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I'm always split when reading stories like this. On the one hand, I really feel for the person and appreciate her sharing. Problems like these rarely consider

by gozo 11y ago

I'm always split when reading stories like this. On the one hand, I really feel for the person and appreciate her sharing. Problems like these rarely consider the practicality of the situation and shouldn't be taken lightly. On the other, I know there are kids out there who never got to go to a good school, always had problems at home and never got to feel the joy of learning. They can't write this kind of story and even if they did no one would read it. They can't travel somewhere, don't have anything to be cut off from nor will ever meet someone who saves them. They can't stop doing things that hurt them and if they become depressed they might very well end up being homeless. Or the high-performing poor kids who might have to work or in other ways face academic death from a thousand papercuts. Many times because families with better resources uses all their power to make overexertion a desirable thing so other kids can't compete. Or just the normal kids who already knew from the beginning what was important and the limits to being productive. Maybe they went to a good state school and now regardless of merit have to live with being last in line after people from private schools time and time again. I guess my point is that when we contemplate a fix to these problems I hope we also don't overlook the people in different situations with similar problems.

ZenoArrow 11y ago
Whilst it's true that we shouldn't overlook the experience of others, I believe if we try to look at the issues all at once we'll not get anywhere (analysis paralysis) or will generalise too much and miss the finer details. You touched on one of the key points for me when you said "never got to feel the joy of learning". Perhaps that's the key problem in this case too, as the author didn't seem to have discovered the joy of learning, but discovered the joy of achieving, and the price you pay when you don't have other joys to balance you out. I can't wait for a time when we lose our obsession with work ethic. Not that working at something you want is automatically bad, far from it, but it's not the only way to enjoy life. One day I hope we can see that being a slacker can be a noble profession.
- roghummal 11y ago
  >Not that working at something you want is automatically bad, far from it, but it's not the only way to enjoy life. One day I hope we can see that being a slacker can be a noble profession. I have some documentation you should read: http://www.subgenius.com/pam1/pamphlet.html http://www.subgenius.com/pam1/pamphlet.html
  - ZenoArrow 11y ago
    You overlooked the 'noble' part. If you shared a link to The Idler then I'd understand. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Idler_(1993) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Idler_(1993)
forgetsusername 11y ago
>I'm always split when reading stories like this. I agree. On one hand, as someone who deals with minor bouts of depression, I wouldn't wish it on anyone. It sucks. On the other, I think part of the problem are these bizarre expectations to have everything "figured out" at such a young age. The author writes about a series of what appear to be catastrophic, depression inducing academic and career oriented decisions, culminating in landing a dream job. All by age 23 or so? It's all about academics, careers, potential employers, grades, GPA, admissions, money, prestige. Need to find my place, need to find my place. Then you find out it's not as fulfilling as you'd imagined. Perhaps it comes with the mentality of being an "overachiever". How about stopping to smell the flowers sometime, and realize you're a kid with a lot of life left to live, full of all kinds of trials and tribulations?
jinushaun 11y ago
100x Yes! I had a similar argument recently. It was all fun and games talking about the problems with traditional education and the loss of creative thinking until I pointed out that the only reason we can have this debate is because we went to good schools, got good grades and got good jobs. As someone who grew up poor and extremely grateful to get out of the ghetto, I'm consistently surprised that I'm surrounded by unhappy well-off peers who have similar struggles and offer similar advice (quit job/school, follow your heart, travel, go to Burning Man, etc). These are lamentations and luxuries of the leisure class. Money doesn't buy happiness, but everything still costs money. When you satisfy 90% of what most people define as needed to keep them happy and comfortable, that last 10% takes over your world. In a post scarcity society, we are all trapped at the top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs and happiness seems harder and harder to achieve. Instead of being happy with what we have, we keep moving the bar. Don't get me wrong, the author's problems are real and valid, and there is something wrong with our society when kids start committing suicide over GPAs, but a large part of me fears for our future. Maybe Star Trek really is a dystopia…
- dropit_sphere 11y ago
  Are people impressed that you got out of the ghetto? Would people be as impressed if, say, a Kennedy your age was where you are now? I guess I'm just agreeing with you. Everybody takes some knocks---which is ensured by the fact that some knocks are caused by not having had any.

by gozo 11y ago

ZenoArrow 11y ago

Whilst it's true that we shouldn't overlook the experience of others, I believe if we try to look at the issues all at once we'll not get anywhere (analysis paralysis) or will generalise too much and miss the finer details. You touched on one of the key points for me when you said "never got to feel the joy of learning". Perhaps that's the key problem in this case too, as the author didn't seem to have discovered the joy of learning, but discovered the joy of achieving, and the price you pay when you don't have other joys to balance you out. I can't wait for a time when we lose our obsession with work ethic. Not that working at something you want is automatically bad, far from it, but it's not the only way to enjoy life. One day I hope we can see that being a slacker can be a noble profession.

roghummal 11y ago
>Not that working at something you want is automatically bad, far from it, but it's not the only way to enjoy life. One day I hope we can see that being a slacker can be a noble profession. I have some documentation you should read: http://www.subgenius.com/pam1/pamphlet.html http://www.subgenius.com/pam1/pamphlet.html
- ZenoArrow 11y ago
  You overlooked the 'noble' part. If you shared a link to The Idler then I'd understand. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Idler_(1993) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Idler_(1993)

forgetsusername 11y ago

>I'm always split when reading stories like this. I agree. On one hand, as someone who deals with minor bouts of depression, I wouldn't wish it on anyone. It sucks. On the other, I think part of the problem are these bizarre expectations to have everything "figured out" at such a young age. The author writes about a series of what appear to be catastrophic, depression inducing academic and career oriented decisions, culminating in landing a dream job. All by age 23 or so? It's all about academics, careers, potential employers, grades, GPA, admissions, money, prestige. Need to find my place, need to find my place. Then you find out it's not as fulfilling as you'd imagined. Perhaps it comes with the mentality of being an "overachiever". How about stopping to smell the flowers sometime, and realize you're a kid with a lot of life left to live, full of all kinds of trials and tribulations?

jinushaun 11y ago

100x Yes! I had a similar argument recently. It was all fun and games talking about the problems with traditional education and the loss of creative thinking until I pointed out that the only reason we can have this debate is because we went to good schools, got good grades and got good jobs. As someone who grew up poor and extremely grateful to get out of the ghetto, I'm consistently surprised that I'm surrounded by unhappy well-off peers who have similar struggles and offer similar advice (quit job/school, follow your heart, travel, go to Burning Man, etc). These are lamentations and luxuries of the leisure class. Money doesn't buy happiness, but everything still costs money. When you satisfy 90% of what most people define as needed to keep them happy and comfortable, that last 10% takes over your world. In a post scarcity society, we are all trapped at the top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs and happiness seems harder and harder to achieve. Instead of being happy with what we have, we keep moving the bar. Don't get me wrong, the author's problems are real and valid, and there is something wrong with our society when kids start committing suicide over GPAs, but a large part of me fears for our future. Maybe Star Trek really is a dystopia…

dropit_sphere 11y ago
Are people impressed that you got out of the ghetto? Would people be as impressed if, say, a Kennedy your age was where you are now? I guess I'm just agreeing with you. Everybody takes some knocks---which is ensured by the fact that some knocks are caused by not having had any.