. People have short memories for this stuff.