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>For me, the entire debate is silly because it's my screen -> my decision what appears What a silly statement. Does the same logic also apply to your TV and ra

>For me, the entire debate is silly because it's my screen -> my decision what appears What a silly statement. Does the same logic also apply to your TV and radio? You are visiting a site that gives you content for free in return for viewing their ads. If you don't like that contract then don't visit the site and limit your browsing to sites that adhere to your personal contract.

acheron 11y ago
"Does the same logic also apply to your TV and radio?" Yes? Or are you saying I shouldn't be allowed to change the station during a commercial?
- krapp 11y ago
  Viewership in tv and radio isn't measured directly, but indirectly through polls and surveys. You're counted as part of the set of potential viewers based on your age, location and whether or not you have a Nielsen box (or whatever they use nowadays.) TV stations don't actually know that you decided to turn the channel, and they don't really care, since that time has already been paid for. When you can very accurately determine how many people have seen a web ad and you know how many people haven't, that more directly affects how much value can be extracted from that advertising. In terms of the actual effect on revenue, blocking a web ad would seem to have more impact than ignoring a tv or radio ad.
  - mziel 11y ago
    I would argue that it has exactly the same impact. Your argument is a bit of "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?" nature. Unless the advertisers want to publicly (!) admit that they wish they could block TV content from people muting/changing the channel/walking out to make tea during commercials.
- greenyoda 11y ago
  In addition, you can also mute the volume and/or walk out of the room during a TV commercial, and it's perfectly legal to record a TV show and fast-forward over the commercials.
- bitmapbrother 11y ago
  No, but you do allow the presence of advertising on your TV or radio so why should web pages be different? That's the contract you agree to.
  - __david__ 11y ago
    Allow how? I haven't watched an ad on TV since I bought my first DVR over 10 years ago.
  - douche 11y ago
    Ad-blocking is exactly the same thing as turning the volume off during commercial breaks. Or perhaps turning the TV/radio off, and then back on again afterwards might be the better analogy, since then you are not consuming the "bandwidth". If I wanted to hurt advertising, I'd create an extension that would fire a thousand click-throughs on their stupid ad, and vacuum up all their AdSense budget. Get a few million people world-wide doing that, and companies would quickly realize that they are spending an even more ridiculous amount of money on advertisements, and they would stop spending.
    - bitmapbrother 11y ago
      Not really as you're constantly having to turn the volume off and on when the show resumes. So you're interacting with the actual ad and subconsciously you've acknowledged what they're advertising. As for hurting advertising by your click though scheme - do you really think you're the first one to have thought of this? They have measures in place to identify and disregard this.
thedudemabry 11y ago
The free content for ad views model is only tantalizing for web publishers because the internet, which they did not develop using their marketing budget, provides access to billions of eyeballs for very little cost. That fantastic bargain comes at the cost of playing by the internet's rules. The internet is not a broadcast medium, but a request-response medium.
rimantas 11y ago
Does tracking and maldvertising apply to TV and radio too?
__david__ 11y ago
> You are visiting a site that gives you content for free in return for viewing their ads. No. They are giving me back some form of data than I can render however I see fit. If I want to render their HTML but skip the rendering of the ads, that's my business and not theirs.
effie 11y ago
There is no implied contract, only assumed/hoped for behaviour. The TV/radio/website operator emits freely accessible information to the world in the hope he will make money of it. There is no obligation on the receiver's part to behave as the operator wants.

acheron 11y ago

"Does the same logic also apply to your TV and radio?" Yes? Or are you saying I shouldn't be allowed to change the station during a commercial?

krapp 11y ago
Viewership in tv and radio isn't measured directly, but indirectly through polls and surveys. You're counted as part of the set of potential viewers based on your age, location and whether or not you have a Nielsen box (or whatever they use nowadays.) TV stations don't actually know that you decided to turn the channel, and they don't really care, since that time has already been paid for. When you can very accurately determine how many people have seen a web ad and you know how many people haven't, that more directly affects how much value can be extracted from that advertising. In terms of the actual effect on revenue, blocking a web ad would seem to have more impact than ignoring a tv or radio ad.
- mziel 11y ago
  I would argue that it has exactly the same impact. Your argument is a bit of "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?" nature. Unless the advertisers want to publicly (!) admit that they wish they could block TV content from people muting/changing the channel/walking out to make tea during commercials.
greenyoda 11y ago
In addition, you can also mute the volume and/or walk out of the room during a TV commercial, and it's perfectly legal to record a TV show and fast-forward over the commercials.
bitmapbrother 11y ago
No, but you do allow the presence of advertising on your TV or radio so why should web pages be different? That's the contract you agree to.
- __david__ 11y ago
  Allow how? I haven't watched an ad on TV since I bought my first DVR over 10 years ago.
- douche 11y ago
  Ad-blocking is exactly the same thing as turning the volume off during commercial breaks. Or perhaps turning the TV/radio off, and then back on again afterwards might be the better analogy, since then you are not consuming the "bandwidth". If I wanted to hurt advertising, I'd create an extension that would fire a thousand click-throughs on their stupid ad, and vacuum up all their AdSense budget. Get a few million people world-wide doing that, and companies would quickly realize that they are spending an even more ridiculous amount of money on advertisements, and they would stop spending.
  - bitmapbrother 11y ago
    Not really as you're constantly having to turn the volume off and on when the show resumes. So you're interacting with the actual ad and subconsciously you've acknowledged what they're advertising. As for hurting advertising by your click though scheme - do you really think you're the first one to have thought of this? They have measures in place to identify and disregard this.

thedudemabry 11y ago

The free content for ad views model is only tantalizing for web publishers because the internet, which they did not develop using their marketing budget, provides access to billions of eyeballs for very little cost. That fantastic bargain comes at the cost of playing by the internet's rules. The internet is not a broadcast medium, but a request-response medium.

rimantas 11y ago

Does tracking and maldvertising apply to TV and radio too?

__david__ 11y ago

> You are visiting a site that gives you content for free in return for viewing their ads. No. They are giving me back some form of data than I can render however I see fit. If I want to render their HTML but skip the rendering of the ads, that's my business and not theirs.

effie 11y ago

There is no implied contract, only assumed/hoped for behaviour. The TV/radio/website operator emits freely accessible information to the world in the hope he will make money of it. There is no obligation on the receiver's part to behave as the operator wants.