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That's definitely a danger, and it's not an either-or thing, of course, as well. I think the point of that advice is to remind that for an astounding amount of

That's definitely a danger, and it's not an either-or thing, of course, as well. I think the point of that advice is to remind that for an astounding amount of people empathy is not at all a priority! It may be even seen as a weakness, in an unspoken way. Humanity and empathy should be a core value on a company's banner precisely because it's fairly explicitly discouraged by default in personal and work culture at large.

lsc 11y ago
>I think the point of that advice is to remind that for an astounding amount of people empathy is not at all a priority! I certainly agree with that; I personally put effort into appearing less empathetic and less respectful than I normally am when I'm trying to get a job, just because I am more likely to get the job when I do that; my theory is that it matches most people's heuristics for "confidence" (I mean, there is a cost... I'd prefer to work at a place that didn't value "confidence" - but not as strongly as I prefer to work.) But yeah. I'm pretty sure people who are interviewing have no real interest in empathy or diversity. Hell, listen to just about anyone talk about "cultural fit" - everyone has an idea of what their new employee should look like, and there's not a lot of diversity (either in the 'inclusive of protected classes' sense or the "diversity of thought" sense) in that idea.
- famousactress 11y ago
  There are super good points here. WAY too much value is put on "confidence". I imagine because really talented folks are tend to be confident confidence is preferred because talent is harder to gauge. That's a shame. "Culture Fit" is a really problematic state of mind. I totally agree that it locks in on a 'type' and reduces diversity. It's a dangerous, ego-maniacal, and lazy way to hire.
  - lsc 11y ago
    >I imagine because really talented folks are tend to be confident It sounds like you make the same mistake as everyone else, thinking there is some connection between confidence and technical skill. Appearing confident is completely unrelated to programming ability. confidence is a skill one needs to learn separately.
famousactress 11y ago
Yes, yes, yes. Looking for work?

lsc 11y ago

>I think the point of that advice is to remind that for an astounding amount of people empathy is not at all a priority! I certainly agree with that; I personally put effort into appearing less empathetic and less respectful than I normally am when I'm trying to get a job, just because I am more likely to get the job when I do that; my theory is that it matches most people's heuristics for "confidence" (I mean, there is a cost... I'd prefer to work at a place that didn't value "confidence" - but not as strongly as I prefer to work.) But yeah. I'm pretty sure people who are interviewing have no real interest in empathy or diversity. Hell, listen to just about anyone talk about "cultural fit" - everyone has an idea of what their new employee should look like, and there's not a lot of diversity (either in the 'inclusive of protected classes' sense or the "diversity of thought" sense) in that idea.

famousactress 11y ago
There are super good points here. WAY too much value is put on "confidence". I imagine because really talented folks are tend to be confident confidence is preferred because talent is harder to gauge. That's a shame. "Culture Fit" is a really problematic state of mind. I totally agree that it locks in on a 'type' and reduces diversity. It's a dangerous, ego-maniacal, and lazy way to hire.
- lsc 11y ago
  >I imagine because really talented folks are tend to be confident It sounds like you make the same mistake as everyone else, thinking there is some connection between confidence and technical skill. Appearing confident is completely unrelated to programming ability. confidence is a skill one needs to learn separately.

famousactress 11y ago

Yes, yes, yes. Looking for work?