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Maybe in the long term - though I very much doubt that patronage was unbiased, nor will crowdfunding. Imagine the fundraising power of anti-vaxxers, for example

by Fomite 11y ago

Maybe in the long term - though I very much doubt that patronage was unbiased, nor will crowdfunding. Imagine the fundraising power of anti-vaxxers, for example, in funding utterly junk science. I like the idea of experiment.com, but right now...it's just not there. I want it to be, but it's just not. None of the projects you link even approach "Pay a grad student for a year", let alone supporting an assistant professor and their lab. I'd also like to note that you're taking "close to the average citizen or constituent" as an inherently good thing, and I'm not necessarily convinced that's true, or at least so true it doesn't need examination. What's worth research is not necessary what captures the public imagination. Heck, its not even what captures the imagination of other scientists - I have no idea what's worth funding and studying in high energy physics or theoretical CS, and I very much doubt they know the same for my field.

dluan 11y ago
What about http://experiment.com/curebatten http://experiment.com/curebatten? Still, big science does not equal good science. In most cases, the opposite is true. I find it's such a huge stereotype, even within research, that scientists forget about the creative, entrepreneurial, or hustling spirit of doing science that they default to pointing to have's and have-not's. "He has a big grant, so I how can I compete", and that zero-sum attitude is so counter productive. > an inherently good thing Yes, I vehemently believe it's a good thing. If we ever approach the levels of science literacy needed to create the adverse effects you're hinting at, then that would be fantastic. And, not knowing what's worth funding isn't a citizen's fault, that's on the scientist. If scientists were more vocal about their work, new opportunities, and big challenges, then of course the public would be able to identify what's worth funding. This is because communicating science is inherently a good thing, and when done well, it can motivate people to learn new things or act differently. Look at what pointing a bomb at the direction of the moon did in the 60s. With respect to the problem in the article, these regulators and policy-makers need a big rocket to point at a single direction. When people are disconnected with what's out there, then there's no context for when science gets taken for a ride with a different agenda.
- Fomite 11y ago
  How frequent are studies being funded at that level? Based on the numbers on your website, that study is almost half your total volume. Again, using the numbers on your site: 5,615 projects created and 364 funded is a 6.5% success rate. If I'm going to be pouring energy in to single digit success rates, they need to hit pretty hard - and while you do have some successes, right now their long-tail oddities. If experiment.com takes off and you regularly get R01-sized projects, that's awesome. But it's just not there yet. And while "big science" does not equal good science, there are some things that just have to be paid for. I'm not talking about massive grants. And I've got experience doing the whole scrappy underdog thing. It's not a zero-sum attitude - it's that the effort for crowdfunding at the moment isn't necessarily worth what comes out of it. I think your problem is that you're conceptualizing your critics as proponents of "Big Science". I funded by dissertation with grants that aren't even approaching big science-type grants, but they brought in way more money than most of the projects on experiments.com, and required, combined, four pages worth of proposals. > Yes, I vehemently believe it's a good thing. If we ever approach the levels of science literacy needed to create the adverse effects you're hinting at, then that would be fantastic. And, not knowing what's worth funding isn't a citizen's fault, that's on the scientist. If scientists were more vocal about their work, new opportunities, and big challenges, then of course the public would be able to identify what's worth funding. Would they? [Citation Needed]. I'm about as science literate as the average citizen could possibly be expected to be, and as I said, I've got no idea what's worth funding in fields well past my own. As I've said, I really like the idea of experiments.com. I've considered it in the past. I'll keep an eye on it in the future. But right now, suggesting it as an alternative to traditional funding streams, or even industry funding is, at this point, just not realistic.
  - dluan 11y ago
    Sure! Point taken. What do you think it would take for it to work? By the way the number you want is 860 projects launched. The 5,615 figure is people who've started working on a project but haven't launched. So closer to ~42% success rate.
    - 11y ago

by Fomite 11y ago

dluan 11y ago

What about http://experiment.com/curebatten http://experiment.com/curebatten? Still, big science does not equal good science. In most cases, the opposite is true. I find it's such a huge stereotype, even within research, that scientists forget about the creative, entrepreneurial, or hustling spirit of doing science that they default to pointing to have's and have-not's. "He has a big grant, so I how can I compete", and that zero-sum attitude is so counter productive. > an inherently good thing Yes, I vehemently believe it's a good thing. If we ever approach the levels of science literacy needed to create the adverse effects you're hinting at, then that would be fantastic. And, not knowing what's worth funding isn't a citizen's fault, that's on the scientist. If scientists were more vocal about their work, new opportunities, and big challenges, then of course the public would be able to identify what's worth funding. This is because communicating science is inherently a good thing, and when done well, it can motivate people to learn new things or act differently. Look at what pointing a bomb at the direction of the moon did in the 60s. With respect to the problem in the article, these regulators and policy-makers need a big rocket to point at a single direction. When people are disconnected with what's out there, then there's no context for when science gets taken for a ride with a different agenda.

Fomite 11y ago
How frequent are studies being funded at that level? Based on the numbers on your website, that study is almost half your total volume. Again, using the numbers on your site: 5,615 projects created and 364 funded is a 6.5% success rate. If I'm going to be pouring energy in to single digit success rates, they need to hit pretty hard - and while you do have some successes, right now their long-tail oddities. If experiment.com takes off and you regularly get R01-sized projects, that's awesome. But it's just not there yet. And while "big science" does not equal good science, there are some things that just have to be paid for. I'm not talking about massive grants. And I've got experience doing the whole scrappy underdog thing. It's not a zero-sum attitude - it's that the effort for crowdfunding at the moment isn't necessarily worth what comes out of it. I think your problem is that you're conceptualizing your critics as proponents of "Big Science". I funded by dissertation with grants that aren't even approaching big science-type grants, but they brought in way more money than most of the projects on experiments.com, and required, combined, four pages worth of proposals. > Yes, I vehemently believe it's a good thing. If we ever approach the levels of science literacy needed to create the adverse effects you're hinting at, then that would be fantastic. And, not knowing what's worth funding isn't a citizen's fault, that's on the scientist. If scientists were more vocal about their work, new opportunities, and big challenges, then of course the public would be able to identify what's worth funding. Would they? [Citation Needed]. I'm about as science literate as the average citizen could possibly be expected to be, and as I said, I've got no idea what's worth funding in fields well past my own. As I've said, I really like the idea of experiments.com. I've considered it in the past. I'll keep an eye on it in the future. But right now, suggesting it as an alternative to traditional funding streams, or even industry funding is, at this point, just not realistic.
- dluan 11y ago
  Sure! Point taken. What do you think it would take for it to work? By the way the number you want is 860 projects launched. The 5,615 figure is people who've started working on a project but haven't launched. So closer to ~42% success rate.
  - 11y ago