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Yes, three words. But combined with their proprietary database... Postal addresses (agreed, not well organized in many countries) and gps coordinates are at le

by Gys 11y ago

Yes, three words. But combined with their proprietary database... Postal addresses (agreed, not well organized in many countries) and gps coordinates are at least open. And gps coordinates can be shortened by using letters. We would actually only need a universal algorithm that can translate any gps coordination into something readable and back. No database needed. No dependence on any company.

rakoo 11y ago
Oh but there is, and has been for a long time now: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geohash https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geohash
- Gys 11y ago
  Yes, I am familiar with that kind of approach. However, something like 'geohash.org/eyckqv01zy2v' is not what I mean because it is similar to '38.7436214,-9.1952231': both can only be communicated by copy-and-paste. You missed the word 'readable' in my post ;-)
nefitty 11y ago
Let's say an earthquake just occurred in a town named "El Pueblo de Nuestra Señora la Reina de los Ángeles de Porciúncula". Emergency personnel can try to lug this big name around, people can try to input into map apps or they can check out the three word address for the town and pass that around much more easily. The example I've given is an exaggeration (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Unusual_place_names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Unusual_place_names) but this use is obviated when a person is traveling in a foreign country with unusual names for streets, stores, etc. I think this is the most interesting everyday use for the technology.
- Gys 11y ago
  The use cases are clear. Also for less dramatic situations :-) But my problem is the reliance on a database, especially a proprietary one. Feels like solving one problem by creating another. Therefore an algorithm for converting gps coordinates into a few common words would be ideal (and to convert back).
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- greenyoda 11y ago
  Who says your smart phone is going to work in an area that just had a big earthquake? The power might be out, the cell towers could have fallen down, or everyone could be trying to use the system simultaneously to tell their families that they're still alive. (In some parts of the world, they may never have had cellular service at all! Or they may not be able to afford phones that can run this app.) For example, it was nearly impossible to use a cellphone in downtown NYC in the aftermath of the 9/11 attack. The backup plan would be to have a local copy of the database cached on everyone's phone, but that would take up a lot of space. Also, who is going to translate the database into every language used in the world? Three English words would be as hard for a Chinese speaker to remember as a pair of geographical coordinates.
  - drdeca 11y ago
    Does it work with a database of word triples to locations, or is it a list of words, and an algo to convert between word triples and locations? I would think the latter would be much smaller to keep on one's phone. the surface area of the earth divided by 9 square meters is around 57 trillion (source: wolfram|alpha ) , so for word triples, you would only need around 4000 words stored in the phone. But, that wouldn't have the redundancy (any of the 3 words wrong would get the wrong result), so if you have any two of the words be enough to encode the result (so, getting 1 word wrong would result in the area you mean, and maybe two other areas you didn't mean), then you need uh, about 8 million words? I'm not sure english has that many words. oh wait maybe its only on land. That would uh, actually only help a little... Ok I don't understand their claim that it is redundant, but I'm pretty sure they don't /need/ to make it use a central lookup table when you can just convert coords into lists of words. IDK if they have their algo being open though. If they don't I guess I should make an open clone of it, because not having it be open is dumb. A standard to refer to a location should be open if it is to be useful.

by Gys 11y ago

rakoo 11y ago

Oh but there is, and has been for a long time now: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geohash https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geohash

Gys 11y ago
Yes, I am familiar with that kind of approach. However, something like 'geohash.org/eyckqv01zy2v' is not what I mean because it is similar to '38.7436214,-9.1952231': both can only be communicated by copy-and-paste. You missed the word 'readable' in my post ;-)

nefitty 11y ago

Let's say an earthquake just occurred in a town named "El Pueblo de Nuestra Señora la Reina de los Ángeles de Porciúncula". Emergency personnel can try to lug this big name around, people can try to input into map apps or they can check out the three word address for the town and pass that around much more easily. The example I've given is an exaggeration (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Unusual_place_names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Unusual_place_names) but this use is obviated when a person is traveling in a foreign country with unusual names for streets, stores, etc. I think this is the most interesting everyday use for the technology.

Gys 11y ago
The use cases are clear. Also for less dramatic situations :-) But my problem is the reliance on a database, especially a proprietary one. Feels like solving one problem by creating another. Therefore an algorithm for converting gps coordinates into a few common words would be ideal (and to convert back).
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
greenyoda 11y ago
Who says your smart phone is going to work in an area that just had a big earthquake? The power might be out, the cell towers could have fallen down, or everyone could be trying to use the system simultaneously to tell their families that they're still alive. (In some parts of the world, they may never have had cellular service at all! Or they may not be able to afford phones that can run this app.) For example, it was nearly impossible to use a cellphone in downtown NYC in the aftermath of the 9/11 attack. The backup plan would be to have a local copy of the database cached on everyone's phone, but that would take up a lot of space. Also, who is going to translate the database into every language used in the world? Three English words would be as hard for a Chinese speaker to remember as a pair of geographical coordinates.
- drdeca 11y ago
  Does it work with a database of word triples to locations, or is it a list of words, and an algo to convert between word triples and locations? I would think the latter would be much smaller to keep on one's phone. the surface area of the earth divided by 9 square meters is around 57 trillion (source: wolfram|alpha ) , so for word triples, you would only need around 4000 words stored in the phone. But, that wouldn't have the redundancy (any of the 3 words wrong would get the wrong result), so if you have any two of the words be enough to encode the result (so, getting 1 word wrong would result in the area you mean, and maybe two other areas you didn't mean), then you need uh, about 8 million words? I'm not sure english has that many words. oh wait maybe its only on land. That would uh, actually only help a little... Ok I don't understand their claim that it is redundant, but I'm pretty sure they don't /need/ to make it use a central lookup table when you can just convert coords into lists of words. IDK if they have their algo being open though. If they don't I guess I should make an open clone of it, because not having it be open is dumb. A standard to refer to a location should be open if it is to be useful.