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I've live in New York and I've literally never been to a single bar or grocery store that accepts American Express. Anyone know why this is?

astockwell 11y ago
Higher fees than the competition. Otherwise known as their "brand premium".
dpeck 11y ago
They charge significantly more off the top vs Visa/Mastercard, and they want their money before you get yours. I appreciate it because its good for me as far as consumer protection, but I fully understand smaller businesses not wanting to deal with the added expense/hassle.
ulysses 11y ago
For regular businesses, the transaction fees (both % and per transaction) are higher for AMEX than VISA or Mastercard. So a lot of small businesses don't take them. With some processors, there's also a monthly fee if you take any AMEX, so it's better to not take it all.
Sanddancer 11y ago
Amex charges higher fees per-transaction. Because they're a charge card, they make their money off the transaction fees, and not off the interest rates a card accrues. Conversely, this means they have to charge more on the front-end to maintain profitability.
- maxerickson 11y ago
  They also offer credit cards. They differ from VISA and Mastercard in that they underwrite many of the lines of credit themselves (they make about $5 billion per year on interest).
- jsprogrammer 11y ago
  Most AMEX cards are credit.
- branchless 11y ago
  Yep - great to see them in trouble. Most small businesses hate them as they take from their bottom line. IIRC amex also tried to stop retailers letting customers know just how much they charge per transaction and wouldn't let shops offer different prices to counter-balance Amex greed. Overall they sound thoroughly nasty and I cheer their demise. ps whenever I can I use cash at an independent business so they keep the 2-3% instead of some big bank.
  - jsprogrammer 11y ago
    Is there a bank or credit issuer who doesn't act substantially the same?
  - cthalupa 11y ago
    >Overall they sound thoroughly nasty and I cheer their demise. They're wonderful as a consumer, and I would be quite sad if they were to go anywhere. I've had multiple large companies try to screw me over, and I went to Amex and they went to bat for me and took care of the issue. I have 100% confidence that I will be taken care of for all purchases related to my Amex card, which I cannot say even for my other "prestige" cards such as the Chase Sapphire Preferred, etc.
zyxley 11y ago
2.5% transaction fees instead of 2%. The average grocery store has a profit margin of 1% to 3%, from what I understand.
- mahyarm 11y ago
  Thing is they don't have to. Visa and co often have lower transaction fees for places like grocery stores exactly for that reason. Amex can adopt the same behavior.
- AngrySkillzz 11y ago
  Yeah, it's as simple as that. When their product that is 25% more expensive than competitors and less useful (accepted at less retailers), they deserve to get knocked off their pedestal. No one cares about the Amex brand. They are a commodity provider in the payment market.
  - lostPixels 11y ago
    Their consumer protections are significantly better than other credit card companies. That alone makes owning a gold card worth it to me.
- branchless 11y ago
  It's 3.5% vs 2-3% on most cards. https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-cards/retailers-accept-american-express/ https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-cards/retailers-accep... So they are all taking a good wedge for very little.
adamgray 11y ago
Higher fees. FWIW I live in Chicago and rarely find a place that doesn't accept AmEx.
johnnyb9 11y ago
I live in Manhattan and my experience has been that every bar accepts Amex.
gorena 11y ago
You've never been to a Whole Foods?
martingordon 11y ago
Where in New York do you live? Everywhere I go in Manhattan accepts Amex. I've even been to a bar that only accept Cash or Amex ("the Costco of bars").
brewdad 11y ago
If you live in NYC, you must be actively trying to avoid places that accept AMEX. It's accepted practically everywhere in Manhattan at least. If you live elsewhere in New York State then, yeah, AMEX charges higher fees to merchants so many smaller ones don't want to deal with them.
dodders 11y ago
IIRC, Aqua Santa in Williamsburg used to only accept AMEX. Think they take other cards now though.
infinite_beam 11y ago
I live in New York and have been to a lot of bars and grocery stores that accept American Express.
morgante 11y ago
I have to assume you're lying. The vast majority of bars and even most grocery stores in NYC accept AmEx.

astockwell 11y ago

Higher fees than the competition. Otherwise known as their "brand premium".

dpeck 11y ago

They charge significantly more off the top vs Visa/Mastercard, and they want their money before you get yours. I appreciate it because its good for me as far as consumer protection, but I fully understand smaller businesses not wanting to deal with the added expense/hassle.

ulysses 11y ago

For regular businesses, the transaction fees (both % and per transaction) are higher for AMEX than VISA or Mastercard. So a lot of small businesses don't take them. With some processors, there's also a monthly fee if you take any AMEX, so it's better to not take it all.

Sanddancer 11y ago

Amex charges higher fees per-transaction. Because they're a charge card, they make their money off the transaction fees, and not off the interest rates a card accrues. Conversely, this means they have to charge more on the front-end to maintain profitability.

maxerickson 11y ago
They also offer credit cards. They differ from VISA and Mastercard in that they underwrite many of the lines of credit themselves (they make about $5 billion per year on interest).
jsprogrammer 11y ago
Most AMEX cards are credit.
branchless 11y ago
Yep - great to see them in trouble. Most small businesses hate them as they take from their bottom line. IIRC amex also tried to stop retailers letting customers know just how much they charge per transaction and wouldn't let shops offer different prices to counter-balance Amex greed. Overall they sound thoroughly nasty and I cheer their demise. ps whenever I can I use cash at an independent business so they keep the 2-3% instead of some big bank.
- jsprogrammer 11y ago
  Is there a bank or credit issuer who doesn't act substantially the same?
- cthalupa 11y ago
  >Overall they sound thoroughly nasty and I cheer their demise. They're wonderful as a consumer, and I would be quite sad if they were to go anywhere. I've had multiple large companies try to screw me over, and I went to Amex and they went to bat for me and took care of the issue. I have 100% confidence that I will be taken care of for all purchases related to my Amex card, which I cannot say even for my other "prestige" cards such as the Chase Sapphire Preferred, etc.

zyxley 11y ago

2.5% transaction fees instead of 2%. The average grocery store has a profit margin of 1% to 3%, from what I understand.

mahyarm 11y ago
Thing is they don't have to. Visa and co often have lower transaction fees for places like grocery stores exactly for that reason. Amex can adopt the same behavior.
AngrySkillzz 11y ago
Yeah, it's as simple as that. When their product that is 25% more expensive than competitors and less useful (accepted at less retailers), they deserve to get knocked off their pedestal. No one cares about the Amex brand. They are a commodity provider in the payment market.
- lostPixels 11y ago
  Their consumer protections are significantly better than other credit card companies. That alone makes owning a gold card worth it to me.
branchless 11y ago
It's 3.5% vs 2-3% on most cards. https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-cards/retailers-accept-american-express/ https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/credit-cards/retailers-accep... So they are all taking a good wedge for very little.

adamgray 11y ago

Higher fees. FWIW I live in Chicago and rarely find a place that doesn't accept AmEx.

johnnyb9 11y ago

I live in Manhattan and my experience has been that every bar accepts Amex.

gorena 11y ago

You've never been to a Whole Foods?

martingordon 11y ago

Where in New York do you live? Everywhere I go in Manhattan accepts Amex. I've even been to a bar that only accept Cash or Amex ("the Costco of bars").

brewdad 11y ago

If you live in NYC, you must be actively trying to avoid places that accept AMEX. It's accepted practically everywhere in Manhattan at least. If you live elsewhere in New York State then, yeah, AMEX charges higher fees to merchants so many smaller ones don't want to deal with them.

dodders 11y ago

IIRC, Aqua Santa in Williamsburg used to only accept AMEX. Think they take other cards now though.

infinite_beam 11y ago

I live in New York and have been to a lot of bars and grocery stores that accept American Express.

morgante 11y ago

I have to assume you're lying. The vast majority of bars and even most grocery stores in NYC accept AmEx.